Hockey Cards - Part III

[The Kingslayer]

Panini's best product was National Treasures and the only reason that was good was because they had to dump all their memorabilia before they lost their hockey license so they loaded the packs with hits, otherwise all other Panini products were pretty much trash. They tried so hard to match UD products 1 for 1 rather than doing their own thing. The best thing Panini did IMO was Private Signings.

Loved NT. Also was a big fan of Certified/Totally Certified and Select for some reason. Just reminded me of cards I liked growing up I guess. value wise not much there but the look I liked.

 

[thebigbea]

Hey guys! Pretty new to the hobby and I pulled this bad boy about a month ago. Does anyone have any idea what it could be worth? Or where I could find out?View attachment 506791

That’s at least close to $1000 there if not more

 

[Cubs2024wildcard]

I would say PSA 10 is somewhere between BGS 9.5 and BGS 10 Black

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

A Black label is a perfect card.

You can take BGS 8.5’s crack them, send them to psa and get a 10 out of it.

Both companies have questionable histories. BGS right now is under the microscope over trimmed cards, but they are 100% the most thorough grader out there. PSA is popular because getting a 10 thru them is easier and PSA has more name recognition then BGS ever will.

Flippers brain washed everyone. The idiots yelling on Tik Tok over a PSA 10 ruined everything.

 

[Dicky113]

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

A Black label is a perfect card.

You can take BGS 8.5’s crack them, send them to psa and get a 10 out of it.

Both companies have questionable histories. BGS right now is under the microscope over trimmed cards, but they are 100% the most thorough grader out there. PSA is popular because getting a 10 thru them is easier and PSA has more name recognition then BGS ever will.

Flippers brain washed everyone. The idiots yelling on Tik Tok over a PSA 10 ruined everything.

Totally. PSA 10 is a BGS 8.5 to 9 maybe half the time. A BGS 9.5 would grade as PSA 10 100% of the time.

 

[edguy]

FML. Bring back Panini.

I agree with you on this. UD's exclusive license is terrible for the hobby. Give Panini, Leaf, Fanatics all licenses competition will make the products better

 

[Cubs2024wildcard]

Totally. PSA 10 is a BGS 8.5 to 9 maybe half the time. A BGS 9.5 would grade as PSA 10 100% of the time.

I blame the influx of get rich pandemic entrepreneurs who came into the hobby, wasted all their money on retail and current high end, and are now stuck with a bunch of crap everyone else has.

In my area four mom and pops opened up and now all of them are struggling. When I told one of these stores to offer me their inventory and they said 100k I laughed and told them I’d give them 2k for all their current garbage and the three vintage cards that actually had value.

And no offense hockey card collectors/investors/scammers, if you were buying McDavid YG’s psa 10’s during the pandemic just to let you know there’s almost as many of those as their are Jagr opcp psa 10 rookies and Jagrs rookie is what, 30 years old and there’s less unopened out there then 2015 UD.

All us vets were telling all of you this was a phase….

 

[Cubs2024wildcard]

I agree with you on this. UD's exclusive license is terrible for the hobby. Give Panini, Leaf, Fanatics all licenses competition will make the products better

Well, the problem is nobody wants the NHL license. Upper deck burned their bridges with the main sports are are stuck with hockey.

Panini got out of their agreement as quickly as they got it. The NHL just isn’t a good license for revenue

 

[Cubs2024wildcard]

That’s at least close to $1000 there if not more

Lol

There’s frameworks numbered to 5 dying on eBay right now at 100 of better players.

A card is only worth what somebody is willing to pay for it. A Price one of one might be worth 100 bucks to a hardcore Price fan, that’s about it.

A Price one of one his rookie year might have 1k value….

 

[Cubs2024wildcard]

Hey guys! Pretty new to the hobby and I pulled this bad boy about a month ago. Does anyone have any idea what it could be worth? Or where I could find out?View attachment 506791

From the looks of that pic, it looks like there’s a lot of chipping on the two top corners and the bottom left. There also looks to be a lot of issues with the photo. It could be dust but I’m just going off the picture and the low quality.

My estimation it’s worth around 100 bucks but will probably sell for around 40-50. There’s too many one of ones flooding the market currently and outside of Gretzky or Orr I’d say the odds of them having sustainable value are low. The best time to sell that card was last year during the playoffs. Now, not so much.

 

[edguy]

Well, the problem is nobody wants the NHL license. Upper deck burned their bridges with the main sports are are stuck with hockey.

Panini got out of their agreement as quickly as they got it. The NHL just isn’t a good license for revenue

I mean Leaf still makes unlicensed hockey cards give them a license even. Some of my favorite products as a kid were In The Game (bought by leaf) if they could get back to being a competitive product itd even push UD a little bit to just be better.

 

[Satan]

Totally. PSA 10 is a BGS 8.5 to 9 maybe half the time. A BGS 9.5 would grade as PSA 10 100% of the time.

Are you just throwing out totally arbitrary numbers or do you have stats to back it up? I don't believe your first claim at all and I have BGS 9.5s that I wouldn't cross to PSA because I don't think they would 10.

People talk about and defend/attack grading companies like they talked about Xbox 360 vs. PS3 vs. Wii back in the day and it's hilarious. Often the loudest voices on message boards are people that don't even send cards to get graded.

 

[Ainec]

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

A Black label is a perfect card.

You can take BGS 8.5’s crack them, send them to psa and get a 10 out of it.

Both companies have questionable histories. BGS right now is under the microscope over trimmed cards, but they are 100% the most thorough grader out there. PSA is popular because getting a 10 thru them is easier and PSA has more name recognition then BGS ever will.

Flippers brain washed everyone. The idiots yelling on Tik Tok over a PSA 10 ruined everything.

This is not true. PSA is much harder with grading than BGS now. They used to be easier but that has changed 2.5 years ago

The bgs 8.5 = 10 talk is facepalm worthy

 

[blankall]

This is not true. PSA is much harder with grading than BGS now. They used to be easier but that has changed 2.5 years ago

The bgs 8.5 = 10 talk is facepalm worthy

Psa grades the same as they did before. They wouldn't change their standards, as it would compromise their brand.

I've graded about 400 cards with each over the last five years or so.

They have very similar grading standards. A psa 10 is either a Beckett 9.5 or 10.

They are use slightly different standards and a lot depends on luck too. I crossed over about 10 cards from Beckett to psa last year. About half came back with higher grades from psa. I think that was more a function of randomness than I've grading higher than the other.

 

[Ainec]

Psa grades the same as they did before. They wouldn't change their standards, as it would compromise their brand.

I've graded about 400 cards with each over the last five years or so.

They have very similar grading standards. A psa 10 is either a Beckett 9.5 or 10.

They are use slightly different standards and a lot depends on luck too. I crossed over about 10 cards from Beckett to psa last year. About half came back with higher grades from psa. I think that was more a function of randomness than I've grading higher than the other.

You only graded 400 in the last 5 years

If you read my post I said the last 2.5 years. And my data set is well over 400

Standards now:
Bgs black > bgs 10 > psa 10 >> 9.5 > psa 9

 

[Cubs2024wildcard]

This is not true. PSA is much harder with grading than BGS now. They used to be easier but that has changed 2.5 years ago

The bgs 8.5 = 10 talk is facepalm worthy

Lol so a company based on integrity just randomly changed their grading scale a couple years ago? When there’s proof over at blowout of cards that were BGS 8.5’s resubmitted to psa that magically turned into psa 10’s?

And that’s facepalm worthy?

Seriously, I’ve been in this hobby a lot longer then the pandemic. I’m not a fan of either grading company but if i want a 10, im sending them to psa in a huge batch and watching 90% of them coming back a 10 if it’s 2000 to current. I am one of the first mass graders in this hobby back when Tuff Stuff was a double sized magazine and card grading was the new thing. I’ve submitted many a card to psa that came back a 10 that would be an 8 by BGS standards.

Sorry, bruh, I know what I’m talking about.

 

[Cubs2024wildcard]

Are you just throwing out totally arbitrary numbers or do you have stats to back it up? I don't believe your first claim at all and I have BGS 9.5s that I wouldn't cross to PSA because I don't think they would 10.

People talk about and defend/attack grading companies like they talked about Xbox 360 vs. PS3 vs. Wii back in the day and it's hilarious. Often the loudest voices on message boards are people that don't even send cards to get graded.

So lemme get this straight…

You wouldn’t send a 9.5 to psa because you don’t think it would grade higher?

lolololol

 

[Satan]

So lemme get this straight…

You wouldn’t send a 9.5 to psa because you don’t think it would grade higher?

lolololol

That's right- I think I have BGS 9.5s that I think could cross as PSA 9s.

The all-time rates support this. It's been easier to get BGS 9.5s than PSA 10s.

All-Time Gem Rates (PSA 10 or BGS 9.5+) as of January 1, 2022:
2020s: PSA 58.7%; BGS 68%
2010s: PSA 55.1%; BGS 64.7%
2000s: PSA 36.4%; BGS 37.1%


Your condescending tone in your posts is also totally unnecessary.

 

[Ainec]

Lol so a company based on integrity just randomly changed their grading scale a couple years ago? When there’s proof over at blowout of cards that were BGS 8.5’s resubmitted to psa that magically turned into psa 10’s?

And that’s facepalm worthy?

Seriously, I’ve been in this hobby a lot longer then the pandemic. I’m not a fan of either grading company but if i want a 10, im sending them to psa in a huge batch and watching 90% of them coming back a 10 if it’s 2000 to current. I am one of the first mass graders in this hobby back when Tuff Stuff was a double sized magazine and card grading was the new thing. I’ve submitted many a card to psa that came back a 10 that would be an 8 by BGS standards.

Sorry, bruh, I know what I’m talking about.

You actually don't in this instance. Nice collection though.

 

[Dicky113]

Are you just throwing out totally arbitrary numbers or do you have stats to back it up? I don't believe your first claim at all and I have BGS 9.5s that I wouldn't cross to PSA because I don't think they would 10.

People talk about and defend/attack grading companies like they talked about Xbox 360 vs. PS3 vs. Wii back in the day and it's hilarious. Often the loudest voices on message boards are people that don't even send cards to get graded.

Been around the hobby long enough to know this to be the case. With the recent Covid boom, I have literally witnessed hundreds of cases of people cracking 8.5-9.5 BGS graded cards to cash in on the PSA misunderstood “10’s” that I think is largely being driven by ignorance on eBay and perhaps comc to a lesser extent.

so I am very confident when I say that a BGS is typically 0.5 to 1 lower for equivalence to PSA. But for some unknown reason, newbies to the hobbie are throwing around huge amounts of money without realizing this. People are going to get burned here I think

 

[Satan]

Been around the hobby long enough to know this to be the case. With the recent Covid boom, I have literally witnessed hundreds of cases of people cracking 8.5-9.5 BGS graded cards to cash in on the PSA misunderstood “10’s” that I think is largely being driven by ignorance on eBay and perhaps comc to a lesser extent.

so I am very confident when I say that a BGS is typically 0.5 to 1 lower for equivalence to PSA. But for some unknown reason, newbies to the hobbie are throwing around huge amounts of money without realizing this. People are going to get burned here I think

I've been collecting for 20 years. Pre-pandemic PSA 10s were still outselling BGS 9.5s. I also posted the historic gem rates on the other page, but I'll include them on this post. It's been historically easier to get BGS 9.5s than PSA 10s. I'll trust the data more than anecdotal evidence.

All-Time Gem Rates (PSA 10 or BGS 9.5+) as of January 1, 2022:
2020s: PSA 58.7%; BGS 68%
2010s: PSA 55.1%; BGS 64.7%
2000s: PSA 36.4%; BGS 37.1%

Example #1
Graph: November 1, 2015 to March 10, 2020 (UDS1 release up until pandemic lockdown)
Blue line: McDavid PSA 10
Green line: McDavid BGS 9.5

Example #2
Graph: January 1, 2006 to January 1, 2015
Purple: Ovechkin PSA 10
Red line: Ovechkin BGS 9.5

 

[Ainec]

Been around the hobby long enough to know this to be the case. With the recent Covid boom, I have literally witnessed hundreds of cases of people cracking 8.5-9.5 BGS graded cards to cash in on the PSA misunderstood “10’s” that I think is largely being driven by ignorance on eBay and perhaps comc to a lesser extent.

so I am very confident when I say that a BGS is typically 0.5 to 1 lower for equivalence to PSA. But for some unknown reason, newbies to the hobbie are throwing around huge amounts of money without realizing this. People are going to get burned here I think

Yes but at the same time, BGS 9.5s are the best deals on the market. They can very well be 10 quality

 

[Satan]

I think the most important thing to realize is that before the pandemic started Beckett was struggling to keep up and scale with the demand for grading. They were already backlogged going into March 2020 and I think they raised their grading prices. You could still submit to PSA up until December of 2021 and still get your cards back in 3-6 months for $15-20. That was a huge reason why so many people graded their cards with PSA.

PSA managed to scale to meet customer demand. Beckett has not and has rightfully so been left treated like a legacy brand.

PSA 10 - Purple
BGS 9.5 - Red

 

[blankall]

I think the most important thing to realize is that before the pandemic started Beckett was struggling to keep up and scale with the demand for grading. They were already backlogged going into March 2020 and I think they raised their grading prices. You could still submit to PSA up until December of 2021 and still get your cards back in 3-6 months for $15-20. That was a huge reason why so many people graded their cards with PSA.

PSA managed to scale to meet customer demand. Beckett has not and has rightfully so been left treated like a legacy brand.

PSA 10 - Purple
BGS 9.5 - Red
View attachment 506993

I had a Beckett order in pre pandemic that took a year. Then they increased prices from $10-15/card to $25.

That's why I went with psa just before the pandemic. I submitted over 200 cards at once. PSA was still charging $8-10/card. I remember being upset, as not as many people wanted psa due to the lack of subgrades.... Now a PSA 10 sells for quite a bit more than a bgs 9.5.

 

[Save By Thomas]

I've got some Bruins stuff for sale if anyone is interested. $175 shipped to your door in the lower 48 States.

 

[Rorschach]

In hockey, BGS was king for a long time and BGS 9.5 > PSA 10 in price. People who collect sports like baseball preferred PSA due to the set registry they have. Now that investor types are looking at key hockey RCs, who came from the other sports, they know PSA.