Hockey Cards - Part III

[GreatSaveEssensa]

Gotta laugh at some of the cards I had protected (this was in the early 90's), Geoff Courtnal? haha
I have a whole page of Falloon rookies including the SP card, thought he was going to be a star .....

Oh he was a star alright……unfortunately for him it was with the Foxwarren, Manitoba senior mens team

 

[Roshi]

Noticing Ovies prices have gone up lately? Sold my collection 2 years ago... had some good ones too and looks like I should have kept them a bit longer..

Still have Ovie YG if someone is interested

 

[CutOnDime97]

If you don't know the story of the Gretzky T206 Wagner:

The Honus Wagner T206 is the sports card GOAT, and it always will be

Great read either way

Bruce McNall, the owner of the NHL's Los Angeles Kings, had by now heard of the card and convinced his star player, Wayne Gretzky, to help him purchase it in 1991. The $451,000 sale was brokered in part by Mastro.
The "Gretzky T206 Wagner," as it would henceforth be called, was the very first card to be graded by PSA, receiving an "8 Near Mint-Mint" designation. To put that into context, according to PSA's current population report, there are no other T206 Wagners that have received a grade above a 5. All but three have received a grade of 3 or lower.
But then McNall went to prison after admitting to defrauding six banks out of $236 million dollars. "Gretzky got stuck with the card and wound up selling it," O'Keeffe recounted. Walmart bought it and raffled it away in a 1995 promotional campaign. But the post office employee who won the card couldn't afford to keep it because of the taxes that came with owning a Wagner.

The card would continue to be sold and resold by prominent auction houses such as Christie's, Sotheby's and Robert Edward Auctions -- as well as private collectors, including MLB pitcher Tom Candiotti -- until it was dubbed the "most expensive card in the world" after Ken Kendrick, principal owner and managing general partner of the Arizona Diamondbacks, purchased it for $2.8 million in 2007.

During the investigation, Mastro finally admitted to what had only been whispered about for years: Yes, he had trimmed the Wagner with a paper cutter long before it was sold to Gretzky.

 

[Muffin]

I think 19/20 is underrated. Pretty deep rookie group. Can be found reasonably priced. Anything from 2013 to 2016/2017 will have big rookies, but will cost significantly more.

Series 2 from this year, is actually starting to drop in price and you can find some good sales now.

The only "reasonably priced" box of 19/20 left is series 1. We're looking at series 2 and SPA at over $300 a box, Premier and Ultimate at $500 and Cup at over $1200.

 

[varsaku]

COVID definitely drove up prices quite a bit. Alot of people like my self, picked back up the hobby after being couped up at home.

 

[blankall]

The only "reasonably priced" box of 19/20 left is series 1. We're looking at series 2 and SPA at over $300 a box, Premier and Ultimate at $500 and Cup at over $1200.

Series 2 for 2020/21 is on sale right now a lot of places.

401games.ca has series 2 hobby for $130 CAD and blasters for $25 CAD.

Sports Cards

In the USA, you can get retail boxes of 24 series 2 for $60 USD and tins for $25 USD:

Search results for upper series hockey

Much cheaper than 2019/20 series 2 right now.

 

[Muffin]

Series 2 for 2020/21 is on sale right now a lot of places.

401games.ca has series 2 hobby for $130 CAD and blasters for $25 CAD.

Sports Cards

In the USA, you can get retail boxes of 24 series 2 for $60 USD and tins for $25 USD:

Search results for upper series hockey

Much cheaper than 2019/20 series 2 right now.

Yea 19/20 stuff is crazy expensive right now but the 20/21 rookie class is looking really weak. In series 2 we're looking at Makar, Dach and Suzuki vs Stutzle and Kaprizov. It might sound crazy but the most "reasonably" priced box in 19/20 might be Cup when comparing the potential hits out of them.

As a Makar collector is really difficult to pull cards on my own right now

 

[Not The One]

I've only recently come back to collecting some cards, and the prices on anything recent do seem absolutely insane.

Around 2003-4 I bought a bunch of BGS 9.5 graded rookie cards of Lecavalier, Gagne, Luongo among other. These are now barely worth more than I paid for them 18 years ago despite having had really great careers. Now Lafreniere's cards are selling for hundreds of dollars after a so-so rookie year? Some people are going to loose a lot of money over this.

 

[Muffin]

I've only recently come back to collecting some cards, and the prices on anything recent do seem absolutely insane.

Around 2003-4 I bought a bunch of BGS 9.5 graded rookie cards of Lecavalier, Gagne, Luongo among other. These are now barely worth more than I paid for them 18 years ago despite having had really great careers. Now Lafreniere's cards are selling for hundreds of dollars after a so-so rookie year? Some people are going to loose a lot of money over this.

Everyone buys into the hype but in reality only top players like Crosby/Ovechkin will gain value in the long term. In a pure investment stand point IMO Ovechkin is the best bet right now, if he breaks Gretzky's record I think his value will rocket.

 

[thebigbea]

Series 2 for 2020/21 is on sale right now a lot of places.

401games.ca has series 2 hobby for $130 CAD and blasters for $25 CAD.

Sports Cards

In the USA, you can get retail boxes of 24 series 2 for $60 USD and tins for $25 USD:

Search results for upper series hockey

Much cheaper than 2019/20 series 2 right now.

I regret picking up 3 cases of 20-21 series 2 . Hoping they will go up in value later

 

[blankall]

Yea 19/20 stuff is crazy expensive right now but the 20/21 rookie class is looking really weak. In series 2 we're looking at Makar, Dach and Suzuki vs Stutzle and Kaprizov. It might sound crazy but the most "reasonably" priced box in 19/20 might be Cup when comparing the potential hits out of them.

I bought a bunch of 2019/20 when it came out. Enough for 3-4 copies of each of the YGs. Sold most of it off though. Personally, I don't think that a lot of these players will end up as huge superstars down the road. While players like Suzuki and Dach are good, I don't see them as constant 100+ point players.

As for 2020/21, I think it's a good buy for a few reasons. Firstly, we only got a weird shortened season, so we don't really know how good a lot of these guys are going to be. Series 2 also go more of the actual rookies than normal, as Series 1 came out before the season.

I wouldn't buy a lot of Series 2 at the high hype prices, but at a discount I think it's a solid buy. Odds are 1-2 guys from there will become legit superstars.

 

[Not The One]

Everyone buys into the hype but in reality only top players like Crosby/Ovechkin will gain value in the long term. In a pure investment stand point IMO Ovechkin is the best bet right now, if he breaks Gretzky's record I think his value will rocket.

Yeah it's why I only collect vintage cards and have little interest in the new stuff.

You can get great looking rookie cards of Ray Bourque for less than Cale Makar. Denis Savard for less than Kirby Dach. Patrick Roy for less than Carey Price.

It makes no sense but it's the free market I guess.

 

[Niten Ichi Ryu]

Heard ebay shut down PWCC auctions for mass shill bidding. About time, but that's a huge blow to consignment grinders. Probably less than 25% of items submitted are shill bidded, such a shame that minority ruins it all for everyone.

If Probstein goes down too, huge opportunity for someone to seize, step in and become the primary consignment service. Anyone with a decent reputation and experience can give it a whirl. Maybe I will

 

[Dr Pepper]

Yea 19/20 stuff is crazy expensive right now but the 20/21 rookie class is looking really weak. In series 2 we're looking at Makar, Dach and Suzuki vs Stutzle and Kaprizov. It might sound crazy but the most "reasonably" priced box in 19/20 might be Cup when comparing the potential hits out of them.

As a Makar collector is really difficult to pull cards on my own right now

Jesus murphy, never seen the full Letterman spelled out like that. Must've taken a while, or you spotted some good deals on ebay.

How much do you reckon that whole collection is worth, if you were to put it on the block right now?

 

[Muffin]

Jesus murphy, never seen the full Letterman spelled out like that. Must've taken a while, or you spotted some good deals on ebay.

How much do you reckon that whole collection is worth, if you were to put it on the block right now?

Hm I haven’t really sat down and priced everything out. Including his Future Watch and Ice Premieres /99 I have at Beckett for grading right now I’m guessing somewhere around 8k?

 

[Dr Pepper]

Hm I haven’t really sat down and priced everything out. Including his Future Watch and Ice Premieres /99 I have at Beckett for grading right now I’m guessing somewhere around 8k?

Probably a fair assessment.

Rack up a few Norris trophies though, and watch that value skyrocket.

 

[Rorschach]

Yeah it's why I only collect vintage cards and have little interest in the new stuff.

You can get great looking rookie cards of Ray Bourque for less than Cale Makar. Denis Savard for less than Kirby Dach. Patrick Roy for less than Carey Price.

It makes no sense but it's the free market I guess.

Yes and no...Bourque, Savard and Roy RC cards have many copies out there, especially in lower grade.
But a Bourque PSA 10 OPC RC from 1980 will light you up for like $9k. So will a Roy OPC RC PSA 10 from 1986.

 

[Not The One]

Yes and no...Bourque, Savard and Roy RC cards have many copies out there, especially in lower grade.
But a Bourque PSA 10 OPC RC from 1980 will light you up for like $9k. So will a Roy OPC RC PSA 10 from 1986.

Yeah because those cards are 35-40 years old.

Look at the PSA population report for the Makar YG:

https://www.psacard.com/pop/hockey-cards/2019/upper-deck/171690

There are 600 PSA 10 and 206 PSA 9 out of 824 graded cards.

For the OPC Bourque there are 31 PSA 10 and 143 PSA 9 out of 1413.

https://www.psacard.com/pop/hockey-cards/1980/o-pee-chee/42657

So you're not comparing the same thing. I see plenty of raw Makars on COMC for 175$ but checking recent eBay sold items the last OPC Ray Bourque at PSA 6 sold for 80$. It's literally insane to me that people think these things will increase in value enough to be an investment. PSA has been grading Bourque cards for 30 years and they have 1400 in total. They already have 800 Makars in the database even though they have months of backlog on their processing.

If these were stocks there would be tons of money to be made in short-selling Makar, Lafreniere and Kaprizov rookies.

 

[Rorschach]

Yeah because those cards are 35-40 years old.

Look at the PSA population report for the Makar YG:

https://www.psacard.com/pop/hockey-cards/2019/upper-deck/171690

There are 600 PSA 10 and 206 PSA 9 out of 824 graded cards.

For the OPC Bourque there are 31 PSA 10 and 143 PSA 9 out of 1413.

https://www.psacard.com/pop/hockey-cards/1980/o-pee-chee/42657

So you're not comparing the same thing. I see plenty of raw Makars on COMC for 175$ but checking recent eBay sold items the last OPC Ray Bourque at PSA 6 sold for 80$. It's literally insane to me that people think these things will increase in value enough to be an investment. PSA has been grading Bourque cards for 30 years and they have 1400 in total. They already have 800 Makars in the database even though they have months of backlog on their processing.

If these were stocks there would be tons of money to be made in short-selling Makar, Lafreniere and Kaprizov rookies.

Bottom line is TV and media. Every card of every player playing today has a multiplier/premium on demand due to collectors being able to watch and follow the player online, on TV or in newsprint. I call this the "presence premium". If you remove that premium, suddenly everything else becomes about the standard supply (including slab pops) and demand (including what position the player plays, what team he plays for, what country he's from, etc.).

So my point is this, there's no point in wishing/complaining about why a newer player is "worth more" because for the most part, the players are regarded similarly on merit...it's just that current players exposed to the media for fans to follow have that presence premium. And naturally since their careers are still playing out, the general "hotness premium" for the players that are the sexiest, this is a lot more volatile as well where as on retired players, this is premium is fairly static.

 

[Cubs2024wildcard]

Heard ebay shut down PWCC auctions for mass shill bidding. About time, but that's a huge blow to consignment grinders. Probably less than 25% of items submitted are shill bidded, such a shame that minority ruins it all for everyone.

If Probstein goes down too, huge opportunity for someone to seize, step in and become the primary consignment service. Anyone with a decent reputation and experience can give it a whirl. Maybe I will

Hahahahahahahahahahahaha

Probsteins been banned countless times and will surely be banned again.

Everyone knew to stay away from PWCC auctions. There was a YouTube video where a guy bid on a common refractor and was a second away from winning it for a penny then magically sold at over 20 bucks.

 

[Cubs2024wildcard]

Yea 19/20 stuff is crazy expensive right now but the 20/21 rookie class is looking really weak. In series 2 we're looking at Makar, Dach and Suzuki vs Stutzle and Kaprizov. It might sound crazy but the most "reasonably" priced box in 19/20 might be Cup when comparing the potential hits out of them.

As a Makar collector is really difficult to pull cards on my own right now

Makar farm

good lord!!!

 

[Not The One]

Hahahahahahahahahahahaha

Probsteins been banned countless times and will surely be banned again.

Everyone knew to stay away from PWCC auctions. There was a YouTube video where a guy bid on a common refractor and was a second away from winning it for a penny then magically sold at over 20 bucks.

PWCC is awful for Canadians. I bought a really unique card from them (they do have some very good stuff), fully knowing that shipping was 40 USD for that single card. BUT they use FedEx 2-day shipping and I got charged an additional 67 CAD for fees before they would actually deliver the card. It's a total scam.

 

[Xspyrit]

Heard ebay shut down PWCC auctions for mass shill bidding. About time, but that's a huge blow to consignment grinders. Probably less than 25% of items submitted are shill bidded, such a shame that minority ruins it all for everyone.

If Probstein goes down too, huge opportunity for someone to seize, step in and become the primary consignment service. Anyone with a decent reputation and experience can give it a whirl. Maybe I will

Talk about greed. PWCC had a very impressive business going on until they decided they needed more!

 

[Satan]

PWCC is awful for Canadians. I bought a really unique card from them (they do have some very good stuff), fully knowing that shipping was 40 USD for that single card. BUT they use FedEx 2-day shipping and I got charged an additional 67 CAD for fees before they would actually deliver the card. It's a total scam.

Pretty simple solution to save on postage fees from US sellers like PWCC or eBays nonsense global shipping program: use a US mailbox service like ShipMyCards.

I save hundreds annually using SMC.

 

[Not The One]

Pretty simple solution to save on postage fees from US sellers like PWCC or eBays nonsense global shipping program: use a US mailbox service like ShipMyCards.

I save hundreds annually using SMC.

Oh my god why didn't anybody tell me this before I pretty much finished my PC.

Prior to the pandemic I used to ship stuff to a place close to the border with Kinek but I obviously couldn't do that right now, and that was before I started collecting cards again. I'll check them out for sure next time I make a big purchase, thanks.