Player Discussion Henrik Lundqvist: Part II

[Amazing Kreiderman]

Is this really your take on mentoring? Come on.

“- Igor, who’s your idol?
- Lundqvist. He was, he is and he will always be my idol”

"Henrik Lundqvist is my idol since I was a little boy, so I very much look forward to seeing him on the ice and learning what he does on the ice ," the 23-year-old goalie said at Rangers development camp in June. "Playing with him someday on the same team, obviously there is some work to be done in that regard.

His locker is next to Lundqvist.

I'm sure the 6th winningest goalie in NHL history has a little more to offer than where Ovie shoots.

So let him retire and hire him as a goalie coach

 

[Harbour Dog]

As much as we like to romanticize the end of a players career, its not reality in 2020. These players are payed a ransom to play a game. Management is on a continual short leash. Doing what will produce the most success is always the plan. If that means buying out a player, that is what you do. There will be a day dedicated to Hank in a few years, where they raise his jersey to the rafters of the Garden. Buying him out won't change that day.

As far as mentoring goes, I think that's nonsense. Hank telling Igor that Ovi likes to shoot from the left dot doens't mean a thing. As a former goaltender, the last thing your thinking about is "oh, there's Tavaras, Hank told me he likes to go 5 hole". If any thought like that is going through your head, your already beat. A locked in goalie is only focused on the moment.

At the end of the day, I think Hank is a large presence in the locker room. This team needs to move on from his leadership and allow the younger guys to take leadership roles. They are the future. The sooner this happens, the better it will be for the team.

Lol at thinking that mentoring is Hank telling Igor how superstars like to shoot. I don't know if Hank mentors Igor at all, but I assume it isn't by regurgitating facts that any cheeto-stained fan can spit up at will.

Also, do we even have a compliance buyout to use right now? It seems like every other post mentions buying him out, but as far as I know that isn't even an option?

 

[haohmaru]

So let him retire and hire him as a goalie coach

We already have the best goalie coach in the NHL. Also, not the same as being on the team, having a locker next to a future HOF'er, being a guy that Shesterkin clearly idolizes and wants to learn from, etc...

It's a year where we're not winning the Cup anyway and Georgiev's aspirations are probably not to be a career backup. Get a 2nd for him, let Lundqvist play to the end of his contract, and we've got plenty of goalies in the system. This isn't a big deal.

 

[The S5]

Is this really your take on mentoring? Come on.

“- Igor, who’s your idol?
- Lundqvist. He was, he is and he will always be my idol”

"Henrik Lundqvist is my idol since I was a little boy, so I very much look forward to seeing him on the ice and learning what he does on the ice ," the 23-year-old goalie said at Rangers development camp in June. "Playing with him someday on the same team, obviously there is some work to be done in that regard.

His locker is next to Lundqvist.

I'm sure the 6th winningest goalie in NHL history has a little more to offer than where Ovie shoots.

I was addressing a previous post that mentioned Hank giving Igor the playbook on shooters. Sure, Igor watching Hank's work ethic is a great thing. He's already witnessed it. Beniot A can also help with that, but the drive has to come from Igor.
I'm not sure buying Hank out is the right move. The cap savings might be better utilized via another player. What I am pretty certain of is that this has been Hank's team and it needs to move on.

 

[haohmaru]

If there's a compliance buyout that doesn't cost anything, that's fine. If we can trade him to a contender without holding much of that contract, also fine. A traditional buyout makes no sense to me or the team for next year.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

If there's a compliance buyout that doesn't cost anything, that's fine. If we can trade him to a contender without holding much of that contract, also fine. A traditional buyout makes no sense to me or the team for next year.

I want Lundqvist to retire, not be bought out. Datsyuk walked away from 5.5m when he retired. Klein walked away from 2m which is 10% of his career earnings, almost double the percentage Lundqvist would walk away from if he retires.

8.5m in cap space is much more valuable to the Rangers than having Lundqvist sit "next to Igor in the locker room"

 

[haohmaru]

I want Lundqvist to retire, not be bought out. Datsyuk walked away from 5.5m when he retired. Klein walked away from 2m which is 10% of his career earnings, almost double the percentage Lundqvist would walk away from if he retires.

8.5m in cap space is much more valuable to the Rangers than having Lundqvist sit "next to Igor in the locker room"

And, I've said as much, so what is your point, exactly? Or are you deliberately refuting arguments that I haven't made?

Only he can decide if he wants to retire regardless of what YOU want.

 

[duhmetreE]

Are there rules that would block Lundqvist from retiring and then getting paid $5M as a consultant by the org?

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

Are there rules that would block Lundqvist from retiring and then getting paid $5M as a consultant by the org?

No.

 

[Leetch3]

Are there rules that would block Lundqvist from retiring and then getting paid $5M as a consultant by the org?

if he wants his $$ but doesn't care about playing, the president has already been set. either he suddenly becomes allergic to his equipment or gets a job in the league office and we are free and clear lol

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

if he wants his $$ but doesn't care about playing, the president has already been set. either he suddenly becomes allergic to his equipment or gets a job in the league office and we are free and clear lol

To be fair, after you take away taxes, escrow and agent fees, he leaves 1.6m on the table. It's a lot of money for us, but for Lundqvist, it's not even 5% of his career earnings (not including endorsement deals)

 

[Irishguy42]

if he wants his $$ but doesn't care about playing, the president has already been set. either he suddenly becomes allergic to his equipment or gets a job in the league office and we are free and clear lol

Precedent*

But yes, the sentiment is right. Pretty sure there's really no hard-and-fast rules about him retiring and then suddenly being hired to a role on the team that conveniently pays the same salary as what he would have made in his final year salary as a player.

Does it look incredibly shady af? Sure.

Also....$5M salary is quite a bit. Most GM's/coaches don't make that, AFAIK.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

Precedent*

But yes, the sentiment is right. Pretty sure there's really no hard-and-fast rules about him retiring and then suddenly being hired to a role on the team that conveniently pays the same salary as what he would have made in his final year salary as a player.

Does it looks incredibly shady af? Sure.

Also....$5M salary is quite a bit. Most GM's/coaches don't make that, AFAIK.

Can Dolan just buy Lundqvist's house for 5 million dollars and then sell it back for the symbolic amount of $1?

 

[eco's bones]

I want Lundqvist to retire, not be bought out. Datsyuk walked away from 5.5m when he retired. Klein walked away from 2m which is 10% of his career earnings, almost double the percentage Lundqvist would walk away from if he retires.

8.5m in cap space is much more valuable to the Rangers than having Lundqvist sit "next to Igor in the locker room"

There's no question to me that Alex needed to be more consistent than he was last year but all in all he outplayed Henrik over the course of the year up until Igor was recalled. Henrik was our third best goalie last year and at 38 years old I don't think he's going to get better. $8.5 mil in cap relief if he retired would make a lot of other upcoming cap decisions by the Rangers a whole lot easier.

The Rangers can make a job for Henrik if he wants to stick around but to me put the best possible team on the ice and IMO Rangers are better with Alex backing up Igor.

As for those thinking the Rangers system is chock full of goalies--I don't agree. Huska played his first full pro season and was a sub .900 save % in Hartford last year. His season was so-so at best and Tyler Wall will be a rookie pro this year if there is an AHL season at all. Another point I'd make is that I don't think Henrik is going to be pleased about being a backup anymore than Alex will.

 

[haohmaru]

As for those thinking the Rangers system is chock full of goalies--I don't agree. Huska played his first full pro season and was a sub .900 save % in Hartford last year. His season was so-so at best and Tyler Wall will be a rookie pro this year if there is an AHL season at all. Another point I'd make is that I don't think Henrik is going to be pleased about being a backup anymore than Alex will.

Meh, even if none of them pan out to be a back-up caliber NHL goalie it's not like finding a decent backup is a difficult chore. When Georgiev's RFA years run out he's not going to be looking to be a back-up either.

 

[NYSPORTS]

Mentoring lol at that cost and a roster spot.

 

[Tawnos]

if he wants his $$ but doesn't care about playing, the president has already been set. either he suddenly becomes allergic to his equipment or gets a job in the league office and we are free and clear lol

The precedent on that first one is that he needs to be able to demonstrate a legitimate medical issue.

 

[and 99 others]

To be fair, after you take away taxes, escrow and agent fees, he leaves 1.6m on the table. It's a lot of money for us, but for Lundqvist, it's not even 5% of his career earnings (not including endorsement deals)

micro-analyzing wealthy people's take home pay is not only a waste of time but breeds unnecessary contempt. You're setting yourself up for a position of being angry at Lundqvist if he decides to stay on with the team for receiving compensation that he earned.

Would it be better for the team if he decides on his own to retire? Most likely yes. Would anyone be justified in being upset with him if he decides to play out his last year as a backup. Absolutely not.

 

[Thirty One]

Are there rules that would block Lundqvist from retiring and then getting paid $5M as a consultant by the org?

Yeah.

 

[eco's bones]

Meh, even if none of them pan out to be a back-up caliber NHL goalie it's not like finding a decent backup is a difficult chore. When Georgiev's RFA years run out he's not going to be looking to be a back-up either.

Yeah, well the most games Igor has played in one season including playoffs is 51. That was all the way back in 2013-14. His backup is kind of important and if we're going to be a playoff team that backup is going to have to play at least .500 or there is going to be enormous pressure on Igor to have to play more games than maybe is comfortable for him. Henrik went into last season as the No. 1 still but by the time Igor was called up to play his first game Georgiev had pretty much outplayed him and if you look back Alex gets the starts in 9 of the last 15 games played before Igor plays his first game. Henrik's record at the end of the season was 10-12-3. Alex's record at the end of the year 17-14-2. It might not seem like much but it matters. The last team in is going to need 95/96/97 standings points or somewhere up as high as 15 games above .500. If Alex gets moved that will still matter and even if Henrik retires and Alex is moved it matters. So if we do move Alex we're going to need someone who can carry his weight---a good backup. Free Agency or a trade and Alex might get to $2.5 mil or so but the guy we find to replace him might too.

And to the idea that some might have that Igor can start 60 games next year and then take us deep into the playoffs when he's never played nearly that amount of games before is kind of a flying blind game plan. And anyway if Henrik were his backup getting 20 games I'm pretty sure he would be seriously unhappy about that.

 

[eco's bones]

micro-analyzing wealthy people's take home pay is not only a waste of time but breeds unnecessary contempt. You're setting yourself up for a position of being angry at Lundqvist if he decides to stay on with the team for receiving compensation that he earned.

Would it be better for the team if he decides on his own to retire? Most likely yes. Would anyone be justified in being upset with him if he decides to play out his last year as a backup. Absolutely not.

Before the season prematurely ended Henrik said he would spend some time over the summer thinking about what he wanted to do--the insinuation being that because of his reduced role he might not be back. Henrik has a year left and has to decide what is best for him. That said the Rangers have options too and every right to buy him out if that's what they decide. It would be better for the team and cleaner for everyone if Henrik just retired IMO.

Henrik if he decides to continue and the Rangers don't buy him out should also think about whether he wants to be sequestered in a bubble for 6/7/8 months because that's what next season might be and barring a major injury Shesterkin is going to play more because he's just flat out the better goalie. Henrik has made a lot of money over the course of his career. Does he really need to make a few million more?

 

[Kovalev27]

Like @Amazing Kreiderman said it’s more like 1.5 or so remaining.

Rangers could offer him a 5 year 5 million dollar special Advisor to the President contract and pay it up front if they wanted to

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

Like @Amazing Kreiderman said it’s more like 1.5 or so remaining.

Rangers could offer him a 5 year 5 million dollar special Advisor to the President contract and pay it up front if they wanted to

Or like the Blue Jackets with Rick Nash in Columbus, they can challenge their inner Michael Scott and name him Assistant to the General Manager

 

[Irishguy42]

Yeah.

Just glanced through the article, and there doesn't seem to be anything to expressly prohibit Hank from retiring and then picking up a job with the team for $5M...on his own accord. You are certainly right that there are circumvention rules about a team getting a player to retire with the incentive of a team job or something.

26.15(e) says exactly this (one of the examples they give).

However, again, I think that this can easily be hand-waved away by the player and team as the player doing it on their own accord, assuming they legitimately do it that way.

Would it look extremely shady? Hell yes.

Do I think the NHL would actually put forth an investigation on this, considering the amount of press and whatnot that has been surrounding this, and it, at least, looks like he will legitimately retire after this season? No.

If Hank retires in a few weeks and then doesn't take a job until February, no one would bat an eye.

 

[haohmaru]

Yeah, well the most games Igor has played in one season including playoffs is 51. That was all the way back in 2013-14.

The KHL season is also 20 games less than an NHL season so that changes the context somewhat. I'm sure he's fine to do 55-60 games and the playoffs.

A bigger question is can he stay as healthy as Lundqvist did during his career?