Player Discussion: Heinola Thread

KingBogo

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Nov 29, 2011
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Schmidt is making almost 6 million, he has certainly not been full value for his caphit when his impact is closer to a DeMelo type if even that. He'd be a guy where the Jets can gain more cap efficiency replacing him with someone like Heinola.
The problem is while still a serviceable player, Schmidt has negative value on the trade market. Who will take on his cap hit without a sizeable sweetener? Just about everyone is squeezed right up against the cap, finding creative ways to remain cap compliant. We would have to take on an even worse contract from any team trying to content. Teams with cap room, wouldn't want him unless you gave up a pick and/prospects for them to take him. No one can flip with 2 3/4 years on his contract. If Chevy was going to move Schmidt it had to be at the beginning of the offseason and take his medicine to do so. Similar to what LV did with Patches.
 

Huffer

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Jul 16, 2010
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The problem is while still a serviceable player, Schmidt has negative value on the trade market. Who will take on his cap hit without a sizeable sweetener? Just about everyone is squeezed right up against the cap, finding creative ways to remain cap compliant. We would have to take on an even worse contract from any team trying to content. Teams with cap room, wouldn't want him unless you gave up a pick and/prospects for them to take him. No one can flip with 2 3/4 years on his contract. If Chevy was going to move Schmidt it had to be at the beginning of the offseason and take his medicine to do so. Similar to what LV did with Patches.
If they look to move Schmidt I think it needs to be in the offseason, and to a team in a similar situation to ours where we acquired him.
 

DRW204

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Dec 26, 2010
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off a quick glance of cap-friendly

it appears that the Jets have 0 cap-pressure to move schmidt (or anyone really) next season. they went into this year with like 3-4m in cap-space. he hasn't been terrible, he has a 10 team ntc, i doubt he gets moved.

i guess it depends if PLD re-signs and to what. i dont think he does end up re-signing here but that's just me.
 
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surixon

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Jul 12, 2003
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The problem is while still a serviceable player, Schmidt has negative value on the trade market. Who will take on his cap hit without a sizeable sweetener? Just about everyone is squeezed right up against the cap, finding creative ways to remain cap compliant. We would have to take on an even worse contract from any team trying to content. Teams with cap room, wouldn't want him unless you gave up a pick and/prospects for them to take him. No one can flip with 2 3/4 years on his contract. If Chevy was going to move Schmidt it had to be at the beginning of the offseason and take his medicine to do so. Similar to what LV did with Patches.

Schmidt's not getting moved inseason. The idea would be to move him next summer whe the cap is slated to rise a couple of million.
 

JetsFan815

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Jan 16, 2012
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The problem is while still a serviceable player, Schmidt has negative value on the trade market. Who will take on his cap hit without a sizeable sweetener? Just about everyone is squeezed right up against the cap, finding creative ways to remain cap compliant. We would have to take on an even worse contract from any team trying to content. Teams with cap room, wouldn't want him unless you gave up a pick and/prospects for them to take him. No one can flip with 2 3/4 years on his contract. If Chevy was going to move Schmidt it had to be at the beginning of the offseason and take his medicine to do so. Similar to what LV did with Patches.

Schmidt could be/could have been moved in the offseason for a team desperate for D. He is not a bad player and improves a team so he's not a cap dump that you need to give up an asset for. Nor does he have a bad injury history/ongoing injuries that make him hard to trade like Patches. Now it's probably too late to trade him as most teams have their cap commited and Chevy would not wanna trade a guy for nothing from a winning team but there was/is a window to move a player like him. His contract isn't terrible either. A team like Ottawa could use him.
 

JetsFan815

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Jan 16, 2012
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off a quick glance of cap-friendly

it appears that the Jets have 0 cap-pressure to move schmidt (or anyone really) next season. they went into this year with like 3-4m in cap-space. he hasn't been terrible, he has a 10 team ntc, i doubt he gets moved.

i guess it depends if PLD re-signs and to what. i dont think he does end up re-signing here but that's just me.

Could those cap $$s be utilized better? If Heinola can give you 80% of what Schmidt does, does that open up opportunities for the Jets to improve the roster even if the Jets are not under a lot of cap-pressure?
 

KingBogo

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Nov 29, 2011
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Schmidt could be/could have been moved in the offseason for a team desperate for D. He is not a bad player and improves a team so he's not a cap dump that you need to give up an asset for. Nor does he have a bad injury history/ongoing injuries that make him hard to trade like Patches. Now it's probably too late to trade him as most teams have their cap commited and Chevy would not wanna trade a guy for nothing from a winning team but there was/is a window to move a player like him. His contract isn't terrible either. A team like Ottawa could use him.
That is pretty much what I said. If you were going to trade him, it needed to be at the front end of the off season so teams could account for his cap hit. I can't see a team out there who takes on his cap hit at this point. And his contract is pretty bad, so yes even in the off season you would have to pay a sweetener.
 

DRW204

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Dec 26, 2010
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Could those cap $$s be utilized better? If Heinola can give you 80% of what Schmidt does, does that open up opportunities for the Jets to improve the roster even if the Jets are not under a lot of cap-pressure?
when have the jets ever done something like this? really the only time i could think of is with steve mason perhaps, and evidently there's a stark difference b/w the two.
a back-up goalie you're paying high $$$ to see the ice 15ish times a year vs a D playing 20+ mins a night. i think he's been fine this year, and i believe the Jets really like his intangibles off the ice. given a 10 team NTC, & cap-space usually being quite scarce league-wide, it might be tough to move him (if the Jets really want to which i do not believe).
 

lomiller1

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Jan 13, 2015
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off a quick glance of cap-friendly

it appears that the Jets have 0 cap-pressure to move schmidt (or anyone really) next season. they went into this year with like 3-4m in cap-space. he hasn't been terrible, he has a 10 team ntc, i doubt he gets moved.

i guess it depends if PLD re-signs and to what. i dont think he does end up re-signing here but that's just me.
Keep in mind that when you look at cap-friendly the remaining cap space doesn't include bonuses. While bonuses can be deferred until next year if you run out of space that can trigger a major cap crunch. Eg it's why Chicago had to trade Ladd and Buff for not a whole lot.

For practicle purposes the Jets had ~$2 million cap space left at the start of the season. Not critical, but not enough to take on a significant contract either.
 

snowkiddin

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I'd give Schmidt an A. Trade pionk and call up Ville. Schmidt is obvious good for the room and that stuff matters. Pionk and Schmidt are the same player. Offensive d men, all things being equal I move pionk over Schmidt all day every day. Schmidt has a vital role in the room, not sure Pionk does. Haven't liked pionks game since the cdn division. Figured that was more of a those teams weren't good then it was pionk being good and appears to be the case. Schmidt is just so damn likable I move pionk over him every day. Jets players all love nate
Now that the locker room cancer is in Florida, I’m not sure I see Schmidt’s locker room presence as important as it was.

To be sure, I don’t think anyone on the team will be happy if Schmidt is moved, especially now as the team is succeeding, but I could see him being traded in the offseason to make room for Heinola and to clear his cap.
 
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DRW204

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Dec 26, 2010
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Keep in mind that when you look at cap-friendly the remaining cap space doesn't include bonuses. While bonuses can be deferred until next year if you run out of space that can trigger a major cap crunch. Eg it's why Chicago had to trade Ladd and Buff for not a whole lot.

For practicle purposes the Jets had ~$2 million cap space left at the start of the season. Not critical, but not enough to take on a significant contract either.
So how much space are you estimating next year?
 

lomiller1

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Jan 13, 2015
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So how much space are you estimating next year?
Tough to say, but not much if they signed someone to a multi-year contract this year. The only money coming off the books is PLD, and if you brought in someone this year at $4 million for more that one year it would add about $6 million to the Jets salary total next year. It looks to me like if they carry over bonus money to next year they are struck trying to move PLD and replace him with someone in the $1 million range.
 

Howard Chuck

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Jan 24, 2012
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I’m probably the biggest Heinola fan here, and I recognize that the team is performing well and I wouldn’t mess that up if I was coach.

He’s going to have to continue to hone his game while he’s waiting.
 
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KingBogo

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Nov 29, 2011
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Keep in mind that when you look at cap-friendly the remaining cap space doesn't include bonuses. While bonuses can be deferred until next year if you run out of space that can trigger a major cap crunch. Eg it's why Chicago had to trade Ladd and Buff for not a whole lot.

For practicle purposes the Jets had ~$2 million cap space left at the start of the season. Not critical, but not enough to take on a significant contract either.
I think one of the main reasons they haven't gone to the cap is to allow for our ELC performance bonuses. If all are met from our current roster players it is a shade over $2 M. Good chance Perfetti hits his, less so for Barron and Samberg. I'm also guessing we see a small add or 2 at the TD with remaining cap space. I doubt they let themselves go into a performance overage situation next season.
 
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Teppo Numenor

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Mar 14, 2016
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I think it's a huge positive that the whole Heinola "issue" (if there really is one, and personally I don't think the Jets see it as an issue), is that we have a good young player that at age 21 has already played multiple seasons in mens leagues with good results and is ready for the next step. We also have another young player in Samberg who is older than Heinola (and with less flexibility with the minors), that has shown he can play in the NHL. And Stanley, who has been up and down, but is also young and shown promise.
While maybe our current NHL roster of defenseman is not a collection of all-stars, they are all well established NHL players. This is not the team that had Beulieu, Sbisa, and other lower quality starters. Not outright beating one of Dillon, or Pionk, or Schmidt at age 20 and 21 is not an indictment on this young players ability or future.

Personally I think the Jets are more than fine with using the fact that Heinola does not need waivers to their advantage. It is not what Heinola would want, and I get it because he'll make 10 times more in the NHL, but it's the reality of the business. Interestingly, the Jets will still need to either trade an established D making more money next offseason, or possibly trade a young D, because we'll still be in this (not terrible) situation.
Totally agree. Trading an established nhl vet to make room for a rookie who wont be as reliable doesnt make sense. If ville was pushing a player out that would be different. Pionk is not a big player either but he plays 50lbs bigger than ville. The off season and injuries will come and ville will get his chance
 
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Adam da bomb

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May 1, 2016
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I sure hope he makes the most of his call up! I want him to be the player we hope he can be.
Is he healthy? Last I heard he was out for 4 games because of illness, from the moose thread. That would be hard on him if he finally gets a chance to shine only to be ill.
 

KingBogo

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Nov 29, 2011
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This looks like it will be Heinola's opportunity to get a consistent string of games in. And it is why teams don't want to leave themselves too thin on defense. Every defensive group has to deal with injuries at some point, and having an close to ready prospect able to step up is what every GM and coach wants. We shouldn't miss much of a beat being able to go to Ville.
 
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Adam da bomb

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May 1, 2016
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This looks like it will be Heinola's opportunity to get a consistent string of games in. And it is why teams don't want to leave themselves too thin on defense. Every defensive group has to deal with injuries at some point, and having an close to ready prospect able to step up is what every GM and coach wants. We shouldn't miss much of a beat being able to go to Ville.
Can he only play 10 games before having to go on waivers?
 

surixon

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Jul 12, 2003
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This looks like it will be Heinola's opportunity to get a consistent string of games in. And it is why teams don't want to leave themselves too thin on defense. Every defensive group has to deal with injuries at some point, and having an close to ready prospect able to step up is what every GM and coach wants. We shouldn't miss much of a beat being able to go to Ville.

Hard to say how many he'll get as concussions are tricky. But the team has 5 before the break and I'd think the org will play it safe and keep him out until after the break at minimum.

He absolutely should be inserted and put immediately on PP2. After all that is the role his coach has said he's being groomed to play and that is the role open. He needs to opportunity to show what he can do with it.
 

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