Player Discussion: Heinola Thread

[Jet]

Except he has been for the past 2 years our best Dman on the Moose and I’m guessing the only reason this season he has been passed is he’s fed up. Why try when it doesn’t seem to matter. Chevy made a mistake when he brought in both Schmidt and Dillon. He blocked his own prospects from moving up. Now he’s facing some backlash for his decisions. Good on Heinola for pushing for what he feels is right for him. He should have been on the Jet’s over a year ago. But PoMo blocked him when Chevy wanted him in.

I don't believe that is true. Chisholm Gawanke have been our best D on the Moose. What is your criteria for claiming it was Heinola?

Saying Heinola was blocked by Schmidt and Dillon would be valid if Heinola was ready to step into a top 4 role which is not correct. Not today and definitely not last season when he had a poor TC and exy. If Chevy wouldn't have made some moves to try and shore up our D he would have gotten shredded here.

Saying Heinola is ready is like saying that a Ferarri with no wheels is the fastest car on the road and is ready for the Autobahn. It has the components to be just that, but without wheels it doesn't matter how good the engine, chassis and suspension is

 

[TS Quint]

The Jets get a coach who is trying to install systems and play that are safer and more structured and the prospect that causes chaos with the puck and can’t turn it over defensively is left on the outside looking in? You don’t say….


The idea that Heinola is a puck moving defenseman in the NHL is a myth based on size and old prospect reports. He passes to the other team just as often as his own on break outs. Defensively you don’t have to be big to be effective but you need to find a way to turn the puck over. Heinola looks like he‘s just trying to hold on for dear life defending, just trying to stay between the puck carrier and the net. The thought of getting the puck back isn’t even in his head.

Maybe in 40 games when the teams has become consistent in their structure you can bring Heinola in and insulate him. But right now, when the team is trying to put it together Heinola is just a stick of dynamite to that structure.

 

[BoneDocUK]

I don't believe that is true. Chisholm Gawanke have been our best D on the Moose. What is your criteria for claiming it was Heinola?

Saying Heinola was blocked by Schmidt and Dillon would be valid if Heinola was ready to step into a top 4 role which is not correct. Not today and definitely not last season when he had a poor TC and exy. If Chevy wouldn't have made some moves to try and shore up our D he would have gotten shredded here.

Saying Heinola is ready is like saying that a Ferarri with no wheels is the fastest car on the road and is ready for the Autobahn. It has the components to be just that, but without wheels it doesn't matter how good the engine, chassis and suspension is

I can't watch the Moose anymore, so I've seen very little of them this year, but I did watch pretty much every game they played over that period and I'd agree that Ville had been their top D over that 2 year period, certainly in terms of puck retrieval, possession, passing and generating chances the other way. Glad to hear that Gawanke is looking good now but he has been an adventure at time for years, despite his offensive gifts. Also a fan of Chisholm and have hopes for him as a contributing NHLer but Heinola has been the straw that stirred the drink for a while now on the Moose.

If he sucks this year, I'm sorry to hear it.

Agree that there's no way he supplants Schmidt and Dillon, especially when waivers come into play. Had Schmidt not been signed developing him as an RHD might have been a path forward and saved the Jets a whole lot of cap and angst but so it goes.

I don't see him agreeing to spend another 2 years in the A at this point, so expect him to be traded as part of a package at some point. Hopefully the return is reasonable.

 

[KingBogo]

I can't watch the Moose anymore, so I've seen very little of them this year, but I did watch pretty much every game they played over that period and I'd agree that Ville had been their top D over that 2 year period, certainly in terms of puck retrieval, possession, passing and generating chances the other way. Glad to hear that Gawanke is looking good now but he has been an adventure at time for years, despite his offensive gifts. Also a fan of Chisholm and have hopes for him as a contributing NHLer but Heinola has been the straw that stirred the drink for a while now on the Moose.

If he sucks this year, I'm sorry to hear it.

Agree that there's no way he supplants Schmidt and Dillon, especially when waivers come into play. Had Schmidt not been signed developing him as an RHD might have been a path forward and saved the Jets a whole lot of cap and angst but so it goes.

I don't see him agreeing to spend another 2 years in the A at this point, so expect him to be traded as part of a package at some point. Hopefully the return is reasonable.

Not agreeing to play in the AHL is like saying I'm not agreeing to make my mortgage payments. Sure you can do it, but it doesn't mean it doesn't come with serious consequences. In all honesty while I like Heinola as a prospect and think he has a ceiling as a # 2/3 offense first play maker, he isn't such a slam dunk talent that GM's will have much patience with his demands. Sure he might get moved by Chevy but it will be on Chevy's timetable and we all know he grinds and grids until he thinks he has as much value as he can get.

 

[surixon]

Not agreeing to play in the AHL is like saying I'm not agreeing to make my mortgage payments. Sure you can do it, but it doesn't mean it doesn't come with serious consequences. In all honesty while I like Heinola as a prospect and think he has a ceiling as a # 2/3 offense first play maker, he isn't such a slam dunk talent that GM's will have much patience with his demands. Sure he might get moved by Chevy but it will be on Chevy's timetable and we all know he grinds and grids until he thinks he has as much value as he can get.

A young dmen who thinks they should be on the big team going to their agent isn't all that newsworthy imo as it is happening more often.

Branstrom did they exact same thing at a similar point in the season last year. He's now a pretty big part of the Sens.

Lunqvist did this past summer and he got dealt.

So I'm curious if Ville will be more Branstrom or Lunqvist.

 

[KingBogo]

A young dmen who thinks they should be on the big team going to their agent isn't all that newsworthy imo as it is happening more often.

Branstrom did they exact same thing at a similar point in the season last year. He's now a pretty big part of the Sens.

Lunqvist did this past summer and he got dealt.

So I'm curious if Ville will be more Branstrom or Lunqvist.

I’m hoping it just blows over. He starts jumping off the page with the Moose and puts himself in the best position possible for then inevitable injury replacement call ups. That is the position he is in and the organization won’t appreciate any distractions as the Jets are out to about as good of start as could be hoped for.

 

[Huffer]

Some people are acting like Ville and his agent just stormed into Chevy's office and starting banging on the table or something.

 

[Jack7222]

I’m hoping it just blows over. He starts jumping off the page with the Moose and puts himself in the best position possible for then inevitable injury replacement call ups. That is the position he is in and the organization won’t appreciate any distractions as the Jets are out to about as good of start as could be hoped for.

...people keep saying this as if Heinola has been bad for the Moose? He was crazy good last year... if he's pouting now then he'll need to smarten up but I'm sure he will, and it's been like 10 games.

 

[DRW204]

Some people are acting like Ville and his agent just stormed into Chevy's office and starting banging on the table or something.

guy just wants a string of games, and wants to play here/likes the city. im surprised it didnt happen a bit sooner w/ all the taxi squad/PB.

 

[Dr Amazing]

The Jets are doing good right now no need to make a roster change Heinola will get his chance he's most likely the next defense to be called up anyways when a injury happens.

 

[Jet]

Some people are acting like Ville and his agent just stormed into Chevy's office and starting banging on the table or something.

That would actually be far more appropriate than going to the media.

At least if they chose the other option the team could handle it internally and perhaps deal him without damage to his asking price

 

[surixon]

That would actually be far more appropriate than going to the media.

At least if they chose the other option the team could handle it internally and perhaps deal him without damage to his asking price

Who's to say they haven't done that.

 

[Jet]

Who's to say they haven't done that.

OK, and?

If I tried that shit at my job it wouldn't go well

 

[surixon]

OK, and?

If I tried that shit at my job it wouldn't go well

Sure but imo you are able to leave your company and seek a better opportunity elsewhere if you don't like how things are going. Not as easy in pro hockey where your rights are controlled for 7 years.

My point is I doubt they went to the media without exploring other options first. Like it or not the media is a tool agents use all the time to get their clients what they want. This is par for the course in pro sports with disgruntled athletes.

 

[Huffer]

That would actually be far more appropriate than going to the media.

At least if they chose the other option the team could handle it internally and perhaps deal him without damage to his asking price

But how do we even know that his agent was the one to pick up the phone and call The Hockey News? Is it possible that the Hockey News is the one to initiate the conversation? Possible that the agent was asked about all of his clients and said, "yeah, Ville was disappointed he didn't stick with the big club and is really looking for a longer look, and I think he's earned it." And then they decided to write an article? (Personally I would think it's "likley" the agent initiated it, but we don't know that is all).

My point is that people have started to put all kinds of negative spin on it based on basically nothing. Using terms like "pouting", etc. It's common around here, that people put their own emotion and assumptions on things where there is no information that is currently shared to assume anything at this point.

Maybe it does get to a point where Ville and his agent ask for a trade (the article says he doesn't want one currently), but until I know that, I'm not going to assume that Ville is an immature, pouting, malcontent.

 

[Adam da bomb]

Sure but imo you are able to leave your company and seek a better opportunity elsewhere if you don't like how things are going. Not as easy in pro hockey where your rights are controlled for 7 years.

My point is I doubt they went to the media without exploring other options first. Like it or not the media is a tool agents use all the time to get their clients what they want. This is par for the course in pro sports with disgruntled athletes.

And he could go play in Liiga or Russia but the NHL is one business just different parts.

 

[Jet]

I've pretty much said all I wanted to about this situation. I guess we will see what happens since we have no impact on the outcome.

I guess my final comment would be that I still really hope that we can figure this out and Heinola stays with the team. I do still really like him as a player and think if he can clean up a couple key areas he could be a key piece of our d into the future.

But how do we even know that his agent was the one to pick up the phone and call The Hockey News? Is it possible that the Hockey News is the one to initiate the conversation? Possible that the agent was asked about all of his clients and said, "yeah, Ville was disappointed he didn't stick with the big club and is really looking for a longer look, and I think he's earned it." And then they decided to write an article? (Personally I would think it's "likley" the agent initiated it, but we don't know that is all).

My point is that people have started to put all kinds of negative spin on it based on basically nothing. Using terms like "pouting", etc. It's common around here, that people put their own emotion and assumptions on things where there is no information that is currently shared to assume anything at this point.

Maybe it does get to a point where Ville and his agent ask for a trade (the article says he doesn't want one currently), but until I know that, I'm not going to assume that Ville is an immature, pouting, malcontent.

Yeah I was a part of it and that's unfair, especially considering I fought against those who were doing it against PLD. I think I'll just sit back and see how it unfolds. I'm not going to harbor any resentment based on what's happened so far.

 

[KingBogo]

And he could go play in Liiga or Russia but the NHL is one business just different parts.

He can't go to either league until his ELC has ended. Unless of course the Jets loan him to another team in another league.

 

[KingBogo]

I've pretty much said all I wanted to about this situation. I guess we will see what happens since we have no impact on the outcome.

I guess my final comment would be that I still really hope that we can figure this out and Heinola stays with the team. I do still really like him as a player and think if he can clean up a couple key areas he could be a key piece of our d into the future.


Yeah I was a part of it and that's unfair, especially considering I fought against those who were doing it against PLD. I think I'll just sit back and see how it unfolds. I'm not going to harbor any resentment based on what's happened so far.

The list of players that have been unfairly speculated about has reached just about ever single player by now. Last summer this place was swarming in a wide range of nefarious speculation on Schiefele's, Wheeler's and a wide range of other players motives and actions. To a far greater extent that Heinola has gotten so far, as even those who are speculating on Ville are still supportive of him and want him to succeed.

 

[DRW204]

Sure but imo you are able to leave your company and seek a better opportunity elsewhere if you don't like how things are going. Not as easy in pro hockey where your rights are controlled for 7 years.

My point is I doubt they went to the media without exploring other options first. Like it or not the media is a tool agents use all the time to get their clients what they want. This is par for the course in pro sports with disgruntled athletes.

it seems like media has been questioning and wondering what the Jets would do with their supposed log-jam of D. there was an interview with Chevy ~3rd week of Sept where it sounded like he wasn't going to make a trade of their Dmen (contrary to posters on here saying all summer that was gonna happen) & evidently none happened. Then recently Friedman said there likely wont be a move. i think if fans are wondering, media is wondering, those players at the end of the log-jam are probably wondering too.

 

[DRW204]

also : did not realize Heinola's agent was a Jets 1.0 draft pick

 

[leer2006]

I don't believe that is true. Chisholm Gawanke have been our best D on the Moose. What is your criteria for claiming it was Heinola?

Saying Heinola was blocked by Schmidt and Dillon would be valid if Heinola was ready to step into a top 4 role which is not correct. Not today and definitely not last season when he had a poor TC and exy. If Chevy wouldn't have made some moves to try and shore up our D he would have gotten shredded here.

Saying Heinola is ready is like saying that a Ferarri with no wheels is the fastest car on the road and is ready for the Autobahn. It has the components to be just that, but without wheels it doesn't matter how good the engine, chassis and suspension is

It was stated many time that Heinola was the best D on the Moose from numerous sources. A quick google can pull up numerous articles stating that. And every thing else you say is nothing but conjecture. Like him getting shredded. Fact of the matter is we don’t know how good he can be in The NHL because he has not been given a fair shot. And it looks as though he will never get that shot with the Jet’s. If that is the case then he needs to be traded for someone who can help the team now.

 

[bumblebeeman]

Heinola has to clear waivers next year right? That means he will be in the NHL either with the Jets, or if they don't give him a shot he'll be claimed for sure

 

[KingBogo]

Heinola has to clear waivers next year right? That means he will be in the NHL either with the Jets, or if they don't give him a shot he'll be claimed for sure

No he is only on year 2 of his ELC. He is still waiver exempt next season as well. Part of the reason teams don't burn ELC years unless they are committed to the player being ready prior to the ELC's automatically kicking in.

 

[BoneDocUK]

Lots of Heinola talk in this article:

Heinola's Jets future? Time to trade a defenceman? Mailbag

Jets fans seem to be taking Winnipeg's 7-3-1 start with an air of cautiousness and have many questions about the defence.

theathletic.com

From his agent:

Roy says Heinola is in a situation that many young players have been in before him — he’s on an entry-level contract, good enough to play in the NHL, but facing a roadblock in the form of several quality players ahead of him on a team that’s performing well. Roy recognizes that Cheveldayoff has five healthy veterans and that Heinola’s entry-level contract makes him easy to keep in the AHL, but believes Heinola is ready for a lengthy NHL look.

“That’s their decision but it’s true: He hasn’t gotten that run of games to show that he could or couldn’t do it.”

I asked Roy if Heinola has asked for a trade. He says no but acknowledges that a trade is one of the possible outcomes.

“We’re trying to work together to find the solution,” Roy said. “A trade is always a possibility but that’s really in Chevy’s court. Whether he wants to keep the asset or move the asset is up to him. It’s probably more about figuring out what the best fit is with that group. The question is: when does that asset start going backward?”

Hearing that question makes me think of Winnipeg’s recent history. Jack Roslovic was thought of as a top prospect bordering on untouchable when he first made the Jets in 2017-18 and again at the 2018-19 trade deadline. Winnipeg was a deep team up front at the time, Roslovic didn’t play big minutes, and by the time Winnipeg traded him to Columbus in 2021, Roslovic was a supplementary piece as opposed to the “A” prospect he would have been just two seasons prior to that. I’ve often wondered what the Jets cost themselves, asset-wise, by picking the lane between playing him and trading him while his stock was presumably much higher.