Confirmed with Link: Head Coach Vacancy Pt III: How's your spelling? (Eakins/Vigneault/Messier/Gretzky)

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My question is do we have the horses to run though? CAn the D chip in offensively? Can they execute a PP? If they aren't capable it doesn't matter who coaches. I'm not sure we have the blueliners but I do think we can get the PP going.

Probably. Each of Stralman, McDonagh, Girardi, Del Zotto, and Staal (had 29 ES points in 77 games, I'm counting it) have had a 30+ point season. Moore is clearly talented offensively, an excellent skater, and he thinks the game quite well. If Eakins could get the best out of this team's defense offensively, it would be a major factor in the Rangers taking a step in the right direction.

Personally, I also think McDonagh is perfectly capable of running a PP. He doesn't handle the puck like a grenade (Girardi/DZ), he does a pretty good job of getting shots through, and above all is probably the second smartest player on the team (behind Stepan). He doesn't stop up and cease moving on the PP like the rest of the unit seems to do, he keeps the PP moving and opens up shooting/passing lanes. That was the team's biggest problem on the PP when they set it up. It was stationary. No PP is going to be successful without movement.
 
Probably. Each of Stralman, McDonagh, Girardi, Del Zotto, and Staal (had 29 ES points in 77 games, I'm counting it) have had a 30+ point season. Moore is clearly talented offensively, an excellent skater, and he thinks the game quite well. If Eakins could get the best out of this team's defense offensively, it would be a major factor in the Rangers taking a step in the right direction.

Personally, I also think McDonagh is perfectly capable of running a PP. He doesn't handle the puck like a grenade (Girardi/DZ), he does a pretty good job of getting shots through, and above all is probably the second smartest player on the team (behind Stepan). He doesn't stop up and cease moving on the PP like the rest of the unit seems to do, he keeps the PP moving and opens up shooting/passing lanes. That was the team's biggest problem on the PP when they set it up. It was stationary. No PP is going to be successful without movement.

Completely agree. I never understood why people didn't think he could/should, or why Torts rarely used him. He was on it during the BOS series and it definitely looked better with him on it. He's one of the smartest players and the best skater. Those are perfect attributes to be the point man on the PP. He doesn't need to have a cannon.
 
Completely agree. I never understood why people didn't think he could/should, or why Torts rarely used him. He was on it during the BOS series and it definitely looked better with him on it. He's one of the smartest players and the best skater. Those are perfect attributes to be the point man on the PP. He doesn't need to have a cannon.

I noticed that as well. As soon as Richards was removed and replaced with McDonagh, the PP looked worlds better.

Now, I'm not 100% sure if it's from the lack of Richards or the addition of McDonagh, but from what I remember, McDonagh was very effective on the PP in games four and five.
 
I noticed that as well. As soon as Richards was removed and replaced with McDonagh, the PP looked worlds better.

Now, I'm not 100% sure if it's from the lack of Richards or the addition of McDonagh, but from what I remember, McDonagh was very effective on the PP in games four and five.

With Moore and Stralman, McD doesn't need to play 1/2 the game anymore either. I think that had to do with his lack of PP time.

Whoever the new coach is, I hope he doesn't reward good play on the PP by removing them from it, haha.
 
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Why not make Wayne the head coach, he has experience

Then messier can assistant and still bring the leadership stuff he has

2 legends behind the bench, awesome stuff
 
Messier's been a head coach since 1989. Messier's the one who told Muckler to unglue Klima off the bench in 1990 and Klima went out and scored a game winner.

Have any of you ever had the chance to see a Rangers practice? Messier ran the show.

Messier ran the bench. Messier told Keenan and Nielson who to match up.

You guys are nuts if you dont think Messier has the ability to run a bench.
 
Look at Messier as Aaron Rogers. He's had several years to analyze, assess and develop. This isnt a guy who's coming off a yacht in Hilton head to coach in the NHL (well, maybe).

Messier always supported youth. Weight, Amonte, Leetch, Graves, Kovalev, Zubov.

Messier told Sather and Muckler at the 1990 deadline that they can last in playoffs with a "kid line" of Graves, Murphy and Gelinas. That line was great in the CF against the Hawks.

He's not my No. 1 choice. He's not my No. 5 choice. But I'll take him over deadbeats like AV, Ruff, Maurice.
 
Leadership qualities that we know Messier has might not be enough. His ability to analyze individuals and situations are positives for coaching, but drawing up plays and execution might not be his cup of tea.

I'd take Messier as an assistant, however, I don't think we're in a state to experiment with a Messier or Gretzky as head coach. We have a good team and with a couple of moves we could very well be contenders. Lundqvist isn't getting any younger and we can't afford to take a risk or experiment with our coaching situation. We need someone established, imo. We need someone established who can take us to the next level for that final push for the Cup.
 
A few ave suggested that fans who wanted Torts gone should feel something akin to shame or embarrassment b/c we didn't "realize Sather would make the next hiring decision." My counter is

Torts lost the locker room and wasn't likely going to get us a cup. it was likely the team was going to worsen and Hank was going to leave therefore annihilating any cup hopes we have.

Firing Torts is independent of whether or not Sather makes a horrific hiring decision. One move had to be m,ade the other does not have to be made.

1. The majority of the "fire torts" crowd was screaming at the top of their lungs for his head long before there were any kinds of hints that there may have been problems in the locker room. Get out of here with the revisionist history.

2. We have no definitive answer for why Torts was fired. It seems likely that at least a few players turned on him based on the speculation that is out there; but that is all it is - speculation. We really don't know anything for sure unless or until more definitive information comes out. So with that in mind, no, I'm not sure that firing Torts was a move that had to be made.

Personally, I don't see a team that fights to make the playoffs and comes back from a 2-0 and then a 3-2 first round series deficit as a team who is tuning Torts out. Does that mean it happened in the Boston series? If so, Torts gets fired/"loses the team" because of a bad playoff series against a team with an arguably better constructed roster? In what universe does that make sense? So I'll just say I'm not completely convinced there was some big move to oust him a la Messier in the early 90s.

But, for the sake of argument; say I'm wrong and there was some discontent. Count me in the camp that would be incredibly unimpressed with whichever player(s) had a big enough beef with him that they felt they needed to move to get rid of him after the team achieved the most success in two successive years that it has in 15 years -- and is one season removed from going to the ECF. If a player can look at that success and decide that it is outweighed by a bastardized season in which:
- The ECF roster was blown up.
- More than half of their forward corps were new faces and had no training camp to get them in shape or teach them the system.
- Their 1C was a ghost of his former self.
- Their 40 goal sniper was invisible.
- Their 1D ends up being out for the season.
- Their captain apparently played through an injury all season.
- The roster was blown up again at the trade deadline.

...and despite all that still decide that the coach was the problem with the team this year - and removing him from the equation was the only possible move; then I seriously question that player(s)' mindset. Unless there was some absolutely god awful thing that happened behind closed doors - which we may never know about - I really find it pretty disturbing that a team could have turned on the coach that quickly and with, based on the limited information we have, such little good reason (at least in my mind). It would be one thing if this were the Tampa Bay Lightning, finishing second to last in the East; or even the Canucks - winning just one playoff game in their last 9. But they weren't.

3. The same goes for your comments about Hank leaving. Not convinced. His comments were possibly troubling, but still pretty ambiguous. But again, all we can do is guess at what happened behind closed doors. If I've missed anything here that is more definitive - please let me know; while I've read a lot of the stuff out there since the end of the season, by no means have I read all of it. Hank is one of the few players for whom I have considered breaking my "no new jerseys" stand (it is in large part meaningless, but a principle I want to stick to nonetheless; since the 04-05 lockout, I decided to limit as much of my own spending that could go to the NHL as possible). But if he was ready to pack it up after one rough season (which, by the way - wasn't even all that bad -- still better than 22 other teams this year in the end), then I've lost some respect for him and question his mental toughness.

4. I didn't want Torts fired, and still think it was a bad decision; but much of this misses the point -- WHO replaces him? And yes, because we all live in the real world, that should include in your thinking who is SATHER likely to pick and who are actually available options? Not, who, in an ideal world, you would like as coach. So no, firing Torts is not independent of who Sather hires or what replacements are available. That is living in fantasy land. If firing Torts meant the team was guaranteed a downgrade at head coach, do you do it? In most cases, I'd assume the answer is no -- unless you literally thought it could get absolutely no worse than Torts (which, really? where were you from 98 to 04?). And before I get people freaking out at me -- yes; that was a false hypothetical, but it was meant to prove a point. You can't make decisions in a vacuum.

This, more than anything, is why I was not a fan of firing him; I do not see any amazing replacement options out there. In the other coaching options I have seen bandied about, the ones that seem most likely for Sather to choose I see as either pretty significant downgrades, or at best, a lateral move (this is obviously my opinion; I'm sure there are plenty who disagree).

I have zero faith in Sather to pick an appropriate coach for this team. And by all accounts, he has no plan and has no clue what he wants in a coach (hilariously, this was one of the few questions he answered in the conference call). If I either thought there were good replacements out there for Torts that Sather would pick OR thought Sather had any sort of plan I would probably not see this as an awful move. I don't think either is the case.

Torts had his issues, but - in my opinion - he was still a good coach who helped this team to achieve some pretty damn good things. Despite the vitriole around Torts being stubborn; I'm not convinced that if given a stable roster (which had maybe a couple tweaks from the one we saw at the end of the season), a training camp, and half of next season to work some things out, that he wouldn't have made some changes that people were calling for, worked to fix some problems, or at the very least - if Sather wanted him to - brought in someone for the PP. He wasn't exactly gumby - there was no way he was going to a run and gun system - but he was more flexible than people give him credit for.


But who knows, maybe Sather shocks me and finds a suitable replacement. We'll just have to wait and see who he goes with and how things turn out.
 
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Once again I don't want Messier as the coach right now, I want someone with experience who can capitalize off the several remaining years of peak that Lundquist has left (IMO the main reason the Rangers have had success in the last few years) The idea in and of itself simply doesn't make me vomit, though!

You are talking quality of matches with a bunch of pyromaniacs here.
 
I've been ignoring this thread but I skimmed through the first page just now.

If we hire a coach based solely on the reason that they deal with the media differently than Torts, I'll ****ing flip out.
 
1. The majority of the "fire torts" crowd was screaming at the top of their lungs for his head long before there were any kinds of hints that there may have been problems in the locker room. Get out of here with the revisionist history.

2. We have no definitive answer for why Torts was fired. It seems likely that at least a few players turned on him based on the speculation that is out there; but that is all it is - speculation. We really don't know anything for sure unless or until more definitive information comes out. So with that in mind, no, I'm not sure that firing Torts was a move that had to be made.

Personally, I don't see a team that fights to make the playoffs and comes back from a 2-0 and then a 3-2 first round series deficit as a team who is tuning Torts out. Does that mean it happened in the Boston series? If so, Torts gets fired/"loses the team" because of a bad playoff series against a team with an arguably better constructed roster? In what universe does that make sense? So I'll just say I'm not completely convinced there was some big move to oust him a la Messier in the early 90s.

But, for the sake of argument; say I'm wrong and there was some discontent. Count me in the camp that would be incredibly unimpressed with whichever player(s) had a big enough beef with him that they felt they needed to move to get rid of him after the team achieved the most success in two successive years that it has in 15 years -- and is one season removed from going to the ECF. If a player can look at that success and decide that it is outweighed by a bastardized season in which:
- The ECF roster was blown up.
- More than half of their forward corps were new faces and had no training camp to get them in shape or teach them the system.
- Their 1C was a ghost of his former self.
- Their 40 goal sniper was invisible.
- Their 1D ends up being out for the season.
- Their captain apparently played through an injury all season.
- The roster was blown up again at the trade deadline.

...and despite all that still decide that the coach was the problem with the team this year - and removing him from the equation was the only possible move; then I seriously question that player(s)' mindset. Unless there was some absolutely god awful thing that happened behind closed doors - which we may never know about - I really find it pretty disturbing that a team could have turned on the coach that quickly and with, based on the limited information we have, such little good reason (at least in my mind). It would be one thing if this were the Tampa Bay Lightning, finishing second to last in the East; or even the Canucks - winning just one playoff game in their last 9. But they weren't.

3. The same goes for your comments about Hank leaving. Not convinced. His comments were possibly troubling, but still pretty ambiguous. But again, all we can do is guess at what happened behind closed doors. If I've missed anything here that is more definitive - please let me know; while I've read a lot of the stuff out there since the end of the season, by no means have I read all of it. Hank is one of the few players for whom I have considered breaking my "no new jerseys" stand (it is in large part meaningless, but a principle I want to stick to nonetheless; since the 04-05 lockout, I decided to limit as much of my own spending that could go to the NHL as possible). But if he was ready to pack it up after one rough season (which, by the way - wasn't even all that bad -- still better than 22 other teams this year in the end), then I've lost some respect for him and question his mental toughness.

4. I didn't want Torts fired, and still think it was a bad decision; but much of this misses the point -- WHO replaces him? And yes, because we all live in the real world, that should include in your thinking who is SATHER likely to pick and who are actually available options? Not, who, in an ideal world, you would like as coach. So no, firing Torts is not independent of who Sather hires or what replacements are available. That is living in fantasy land. If firing Torts meant the team was guaranteed a downgrade at head coach, do you do it? In most cases, I'd assume the answer is no -- unless you literally thought it could get absolutely no worse than Torts (which, really? where were you from 98 to 04?). And before I get people freaking out at me -- yes; that was a false hypothetical, but it was meant to prove a point. You can't make decisions in a vacuum.

This, more than anything, is why I was not a fan of firing him; I do not see any amazing replacement options out there. In the other coaching options I have seen bandied about, the ones that seem most likely for Sather to choose I see as either pretty significant downgrades, or at best, a lateral move (this is obviously my opinion; I'm sure there are plenty who disagree).

I have zero faith in Sather to pick an appropriate coach for this team. And by all accounts, he has no plan and has no clue what he wants in a coach (hilariously, this was one of the few questions he answered in the conference call). If I either thought there were good replacements out there for Torts that Sather would pick OR thought Sather had any sort of plan I would probably not see this as an awful move. I don't think either is the case.

Torts had his issues, but - in my opinion - he was still a good coach who helped this team to achieve some pretty damn good things. Despite the vitriole around Torts being stubborn; I'm not convinced that if given a stable roster (which had maybe a couple tweaks from the one we saw at the end of the season), a training camp, and half of next season to work some things out, that he wouldn't have made some changes that people were calling for, worked to fix some problems, or at the very least - if Sather wanted him to - brought in someone for the PP. He wasn't exactly gumby - there was no way he was going to a run and gun system - but he was more flexible than people give him credit for.


But who knows, maybe Sather shocks me and finds a suitable replacement. We'll just have to wait and see who he goes with and how things turn out.

i'm gonna be honest, you make some really good arguments and almost had me a believer. But when you step back and think about this season i remember torts allowing miller to play through his mistakes while krieder was benched after one mistake.

i remember a guy who disrespected sam rosen, i remember a guy who said his players stink etc... a power play that was a joke and the list goes on ......

when sather says it wasn't for one reason he is being honest..... its for everything torts did.
 
http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/gretzky-messier-interested-in-rangers-job/

interesting take on Messier and Getzky interested in the head coaching job...they also mention Brian Leetch has interest in being an assistant coach.

I wonder if a coaching lineup of Messier, Gretzky, and Leetch would be really good. I feel like it could be.

Had a Good laugh at a comment from the aforementioned article that reads:
I would say it will go to Mess. Wayne every time you see him he is sitting in the stands. Every time is see Mess he is in Sathers box. But all you can see of Mess is the back of his head and he is on his knees.
 
I can't remember too many all-time-greats as players being good coaches. That said, I think Messier might be a good HC with his leadership and motivational qualities, however he'd need a very good and experienced assistant who can draw up the plays and do the "real" coaching.
 
I can't remember too many all-time-greats as players being good coaches. That said, I think Messier might be a good HC with his leadership and motivational qualities, however he'd need a very good and experienced assistant who can draw up the plays and do the "real" coaching.

Bill Watters (aka Wilbur) was on the Power Play with Scott Laughlin on Thursday (I think) on NHL Network Radio on SiriusXM. I don't think I have ever agreed with anything Bill Watters has ever said and same goes for this. His opinion is Messier should not be the coach of the Rangers and that Messier's leadership was always grossly overrated.
 
Bill Watters (aka Wilbur) was on the Power Play with Scott Laughlin on Thursday (I think) on NHL Network Radio on SiriusXM. I don't think I have ever agreed with anything Bill Watters has ever said and same goes for this. His opinion is Messier should not be the coach of the Rangers and that Messier's leadership was always grossly overrated.

I've never heard of this Bill Watters guy, but i've heard many players and Front Office people, many of whom are Hall of Famers, claim otherwise. So ill pass on this overrated speak
 
Most of HF shudders at the thought, but polls show the unwashed masses are in favor of Messier. Really hope they don't get their wish :help:
 
Stop with the Messier BS. He didn't have interest in coaching. He wanted to be GM. Maybe he realizes that path is blocked with Gorton so now he wants to coach. Go coach in the AHL or in the CHL and gain some experience. There are many credible options available for the Rangers. The Rangers can't be looking for a new coach again in the next 12-18 months if Messier bombs out or decides it too much work.
 
The options suck. None of the available coaches are considered commodities. Roy was only going to Colorado.

Vigneualt is massively overrated. he did nothing with Montreal. Nothing in almost 5 seasons.

He goes to a stacked vancouver team, and in four of his five postseasons, his top-seeded team was bounced in the 1st or 2nd round. All those teams were superior in many areas to the teams they lost to.

The one shining moment -- the 2011 playoffs where his team crumbled in the SCF.

What did he do to make Vancouver an elite team? Luongo was an elite goalie. The Sedins were elite talents. His GM went out and got him great pieces.

Sorry, but AV is not the coach to put this team over the top. Neither is Ruff.

Eakins? Only reason why I like him is because he's played in NY (a little) and he coached in a major market (The Marlies get more press than the Devs and Isles combined).

Is he a tactician? Not from an offense standpoint.


My list:

Desjardins
Carbonneau
Weight
Eakins
Mark French
 
im hoping no Messier or Gretzky. Vingneault likely the best optin

wont be upset with Ruff. Eakins is an unknown but all I hear is good things
 
My gut tells me it'll be Vigneualt, which would upset me very much. An improvement on Torts in that he won't absolutely ruin offensive talent, as we saw with the Sedins, but he's still not a good offensive coach.
 
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