Grade Cheveldayoff's offseaon

[Whileee]

Apparently, cap management has not been that great, because it is certainly not FINE now. This situation is not fine. It is barely manageable at best. If the cap indeed goes up a mil each year for a while, that will help a lot. But apart from that, there is no large amount of cap space being freed up for the next 3 years. There is Stastny and Copp previously mentioned, but that money can be seen as already gone, or most of it.

Sure, they may have cap to spend on replacing Copp. My point was the lost opportunity to retain him. And will we be able to get as good with the cap space we have?

The stable of young forwards is already fully committed for the next few years. Harkins takes Perreault's spot. Vesalainen takes Appleton's spot. Gustafsson takes Thompson's spot. In another year Perfetti takes Stastny's spot. There is no plan B if any of those don't pan out. There is no replacement for Copp in there and the replacement for Wheeler is a little further away.

There is the possibility that Heinola and/or Samberg eventually push their ways into the lineup and we trade 1 or more of Dillon/Schmidt/DeMelo. That would ease the cap squeeze. That could happen as soon as next year, but not likely this year.

I'm not trying to paint this as some kind of terrible disaster. I only changed my vote fro A to B, not from A to F. But it is a difficult situation that has already cost us elsewhere and if either of Heinola or Samberg is ready, then it was unnecessary. That's all.

We disagree. Cheers.

 

[10Ducky10]

That is entirely beside my point. He could win the Norris and still have been more than we needed and more than we could afford.

It isn't about how good he will be for us and neither is it about how much money would be fair for him. It is about us being cap squeezed and having had prospects with the Moose who should be able to fill the spot.

If we're going into the playoffs, I want the D man that has 68 games under his belt.

 

[garret9]

I'm not sure how I'd grade Chevy's offseason, because it depends on how you account for the past and also how you grade market vs impact.

Just a random example:
Stastny was paid more than historically a player of his contributions, age, and history would get paid on the market.
Stastny is still paid less than I believe his true impact on the ice is (but that could sink fast given age) and less than some alternatives that are worse.
So how do you grade that?
That's going to be subjective.

Another example:
I think Dillon and Schmidt are the right type of moves, but would they have been necessary if Jets did smarter moves for cheaper, younger defenders that were available previously?
Hard to say.

Either way I think I agree with the direction Chevy took the team. Whether or not it'll work out or been the best possible options remain to be seen.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

You’re getting too fixated on the cap I think - Jets have a roster and it’s to cap max - every team has to make sacrifices in the flat cap world...

There’s really only one too six spot up for grabs in the next 3 years unless Wheeler really drops off then there’s two... I’m sure perfetti will get slotted into top six next year

that leaves an extra $2.75m from state expiring contract and another $1m in cap increase

this should be enough to sign PLD long-term and to re-sign or replace Copp... or harkins replaces Copp and we sign a better backup goalie

what’s the panic about

As I pointed out in another post. No panic at all. I changed from an A to a B, not from an A to an F.

Chevy has a problem, whether you like to acknowledge it or not. He created the problem himself. I question the necessity for creating it.

The problem is not massive. It is not beyond solution. But it exists.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

If we're going into the playoffs, I want the D man that has 68 games under his belt.

That's fine. Apparently Chevy does too. But there is no denying that we are cap squeezed.

 

[LowLefty]

That's fine. Apparently Chevy does too. But there is no denying that we are cap squeezed.

We also have a good team and that's what happens when you fill out the lineup the they have in a cap environment.
Is it perfect? No - but much better than it was and well balanced for the most part.
I have no major issues with where this leaves us - very much looking forward to the upcoming season.
We'll see how well Chevy has done - I'm optimistic

 

[surixon]

Welcome to being a team that expects to contend. Being cap strapped with the question marks being at the bottom of the depth charts.

I certainly am happy to go into this year with some question marks at the fourth line and with our backup. It certainly beats the major defensive question marks or years past.

 

[ps241]

I'm not sure how I'd grade Chevy's offseason, because it depends on how you account for the past and also how you grade market vs impact.

Just a random example:
Stastny was paid more than historically a player of his contributions, age, and history would get paid on the market.
Stastny is still paid less than I believe his true impact on the ice is (but that could sink fast given age) and less than some alternatives that are worse.
So how do you grade that?
That's going to be subjective.

Another example:
I think Dillon and Schmidt are the right type of moves, but would they have been necessary if Jets did smarter moves for cheaper, younger defenders that were available previously?
Hard to say.

Either way I think I agree with the direction Chevy took the team. Whether or not it'll work out or been the best possible options remain to be seen.

There is also the degree of difficulty Kevin faces because of the market. I can’t speak to our friction but I do remember being on a golf junket with a highest level executive from another team in a “desirable” market and he admitted to me they get a great look at all the top free agents and often they don’t have to initiate because agents reach out to them first to try to shop their players.

That is a different world from Winnipeg.

 

[ps241]

Welcome to being a team that expects to contend. Being cap strapped with the question marks being at the bottom of the depth charts.

I certainly am happy to go into this year with some question marks at the fourth line and with our backup. It certainly beats the major defensive question marks or years past.

Every team except Tampa the last few seasons has holes and question marks.

 

[WolfHouse]

Every team except Tampa the last few seasons has holes and question marks.

I would say that 36 year old Brian Elliot is a huge question mark as backup...

 

[WolfHouse]

Last year McElhinney had a .875 sv pcg for Tampa as their backup...,

 

[10Ducky10]

Chevy has given Maurice enough tools now it is up to Maurice.
We have a favorable October and start November with a 7 game homestand...lots of opportunity to start the season off very strong.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

We also have a good team and that's what happens when you fill out the lineup the they have in a cap environment.
Is it perfect? No - but much better than it was and well balanced for the most part.
I have no major issues with where this leaves us - very much looking forward to the upcoming season.
We'll see how well Chevy has done - I'm optimistic

I agree with this. But how would we look without Schmidt and with another 5 mil in cap space - most of it hopefully well spent elsewhere?

We certainly look a lot better than last year, even after having to give up a player to Seattle. No denying that.

 

[surixon]

I agree with this. But how would we look without Schmidt and with another 5 mil in cap space - most of it hopefully well spent elsewhere?

We certainly look a lot better than last year, even after having to give up a player to Seattle. No denying that.

Where else could it have been better spent?

I guess back up but I'm of the opinion when you have a big minute munching elite goalie it is a poor use of funds to bring in more then a league minimum guy to play not even a 1/4 of the season.

Our top 6 is full so where does that leave us? Fleshing out the bottom 6 is really the only other spot, but once again spending big money on fourth liners (really all we need now) is also a poor use of funds.

Spending $5 million to solidify the top 4 is probably the best use of available cap space for us.

We should have more then enough developed players to fill the 3 open bottom of the line forward spots on this team and if not you can always waive a Harkins and pick up.a fourth liner on waivers.

 

[Jets 31]

It kills me how some on here think we would be better off with Heinola and i guess Samburg starting next season instead of Dillon and Schmidt . Yes we would have more cap room but what if both weren't ready to start 82 games, could get ugly real fast. Just because they are young doesn't mean they are ready and if you throw them in too fast you can ruin the players development. After watching our defense last season how could anyone not be happy so far with what Chevy has done.

 

[ps241]

I would say that 36 year old Brian Elliot is a huge question mark as backup...

Last year McElhinney had a .875 sv pcg for Tampa as their backup...,

McElhinney’s three previous seasons were .906, .912, and .924 and he has historically been a very reliable back up. Perhaps his age is finally catching up to him. I can’t speak to how the Lightning look this Season as I haven’t had a good look yet. I know they lost some very high quality depth pieces.

 

[Jets 31]

McElhinney’s three previous seasons were .906, .912, and .924 and he has historically been a very reliable back up. Perhaps his age is finally catching up to him. I can’t speak to how the Lightning look this Season as I haven’t had a good look yet. I know they lost some very high quality depth pieces.

I wonder if Pavelec is busy.

 

[Shazzam]

I agree with this. But how would we look without Schmidt and with another 5 mil in cap space - most of it hopefully well spent elsewhere?

We certainly look a lot better than last year, even after having to give up a player to Seattle. No denying that.

I get what you're saying. But I don’t buy into your assumption that just getting Dillon was good enough and we didn't need to do more. Presumably moving up Heinola and/or Samburg.
Our defense was so bad last year, just adding one new guy and hoping the youngsters do well doesn’t cut it imo.
We might get a little cap relief if we waive or trade Booboo.
I feel like we needed to get two proven D and still have Heinola and Samburg to integrate slowly into the NHL. Yes I know Schmidt had an off year, but has had a pretty good career otherwise.
I think Chevy did what he had to, to improve this team and not waste anymore years of our not as young anymore core and go all in.

 

[DRW204]

Nearly every team in the league is gonna have weaknesses or holes. it's a cap league, you have limited amount of money to spend, and/or need highly productive players on cheap ELC to get that cap efficiency. there's like what 2-3 teams in the nhl that are perfect top-to-bottom? if that?

Jets 17-18 were close to perfect. BUT you had Ehlers, Connor, Laine, Morrissey on ELC, and Trouba & Helle on cheap deals. those guys alone merely a few years later cost like 40M combined when altogether they were like under 10M in 17-18.

I don't love Comrie as the back-up goalie given helle's cumulative worlkload and how often he falters in the POs (this past year he was great, but lesser in-year workload). but if there was a weakness on the roster id rather have it a back-up goalie than the top9 fwd or top6 D. back-up goalie wont be starting in the POs so it's whatever. but like i said, id like to see Helle in the 50-60 game range, but c'est la vie.

 

[Whileee]

I get what you're saying. But I don’t buy into your assumption that just getting Dillon was good enough and we didn't need to do more. Presumably moving up Heinola and/or Samburg.
Our defense was so bad last year, just adding one new guy and hoping the youngsters do well doesn’t cut it imo.
We might get a little cap relief if we waive or trade Booboo.
I feel like we needed to get two proven D and still have Heinola and Samburg to integrate slowly into the NHL. Yes I know Schmidt had an off year, but has had a pretty good career otherwise.
I think Chevy did what he had to, to improve this team and not waste anymore years of our not as young anymore core and go all in.

I agree with this. The Jets really needed a strong partner for Morrissey. DeMelo might have been okay, but then the Jets would have had no depth at RD. So I think the Schmidt acquisition gives the Jets a lot of quality, depth and flexibility on RD, which they have been lacking.

Also, Pionk really needed a major upgrade on his left side. He carried Forbort around as the season progressed, and they were buried by opponents in the playoffs. I had hoped that the Jets would have tried Samberg (or maybe Heinola) at LD with Pionk last season, but since they didn't do that, the Jets really needed to acquire a proven LD for Pionk. Dillon is exactly the type they needed, and a Dillon-Pionk pair would be a very respectable top pair. Now, the Jets have two pairs that could be respectable top pair, and their 3rd pair with DeMelo could be an advantage over most teams (with a mix of Stanley, Heinola and maybe Samberg on LD). I expect heavy competition for the 3 LD position, and although Stanley has the inside track, it's very possible that he'll hit rough patches or match-ups that are better suited for Heinola and/or Samberg. So, I expect that 3 LD to have some rotation of the young LD, and with the likelihood that there will be injuries, other configurations.

The fly in the ointment is Beaulieu, and the high risk that Maurice leans on him as a prominent 3 LD option. I think that would be unwise both in the short term and the medium to longer term (because of development and assessment needs for the young LD in the system). That's not so much a Chevy problem, because Chevy signed Beaulieu for 3 years as a hedge for the expansion draft. It's up to Maurice and the coaching staff to lean more on the youth on LD.

 

[WolfHouse]

All teams are in tough with the flat cap... Philly just walked Sanheim straight to UFA

 

[Whileee]

All teams are in tough with the flat cap... Philly just walked Sanheim straight to UFA

Absolutely. The Jets have actually managed the flat cap quite well, all things considered.

 

[BoneDocUK]

I get what you're saying. But I don’t buy into your assumption that just getting Dillon was good enough and we didn't need to do more. Presumably moving up Heinola and/or Samburg.
Our defense was so bad last year, just adding one new guy and hoping the youngsters do well doesn’t cut it imo.
We might get a little cap relief if we waive or trade Booboo.
I feel like we needed to get two proven D and still have Heinola and Samburg to integrate slowly into the NHL. Yes I know Schmidt had an off year, but has had a pretty good career otherwise.
I think Chevy did what he had to, to improve this team and not waste anymore years of our not as young anymore core and go all in.

Good points here. I think Beaulieu needs to be waived, full-stop. We need the space, and we have players in Heinola, Kovacevic and Samberg who are going to need the reps. Chevy has given Maurice something very close to the team he has wanted for a while now -- now it's time to cut bait at the margins and make room for the next wave, IMO.

 

[scelaton]

Apparently, cap management has not been that great, because it is certainly not FINE now. This situation is not fine. It is barely manageable at best........

I'm not trying to paint this as some kind of terrible disaster. I only changed my vote fro A to B, not from A to F. But it is a difficult situation that has already cost us elsewhere and if either of Heinola or Samberg is ready, then it was unnecessary. That's all.

You are entitled to grade Chevy any way you want, but I would describe you as a very, very tough marker--the kind that makes the best students shake their heads in exasperation.

Chevy has been that kind of student this off-season. The biggest priority for management--clearly articulated by them-- was finding an optimal RHD partner for Morrissey and he did that. That alone is worth high marks, keeping in mind the frothy market for high-end D. Schmidt is making <$6M per year, is ~35th in cap league-wide and will fall further as early as next season when players like Pullock get new deals. (Dillon is 89th in D-cap, btw, and he and Pionk have top pair potential for the next 3+ years)

The bar for an A grade is not perfection, but rather high achievement at the ~ 80th percentile. It leaves plenty of room for mistakes so long is the overall effort is excellent. For example, I stated previously that I thought Stastny was overpaid by up to $1M relative to his peer group. I still believe that in a vacuum, but that is a minor factor in the overall scheme of things, especially now that we see the role he had in securing Schmidt.

Similarly, the backup goalie situation is a minor problem, easily rectified if Comrie doesn't work out. It doesn't change the overall quality of his performance, because the bar is not--is never--perfection.

Finally, I wouldn't grade Chevy's cap management on what might happen next year, but rather what has happened this off-season. It's a minor miracle that he has retained all his top talent and prospects, and transformed the D from a liability to a strength.

To end as I began, grade Chevy any way you want. All I can say is that I'm glad you weren't my high school home-room teacher!

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Where else could it have been better spent?

I guess back up but I'm of the opinion when you have a big minute munching elite goalie it is a poor use of funds to bring in more then a league minimum guy to play not even a 1/4 of the season.

Our top 6 is full so where does that leave us? Fleshing out the bottom 6 is really the only other spot, but once again spending big money on fourth liners (really all we need now) is also a poor use of funds.

Spending $5 million to solidify the top 4 is probably the best use of available cap space for us.

We should have more then enough developed players to fill the 3 open bottom of the line forward spots on this team and if not you can always waive a Harkins and pick up.a fourth liner on waivers.

Backup is my first thought. You may have a point about allocation of resources but I think that if you really want to contend you need 2 goalies. Your "minute munching" starter needs more rest than he wants. Goalies always want to play every game, but they play better with some rest. Then there is the risk of your starter being injured.

Fleshing out the bottom 6 is next on the list. IDK how you can say that all we need is 4th liners. Having kept Copp for 1 more year still leaves us needing a 3RW. Everyone is just assuming that Vesalainen is ready for that but he is entirely unproven and a natural LW.

We aren't going to get better than Harkins on waivers, even if he disappoints a bit.

Finally, a mil or two of breathing space will almost certainly be needed through the season. I can see how we get to our roster for the 1st game, but IDK what we are going to do when injuries hit.