Agent Zuuuub
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And considering he works for the cheapest owner in the NHL it's sorta hilarious
Management GM Pierre Dorion/Front Office Thread - Part VIII
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And considering he works for the cheapest owner in the NHL it's sorta hilarious
Wallet Inspector
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cudi
Mojo So Dope
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just cuz you can doesnt mean you should. I wouldn't want half my dcore being rookies.
we spent millions of dollars on MDZ, Murray, White and Tierney on the roster
Melnyk is cheap for sure but he has been willing to spend . This is on management
AchtzehnBaby
Global Matador
“Willing to spend” how? We are last in spending every single year.
we are rebuilding so its understandable
We just blew millions on the above mentioned players. I hope we have a new management staff making the next signing or trade
There are lots of teams rebuilding, we are last over and over again for a reason. Some of Dorion’s moves are just flat out bad like Murray, but the constant one or two years on mediocre players is a budget issue, it’s pretty obvious. Getting better players requires you to pay more money. Will Melnyk pay when we’re contending? Maybe, who knows. But he’s certainly trying to cut costs at the moment, as he has been doing for years.
Big Muddy
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Buffalo has the lowest cap hit. We have the 2nd lowest.
CapFriendly - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps
The year before it was the NJ Devils & Ottawa as the runner up.
NHL 2020 Cap Tracker
But yes, Melnyk's Senators are a budget/low salary team for sure.
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Big Muddy
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OK. If you can find stats based on salary, then post them. I just found what I could find and shared. Happy to view any other stats that are provided though.
As an aside, and just because I'm curious, would players on LTIR that have insurance be reflected in the "salary" stats? Its just something I wondered about.
The link below is all I found (so far). This was for the 2020-21 season and the Ottawa Senators were 2nd lowest as far as salaries.
CapFriendly: Real-dollars salary expenditure has Canucks 21st in NHL | The Province
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It’s on the second link you posted, just switch to team cash payroll.
That article was prior to the season ending so who knows where they all ended up. Point is, Melnyk isn’t spending. I suspect this will change within the next two years with a lot of our players needing contracts, but that’s why I’m also not sure we’re going to be able to add anything of substance.
IR gets included but we only actually pay 20% in those cases I believe so our spending is less. This year’s figures aren’t totally accurate though because Murray + MDZ don’t show up so you can add another 7 mil or so.
Big Muddy
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Thanks for sharing.
Looks like that article from The Province doesn't align with Spotrac, not that its overly important. I generally use CapFriendly and haven't poked around much on Spotrac, but it is interesting they have the cash payroll feature.
Yes Melnyk not spending is not a surprise. I actually didn't think he would spend more given COVID at least for a couple of years (doesn't look like we are out of the woods with COVID even at this point). I don't hold my breath waiting for Melnyk to spend money. Ottawa isn't going to spend their way out of problems, so that's why wasteful or dead cap is a big/bigger problem for a team like the Senators.
BUT the team is near the bottom of the league for salary dollars at this time, so the team is not spending at a competitive level.
definitly need to spend more but that will happen as we sign our guys. We could easily be much more competitive if Dorion spent money on actual talent
Stylizer1
Teflon Don
I think they took a gamble on Murray and at the time Ottawa was being praised for it, with some amount of risk to it but many thought it was justified. Something is going on with Murray between the ears this year, not wanting to play the opener this year, no one saw this fall coming and at the end of last year he looked good again.
Mdz ya that was horrid as well as most of the trades last year for roll players. They aren't getting Chris Niel in any of these guys cause the players are not invested in Ottawa at all and just want money. I don't think they get that with their acquisitions.
White was hyped up since drafted, I didn't see why but people love him. He's not playing so no one knows what he is but is getting paid like he's established, for white it was right place right time I don't fault them.
I don't think with the state of the team is in at the moment will help getting anyone better to come in until the team starts winning with what they have. Injuries to white and pinto really hurt the team badly for attracting next year's free agents.
I also think most of the young guys are solid so it will get there soon enough. The guys they draft are fighters who don't give up so I don't think you will end up in a buffalo or Edmonton cycle but to be fair it's getting close.
I still am glad I picked the sens as the team that I root for. I would rather be here now then a bubble team every year. I like drafting good players that are needed for the final push for the cup. It's just painful ATM.
Mdz ya that was horrid as well as most of the trades last year for roll players. They aren't getting Chris Niel in any of these guys cause the players are not invested in Ottawa at all and just want money. I don't think they get that with their acquisitions.
White was hyped up since drafted, I didn't see why but people love him. He's not playing so no one knows what he is but is getting paid like he's established, for white it was right place right time I don't fault them.
I don't think with the state of the team is in at the moment will help getting anyone better to come in until the team starts winning with what they have. Injuries to white and pinto really hurt the team badly for attracting next year's free agents.
I also think most of the young guys are solid so it will get there soon enough. The guys they draft are fighters who don't give up so I don't think you will end up in a buffalo or Edmonton cycle but to be fair it's getting close.
I still am glad I picked the sens as the team that I root for. I would rather be here now then a bubble team every year. I like drafting good players that are needed for the final push for the cup. It's just painful ATM.
Stylizer1
Teflon Don
DrSense
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Just curious and legit question, but what free agents or spending did fans want to see? What massive long-term deals should we have been competing on?
I'm sort of in the camp that we've tried to spend a bit of money, but it hasn't worked out very well. We've also traded assets for players in their 20's and signed them to long-term deals (Murray). Frankly, our decisions on acquiring and spending on veterans haven't worked out great, so spending MORE $ on free agents...is that what people really want? If we do that, we will have less money and cap space to resign guys like Norris, Stutzle, Zub and ultimately Sanderson. Does that really make sense right now with this team?
Shouldn't we be keeping our powder dry and use it to lock up the Tkachuk's, Chabot's and Batheron's like we have? Is spending on free agents really the thing missing for this team? I don't see it.
In the end, trying to speed up a rebuild with massive contract signings typically just shortens the window and creates cap issues sooner rather than later. And we've been a cap team many times before, but we were legit contenders. I'm still in the camp of being patient, although it's certainly reasonable to be critical of where we have spent $'s.
I'm sort of in the camp that we've tried to spend a bit of money, but it hasn't worked out very well. We've also traded assets for players in their 20's and signed them to long-term deals (Murray). Frankly, our decisions on acquiring and spending on veterans haven't worked out great, so spending MORE $ on free agents...is that what people really want? If we do that, we will have less money and cap space to resign guys like Norris, Stutzle, Zub and ultimately Sanderson. Does that really make sense right now with this team?
Shouldn't we be keeping our powder dry and use it to lock up the Tkachuk's, Chabot's and Batheron's like we have? Is spending on free agents really the thing missing for this team? I don't see it.
In the end, trying to speed up a rebuild with massive contract signings typically just shortens the window and creates cap issues sooner rather than later. And we've been a cap team many times before, but we were legit contenders. I'm still in the camp of being patient, although it's certainly reasonable to be critical of where we have spent $'s.
Beech
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A line I heard on radio was (and this was a texter who wrote in after on of the losses in December); You cannot draft all 22 players. There was a time, I would have vehemently argued against that, now I see it his way.
A delicate balance between the 3 main components of player acquisition is needed. The balance does not mean equal. It means proper components of each.
So of your 3 top forward lines (9 players), top 2 pairs of Dmen and #1 goalie. You are at 14 players. It would stand to reason that the bulk must be your drafts. So say 1/2 to 3/4. Meaning 7-10 are your picks. The other 4-7 must be trades and free agents. 2-3 of one, 2-4 of the other.
Any attempt at getting all 14 via the draft, would mean that your are constantly chasing your tail. It is virtually impossible for your draft to yield 14 quality players in a 5-6 year period. Especially when you took this thing down to the wood. An amazing draft will yield 1 or 2 quality players a year. So at 1.5 players per year in 6 years you are at 9 total. You need another 5..Basic math.
At some point, this team needs to focus on the pro side of their team building. They need to get that group of 4-7 trades/free agents.
Saving their money to pay the 7-10 players they drafted/developed is wonderful. But it will mean a top heavy team with the remaining 4-7 guys not up to standard. And the window you speak of. In today's sports scene, it is naturally short. Free agency is at 7 years of service or age 27. And 32 teams with players from the hockey world as a whole, they are all mercenaries. You have 5-7 years max. The Sens may have burnt 1-2 already. You are down to 3-5. Waiting for Sanderson, JBD, et all will mean Chabot will be burnt, or gone by the time those pieces arrive/mature.
I hope that McGuire is here to focus in on the 4-7 outside players.
SPF6ty9
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From this fan's perspective, would rather that money be spent on competent management, more scouting, basically increase the hockey ops budget. Do the little things that will help players develop, help us find better players, and make us a model organization players would want to come to.
That sounds like money much better spent than throwing away a few million on the Del Zottos, Gudbransons, Josh Browns, and Matt Murrays of the world. In fact, by spending a few million extra per year on hockey ops, I would hope that would reduce or eliminate the dumb signings like those.
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