Management GM Pierre Dorion/Front Office Thread - Part VIII

[PlayersLtd]

Nobody would or should ever tell you that Dorion has been a complete failure. He can still be a bad G.M who has done some great things like certain draft picks, signing Chabot and Batherson to great deals, etc.

It is about the moves he is making that are hurting the team moving forward that make us question whether or not he is capable of taking the next step and going from re-build to contender.

Fair to question his ability to build a winner moving forward but what has been more critical up to now...

That A/ he properly dismantled the team and built it back up very well through the draft,
or B/ That he whiffed on a few stop gap vets?

I'd say A is more worthy of dwelling on and those points seem to sum up the two sides that surround the Dorion debate around here. Glass half full people vs. glass half empty people I guess.

 

[HSF]

Fair to question his ability to build a winner moving forward but what has been more critical up to now...

That A/ he properly dismantled the team and built it back up very well through the draft,
or B/ That he whiffed on a few stop gap vets?

I'd say A is more worthy of dwelling on and those points seem to sum up the two sides that surround the Dorion debate around here. Glass half full people vs. glass half empty people I guess.

i think most people agree that he drafted well and collected some good young player (though he did start with some all star level players). I think now its time to move on from Dorion and bring in someone who can add some peices through trade or free agency. Bring in a vet GM who guys want to sign with or play for someone who has a bit more experience would really help imo

It not uncommon for teams to have a guy build aspects of a team and move on to someone else to build other parts of the team up. Its just business and Dorion has got paid for his services

 

[TheDebater]

I am actually happy for Dorion that he got that extension because I think he had to work really hard under Melnyk, and if he were to go unsigned this year, he was probably never getting another GM gig again.

If he gets fired, at least he gets fired a little richer.

 

[Alex1234]

Dumbass spends roughly 10M$ / year on non-roster crap players

Add 2-3 M$ and you have Mark Stone in the line up

 

[Ice-Tray]

he signed his own RFAs?

Is this how low the bar is set for Dorion?

Jim Benning should get the GM of the year award for signing Hughes and Petersson !

Lol here we go again.

The fans in here bitch a moan and clutch their handbags super worried that we’re not going to be able to sign out RFAs, UFAs, college players, etc…

Then when we do you try and brush it off like it’s no big deal?

Come now.

And the Petterson deal was terrible.

 

[TheDebater]

Lol here we go again.

The fans in here bitch a moan and clutch their handbags super worried that we’re not going to be able to sign out RFAs, UFAs, college players, etc…

Then when we do you try and brush it off like it’s no big deal?

Come now.

And the Petterson deal was terrible.

I assume the concern from many of us with regards to not being able to sign our RFA'S and UFA'S is due to our owner's reputation of being cash strapped and has nothing to do with the G.M Dorion.

It is only a concern in Ottawa when it comes to signing players, so the G.M of a team being able to do it is not supposed to be regarded as one of their great achievements. In Ottawa however, signing an RFA to a great deal is an achievement, and Dorion received a ton of praise for Chabot, Batherson (especially), and even the Tkachuk contract (nobody actually blamed Dorion for the "overpayment", we knew the situation) was applauded for being long term.

So again, Dorion doing regular GM things is not a major achievement and does not or should not give him any mulligans when it comes to the brain dead moves that even fans at the time realize were bad....I mean come on go back and read the threads on MDZ, the Murray extension, and even the Duclair thread when he was released.

 

[AchtzehnBaby]

I assume the concern from many of us with regards to not being able to sign our RFA'S and UFA'S is due to our owner's reputation of being cash strapped and has nothing to do with the G.M Dorion.

It is only a concern in Ottawa when it comes to signing players, so the G.M of a team being able to do it is not supposed to be regarded as one of their great achievements. In Ottawa however, signing an RFA to a great deal is an achievement, and Dorion received a ton of praise for Chabot, Batherson (especially), and even the Tkachuk contract (nobody actually blamed Dorion for the "overpayment", we knew the situation) was applauded for being long term.

So again, Dorion doing regular GM things is not a major achievement and does not or should not give him any mulligans when it comes to the brain dead moves that even fans at the time realize were bad....I mean come on go back and read the threads on MDZ, the Murray extension, and even the Duclair thread when he was released.

We can do the same with the Brady pick thread too, no?

 

[PlayOn]

We can do the same with the Brady pick thread too, no?

We can do it with a plethora of threads. The fanbase is often very right and they are very wrong just as often.

 

[HSF]

Are we holding a professional NHL management team to the same standard to that of fans on a hockey board who aren't doing this full time?

Some of you are taking this way to personally. If a GM and his staff continually can't get the job done and waste millions of dollars on the wrong player then it is time to move on.

Signing RFAs while an accomplishment is a standard part of the job . Actually building a competitive team is hard and requires the right person. I thought it was also good getting Dadanov and the move to get rid of him was good as well but I am not being paid to make these moves nor do I have to pay for the team not doing well.

I think most people agree that Dorion has done a good job draft but I think it will take a different mind and management team to get us to the next level.

 

[TheDebater]

We can do the same with the Brady pick thread too, no?

Again, the RFA signings and drafting are the two biggest praises Dorion gets, so you can use the Brady pick as "miss" by fans, but then you would also be able to add Thomson, Pinto and who knows maybe Boucher to that list too.

You will not find many Sens fans who do not give credit to Dorion's drafting, some will say it is all Mann, but regardless the G.M is the one who will be remembered.

 

[PlayOn]

Are we holding a professional NHL management team to the same standard to that of fans on a hockey board who aren't doing this full time?

Some of you are taking this way to personally. If a GM and his staff continually can't get the job done and waste millions of dollars on the wrong player then it is time to move on.

Signing RFAs while an accomplishment is a standard part of the job . Actually building a competitive team is hard and requires the right person. I thought it was also good getting Dadanov and the move to get rid of him was good as well but I am not being paid to make these moves nor do I have to pay for the team not doing well.

I think most people agree that Dorion has done a good job draft but I think it will take a different mind and management team to get us to the next level.

I don’t like Dorion and I would also prefer to replace him, I just think a lot of the moves he gets criticized for are budget problems, not Dorion problems. We spend $10 million less than the 31st lowest spending team in the NHL, we are quite literally getting what we pay for. MDZ is a product of searching for “bargains” and trying to pigeon them into roles they can’t live up to because you can’t afford a better player.

Now the Murray deal he deserves total flack on. But a new GM can’t outperform 31 other teams spending like this. Bottom 10-15 in spending I can buy, but until Melnyk is gone we’ll have the same complaints about the next guy imo.

 

[supsens]

I don’t think he should be replaced yet. This guy is building an absolute fantastic looking team.
Being stuck with Murray for 1 year while the team finally starts to compete is fine, it’s not great but at least it isn’t a seven year disaster that teams like Edmonton and Calgary walked into.
They move Jimmy back to the wing with Pinto and the top two lines should be set for the next few years.

 

[Alex1234]

The Murray acquisition is a disaster and Dumbass should be blame for it

 

[Butchy Dakkar]

I don’t think he should be replaced yet. This guy is building an absolute fantastic looking team.
Being stuck with Murray for 1 year while the team finally starts to compete is fine, it’s not great but at least it isn’t a seven year disaster that teams like Edmonton and Calgary walked into.
They move Jimmy back to the wing with Pinto and the top two lines should be set for the next few years.

Say what??? Um, no thanks…

 

[supsens]

Say what??? Um, no thanks…

Why? He does not need to be there if pinto is good enough to be a second line center. Jimmy is capable of playing wing Pinto I am not so sure.
They need a good solid second line picking who plays where over some insecure need to prop jimmy up is pointless.
Alfy Hossa the Drake all did/do a lot of damage from the wing. They need a second line if they are going to compete.

 

[Butchy Dakkar]

Why? He does not need to be there if pinto is good enough to be a second line center. Jimmy is capable of playing wing Pinto I am not so sure.
They need a good solid second line picking who plays where over some insecure need to prop jimmy up is pointless.
Alfy Hossa the Drake all did/do a lot of damage from the wing. They need a second line if they are going to compete.

Stü is our most skilled player and will hopefully be a massive part of our future. Almost has to be if we are going to contend. His skill set is most suited to the middle (IMHO). I think he will be our best C in a few years. Anyway, just my opinion.

 

[supsens]

Stü is our most skilled player and will hopefully be a massive part of our future. Almost has to be if we are going to contend. His skill set is most suited to the middle (IMHO). I think he will be our best C in a few years. Anyway, just my opinion.

I hope he is the best player soon but they are still going to need a second line, that top line has brought it to another level there is no reason to mess with that unless they have to.
Who knows maybe they move Pinto to wing but finding two second line wingers is a big step back and a long road. For cap reasons the window will be short. Pinto might never be good enough for a second line and that would suck, but if he is it’s a huge bonus and the team would be a powerhouse.
Allowing Jimmy to run wild and not have to worry about defending might also be a good plan

 

[Butchy Dakkar]

I hope he is the best player soon but they are still going to need a second line, that top line has brought it to another level there is no reason to mess with that unless they have to.
Who knows maybe they move Pinto to wing but finding two second line wingers is a big step back and a long road. For cap reasons the window will be short. Pinto might never be good enough for a second line and that would suck, but if he is it’s a huge bonus and the team would be a powerhouse.
Allowing Jimmy to run wild and not have to worry about defending might also be a good plan

Haha…. Who would have thought we might have to figure out what to do with too many good top 6 C’s. I guess if we get there it will be a great problem, although you’re right, the challenge might be wingers. For now I’m enjoying watching Stü at C, and the commentators seem to talk up how effective he has been since the change as well.

 

[TheDebater]

I hope he is the best player soon but they are still going to need a second line, that top line has brought it to another level there is no reason to mess with that unless they have to.
Who knows maybe they move Pinto to wing but finding two second line wingers is a big step back and a long road. For cap reasons the window will be short. Pinto might never be good enough for a second line and that would suck, but if he is it’s a huge bonus and the team would be a powerhouse.
Allowing Jimmy to run wild and not have to worry about defending might also be a good plan

I have no problem with Pinto being the best 3rd line center in the league. He is still young, why the rush to make him our #2 center when Stützle is proving to be more than capable and looking damn good doing it too.

Much easier to sign/trade for or promote a couple of wingers to play with him than it is trying to trade for an elite centre man.

 

[Alf Silfversson]

Oops

 

[Burrowsaurus]

Yo what happened to @formentonforthefuture

 

[AchtzehnBaby]

Yo what happened to @formentonforthefuture

Changed his name?

 

[Alf Silfversson]

Yo what happened to @formentonforthefuture

Handling multiple accounts became too much for him?

 

[Emerica]

Yo what happened to @formentonforthefuture

Yeah we miss him so much

 

[ksens]

That A/ he properly dismantled the team and built it back up very well through the draft,

He hasn't built anything back up. When the team is making the playoffs and contending then we can talk about how the "rebuild" has been successful. In the meantime we've got a bad team with some potential that Dorion drafted, and nothing more.