Management GM Pierre Dorion/Front Office Thread - Part IX [Mod Warning in post 1)

[Sens Vader]

We all have our particular tastes in movies I guess

All right man we’ve had a nice protracted back and forth. It’s been fun but let’s call it a day. We agree to disagree here, and we’re just running in circles.

Cheers!

yeah we have haha

Go Sens Go baby!!

 

[Ice-Tray]

yeah we have haha

Go Sens Go baby!!

I hear that man, can’t wait for the draft…. 3 long months lol

 

[AchtzehnBaby]

But here’s the thing, he doesn’t have ‘horrible communication skills’ that’s your personal opinion, and I consider it a pretty large exaggeration. I would hazard a guess that no one in the media that covers the NHL, nor any of the bloggers, not to mention the general fanbase, hold this opinion of the man.

It’s not his forté, and he is prone to making statements in his excitement that he regrets later, but he does a fine job in communicating the direction of the team, and the finer points of his job.

No, how he acts in front of the camera; or in front of a group does not indicate how he is in one on one more private or business interactions. That is a ridiculous statement. In general, people feel and behave differently in more stressful situations.

Lots of people in here have been showing up throughout this rebuild, they talk about it all the time. Those that haven’t bothered through this rebuild only have themselves to blame. You want to be wooed, and I think the organization should ignore you and focus on fans who are excited about this young team and are looking forward to seeing them play in September. I think the GM should stick to his plan and build a winning team, because that’s the best way for him to fill the stands.

Any fan who isn’t going to games because they don’t like the GM has their own issues going on, and shouldn’t be a focus for team marketing, ever. I just heard today that the passing of EM hasn’t even changed anything, so we know the goalposts have already shifted for those folks, and the GM is next in the cross hairs.

Petty superficial complaints should be ignored not catered to. The team on the ice will dictate the successes and failures of the GM, and will be the ultimate determining factor of attendance in the Ottawa market.

A-f***ing-men, brother.

 

[coladin]

They bombed their drafts of Lias Anderson and Kratztov, Kappo has 16 total goals the last 2 seasons and had 7 goals this year. And they probably didn’t even get a top 5 player of that draft picking Lafraneiere so don’t know what you’re talking about with this winning draft thing.

Not smart analysis but you spelled everything correctly

Rangers had Panarin and Adam Fox walk on to their roster during their rebuild. No biggie there either I guess?

 

[FunkySeeFunkyDoo]

PD is not a sales rep. He is the general manager of an NHL hockey team. His primary job is to build a winning team on the ice, not market the team to you. ...

His primary job is to be the leader of a relatively large organization of highly skilled individuals, many of them with very big egos.

Simple fact of life is that a leader has to inspire confidence and respect. At all times, under all circumstances.

Without it, he or she has no chance.

Dorion doesn't inspire confidence when he speaks. And he flat out says and does things that make you NOT respect him.

 

[BankStreetParade]

His primary job is to be the leader of a relatively large organization of highly skilled individuals, many of them with very big egos.

Simple fact of life is that a leader has to inspire confidence and respect. At all times, under all circumstances.

Without it, he or she has no chance.

Dorion doesn't inspire confidence when he speaks. And he flat out says and does things that make you NOT respect him.

Wouldn't the President of Hockey Operations be the leader of the organization?

 

[FunkySeeFunkyDoo]

Wouldn't the President of Hockey Operations be the leader of the organization?

Both people would be expected to lead.

But, the President of Hockey Ops doesn't exist, so the job falls entirely on Dorion's shoulders.

In fact, at least once or twice he's stated in a presser something like "These decisions are made by the Hockey Ops group, of which I am the leader of..."

 

[umma gumma]

Rangers had Panarin and Adam Fox walk on to their roster during their rebuild. No biggie there either I guess?

That is huge, which coincidentally is kinda what we're looking for. This team would look vastly different if two players of that calibre fell into our lap.

 

[BonHoonLayneCornell]

Wouldn't the President of Hockey Operations be the leader of the organization?

If that is our leader, there are question marks there too. The last statement we got from him had to be pulled because it was an insensitive pile of bullocks.

 

[cudi]

You gotta sell UFAs on the future of your team and why they should join. Seems like sales work to me.

 

[JungleBeat]

Dorion has failed in every aspect of constructing a respectable and successful NHL team.

He also lacks soft skills. The players in the locker probably don't even respect him and view him as a pushover,

 

[AchtzehnBaby]

Dorion has failed in every aspect of constructing a respectable and successful NHL team.

He also lacks soft skills. The players in the locker probably don't even respect him and view him as a pushover,

You saying this team sucks?

 

[Ice-Tray]

Both people would be expected to lead.

But, the President of Hockey Ops doesn't exist, so the job falls entirely on Dorion's shoulders.

In fact, at least once or twice he's stated in a presser something like "These decisions are made by the Hockey Ops group, of which I am the leader of..."

Most large organizations have spokespeople. And it seems like you mean inspires you, which doesn’t make a lot of sense since you don’t factor into the equation of his job at all. His job isn’t to wind you up like William Wallace, that’s a fans delusion of grandeur…

The GM of a hockey teams job isn’t to inspire confidence in people through inspirational speech, it’s through creating a vision, and manifesting that vision on the ice. At the end of the day if the GM creates a good team, that’s the inspiration people need to have faith in them. The on ice situation is a bit precarious right now and it’s understandable if people are lacking faith.

The media sound bites stuff is just vocal fan noise. As much as people go on about how he looks, dresses, lip smacks, smugness, cringy sound bites, none of it matters when it comes to his NHL job. Angry fans just like to be petty, feel like their opinions matter, and that their righteous fury will be answered. It doesn’t, and never will. We are literally observers, the only power is in choosing to observe or not. The only direct effect is to your own life.

In the end PD will be judged by his peers, by the media, by the league, and by his bosses based on what he’s able to produce on the ice through this rebuild. His NHL career, and his future as a GM in the league, is being shaped right now for good or for bad.

 

[FunkySeeFunkyDoo]

Most large organizations have spokespeople. And it seems like you mean inspires you, which doesn’t make a lot of sense since you don’t factor into the equation of his job at all.

....

I'll stop you right there.

No.

I didn't mean that it's important for him to inspire me.

I meant that it's important for him to be a leader within the organization.

If you don't understand why that's important, I doubt I can convince you.

 

[BankStreetParade]

Both people would be expected to lead.

But, the President of Hockey Ops doesn't exist, so the job falls entirely on Dorion's shoulders.

In fact, at least once or twice he's stated in a presser something like "These decisions are made by the Hockey Ops group, of which I am the leader of..."

So, if you were promoted to a first time manager and the company you worked for didn't fill the more senior management positions - aka, your boss(es) - would you find it fair to be blamed for everything that goes wrong or would you say you didn't have the right support in place to succeed?

The owner never filled the more senior leadership roles. Dorion is only the "leader" by default, not merit. There's a huge difference there and when we critique and assess his work, there should be a big asterisk there about the absence of guidance, experience and leadership that could help insulate him. It shouldn't be used against him when no one else, in their jobs, would accept the same criticisms in the same situation.

 

[Ice-Tray]

I'll stop you right there.

No.

I didn't mean that it's important for him to inspire me.

I meant that it's important for him to be a leader within the organization.

If you don't understand why that's important, I doubt I can convince you.

Right, you did say inspire me, and since you aren’t part of the organization I went ahead and assumed that you weren’t pretending to know how folks on the team and on the staff felt.

Your premise is fine in general, I’m just not sure you have the information needed to speak for how the staff and players feel.

Maybe I’m wrong and you do…

 

[Agent Zuuuub]

Most large organizations have spokespeople. And it seems like you mean inspires you, which doesn’t make a lot of sense since you don’t factor into the equation of his job at all. His job isn’t to wind you up like William Wallace, that’s a fans delusion of grandeur…

The GM of a hockey teams job isn’t to inspire confidence in people through inspirational speech, it’s through creating a vision, and manifesting that vision on the ice. At the end of the day if the GM creates a good team, that’s the inspiration people need to have faith in them. The on ice situation is a bit precarious right now and it’s understandable if people are lacking faith.

The media sound bites stuff is just vocal fan noise. As much as people go on about how he looks, dresses, lip smacks, smugness, cringy sound bites, none of it matters when it comes to his NHL job. Angry fans just like to be petty, feel like their opinions matter, and that their righteous fury will be answered. It doesn’t, and never will. We are literally observers, the only power is in choosing to observe or not. The only direct effect is to your own life.

In the end PD will be judged by his peers, by the media, by the league, and by his bosses based on what he’s able to produce on the ice through this rebuild. His NHL career, and his future as a GM in the league, is being shaped right now for good or for bad.

no one is making fun of how he looks.


have you listened to people talk about things that they are extremely knowledgeable about? they understand the material with their eyes closed and can communicate it fluently even if they are awkward, shy, or not speaking in their first language.

Do you know why this isn't Dorion? because he is a hockey idiot.

listen to an interview with someone who understands hockey on a deep level like yzerman and compare that to dorion. night and day.

 

[FunkySeeFunkyDoo]

So, if you were promoted to a first time manager and the company you worked for didn't fill the more senior management positions - aka, your boss(es) - would you find it fair to be blamed for everything that goes wrong or would you say you didn't have the right support in place to succeed?

....

Yes.

He knew there was no President of Hockey Ops when he accepted it.

In fact, the concept of a President of Hockey Ops wasn't even floated til well after he got the GM job.

And, he seemed a little resistant to it when asked about it in a presser.

 

[FunkySeeFunkyDoo]

Right, you did say inspire me, and since you aren’t part of the organization I went ahead and assumed that you weren’t pretending to know how folks on the team and on the staff felt.

Your premise is fine in general, I’m just not sure you have the information needed to speak for how the staff and players feel.

Maybe I’m wrong and you do…

I do not have specific info about how the players feel about Dorion.

I have general knowledge about what NHL players do / do-not respect as I know a couple former players.

And we do have public info from which we can infer how they feel -- Julie Turris laughed at him in a tweet, none of the departing players have ever thanked or complimented him after they left.

I'd be very surprised if any of them thought highly of him.

 

[Micklebot]

Yes.

He knew there was no President of Hockey Ops when he accepted it.

In fact, the concept of a President of Hockey Ops wasn't even floated til well after he got the GM job.

And, he seemed a little resistant to it when asked about it in a presser.

Wasn't Leeder president of hockey ops, or did he have another title? In reality though it's odd to me to argue the gm doesn't have a pronounced leadership role in the org. It's like saying the deputy minister shouldn't be expected to be a leader in his department, leadership isn't exclusive to the top position...

 

[AchtzehnBaby]

I do not have specific info about how the players feel about Dorion.

I have general knowledge about what NHL players do / do-not respect as I know a couple former players.

And we do have public info from which we can infer how they feel -- Julie Turris laughed at him in a tweet, none of the departing players have ever thanked or complimented him after they left.

I'd be very surprised if any of them thought highly of him.

Really? The people that got traded away are not happy? That never happens.

Julie Turris misses the olden days

 

[BonHoonLayneCornell]

Wasn't Leeder president of hockey ops, or did he have another title? In reality though it's odd to me to argue the gm doesn't have a pronounced leadership role in the org. It's like saying the deputy minister shouldn't be expected to be a leader in his department, leadership isn't exclusive to the top position...

Well he did learn some from Melnyk, or at least operated under him for years, and that's someone that obviously had some of the worst "leadership" qualities we've seen in the league.

Dorion was given the job of team spokesman by default and if he didn't like it, he knew who to complain to. Dorion has literally been the only face from the Ottawa Senators for fans and media to see for like 6 years now other than some small contributions from people that didn't last, the now very rare statements to the media from Leblanc, or Mann at the draft.

 

[BankStreetParade]

Wasn't Leeder president of hockey ops, or did he have another title? In reality though it's odd to me to argue the gm doesn't have a pronounced leadership role in the org. It's like saying the deputy minister shouldn't be expected to be a leader in his department, leadership isn't exclusive to the top position...

We're kinda moving away from the actual point here but let's not mix being part of leadership with being the leader.

 

[aragorn]

I think that the vast majority of people not only don't care who the managers are, but don't know them with maybe the exception of Dorion who gets the most air time. People watch hockey for the players & in that category Tkachuk leads this team like a champ & is a marketing icon, he definitely inspires the fans & his teammates & the press love him. Stutzle is another guy they can market the crap out of as well as Chabot especially on the French side & they also have Norris, Batherson & Forsberg they could market. Nobody gets inspired by management, but most fans will be inspired by the players they relate to & like.

 

[SENATOR]

You have Joe Sakic and some freak Dorion. Where the f*ck he even came from?