Management GM Pierre Dorion/Front Office Thread - Part IX [Mod Warning in post 1)

[Mark Stones Spleen]

On Saturday, Senators GM Pierre Dorion acknowledged that deals have been close, but failing to agree to terms on an extension has been the sticking point.

Bruce reported "Term" vs "Terms"

Could this be one of these

I don't think Bruce understands the difference between the two.

 

[Mingus Dew]

So DBC was a rental then? Strange trade to make.

Well everyone was shocked he was so cheap lol (wasn’t that cheap but still). This is why.

 

[PlayersLtd]

Just wanted to make sure that PD wanted DBC as rental. Just getting the new facts right. No big deal.

I woudn't treat what I say as gospel like that but I'm flattered regardless.

 

[Micklebot]

Well everyone was shocked he was so cheap lol (wasn’t that cheap but still). This is why.

We paid about as much (a bit more actually) as LA did for an extended Fiala, that was just the market value at the time.

 

[Nac Mac Feegle]

You have to at least admit, Dorion immediately getting into a cap crunch after finally being able to spend to the cap as a non-playoff team is pretty funny.

You know how it is, when it's your first time at the all you can eat buffet.

 

[Mingus Dew]

We paid about as much (a bit more actually) as LA did for an extended Fiala, that was just the market value at the time.

I think the risk was priced in tbh. DBC was a more highly regarded asset.

 

[NyQuil]

Dorion on the phone with Korpisalo’s agent

Ok, that’s the last one.

Hope he’s a good one.

 

[Loach]

I woudn't treat what I say as gospel like that but I'm flattered regardless.

It just makes it a really bad trade. Why get a rental when the team hadn't made the playoffs in 5 years? Should have kept the picks. You make a trade like that to get to the Conference Finals or Finals....not to get in for 1 year and then trade/let the player walk. Oh well.

 

[Gil Gunderson]

But it’s so much better than the budget cap floor crap we had to endure a few years ago

 

[Mingus Dew]

It just makes it a really bad trade. Why get a rental when the team hadn't made the playoffs in 5 years? Should have kept the picks. You make a trade like that to get to the Conference Finals or Finals....not to get in for 1 year and then trade/let the player walk. Oh well.

Cause he was trying to save his job.

 

[BonHoonLayneCornell]

The PR legend.

"Ottawa fans should be excited that there's a salary cap floor we're required to spend to."

Team proceeds to circumvent the cap to spend well below.

 

[BoardsofCanada]

Cause he was trying to save his job.

He was trying to give the city some excitement. It was time to compete. He got us Giroux, DBC, Talbot and finally Chychrun. It didn't work because of injuries and goaltending but I think Dorion did a pretty good job trying to get us there.

 

[PlayersLtd]

Cause he was trying to save his job.

The board was looking to oust PD last summer? That's just conjecture, right? I don't remember anything like that being leaked.

 

[PlayersLtd]

It just makes it a really bad trade. Why get a rental when the team hadn't made the playoffs in 5 years? Should have kept the picks. You make a trade like that to get to the Conference Finals or Finals....not to get in for 1 year and then trade/let the player walk. Oh well.

But what if it was two years and in year two we actually made (make) some noise?

You don't have to agree but I'm pretty adamant that we were a playoff team last year with better injury luck and if that was the case it would have made us that much more of a threat this year to the point where the trade would have looked just fine.

In other words without injuries we were a 95 point team last year. If we were a 95 point team last year I would expect us to be a 100 point team this year. If we're a 100 point team this year with the added bonus of some playoff experience I would say that trade, and losing him for nothing in 2024, is perfectly rational.

Add to that that PD was selling hope and I think you have a perfectly reasonable acquisition, albeit with some risk.

 

[BonHoonLayneCornell]

Whether or not the risk was worth it is subjective, so I don't see how anyone ultimately wins these debates. Dorion stuck his neck out. It didn't work out. Now he's got his chance to try to neutralize some of it with the trade and do other things to try to make a winning team.

 

[Mark Stones Spleen]

He's not used to spending near the cap but does he know that we're allowed to go over it in the summer? Would be nice to plug a couple cheap holes.

 

[Mingus Dew]

The board was looking to oust PD last summer? That's just conjecture, right? I don't remember anything like that being leaked.

Weird post. Melnyk died and another year without playoffs would look bad for new ownership. He’s lucky the sale was such a gong show otherwise he’d already be canned.

He was trying to give the city some excitement. It was time to compete. He got us Giroux, DBC, Talbot and finally Chychrun. It didn't work because of injuries and goaltending but I think Dorion did a pretty good job trying to get us there.

Could have been part of it but I don’t think he cares about our excitement.

 

[AchtzehnBaby]

Weird post. Melnyk died and another year without playoffs would look bad for new ownership. He’s lucky the sale was such a gong show otherwise he’d already be canned.



Could have been part of it but I don’t think he cares about our excitement.

Fake news.

Rebuilding complete.

PD safe for now.

 

[JD1]

The only reason that a contract extension is being talked about is that that’s what Ottawa would prefer.

DBC, in all likelihood, never wanted to sign a long term deal with anyone aside from a team he really wanted to go with, for a contract he wants.

It seems he’s not getting that kind of contract from teams he doesn’t want to go to in the first place.

Whether he wants to risk going to UFA and taking his chances, or sign a shorter term deal for less money than he and his agent were thinking is the issue now in my opinion.

Does it seem that?

DeBrincat provided a list. Dorion has talked trade. Dorion has said he's got to the point of allowing teams to talk to DeBrincat and alluded to those talks falling apart over term.

It seems to me that the teams he is interested in aren't interested in him with term. Or his list is a sham.

 

[BondraTime]

Does it seem that?

DeBrincat provided a list. Dorion has talked trade. Dorion has said he's got to the point of allowing teams to talk to DeBrincat and alluded to those talks falling apart over term.

It seems to me that the teams he is interested in aren't interested in him with term. Or his list is a sham.

Im coming at it from a biased view without a doubt, I’ve looked at the list as a sham ever since it was announced, knew it would have a near impossible success rate with teams actually looking for him and actually able to fit/want him. Turns out that’s how it played out. Somehow I was told I was freaking out and going off the deep-end because I said that DBC wasn’t going to be providing a list that benefited the Sens by including teams that realistically could get him, rather than the Vegas’, Florida’s of the league.

“Here are 5 teams I may sign with if you’re asking for a list. It’s not very realistic, and I’m really not really in a rush to sign, but knock your boots, if the right deal is there I will sign”

It should be no surprise that teams like the Isles, etc. aren’t going to be enticing to DBC, and it shouldn’t be put out in the media that DBC is holding up trades because he isn’t signing and his contract terms aren’t realistic. He’s under zero obligation to sign, other than the Sens selfishly (for good reason) wanting him to for their leverage. I have zero problem with the Sens trying to get him signed, but it doesn’t seem to be working, and it’s not DBC’s fault.

Garrioch saying that the team specifically asked for the list, when he has no trade protection whatsoever, sealed it for me, in my opinion. The team knows an unsigned DBC isn’t an appealing asset at 8 million for 1 year, it may literally be very tough to move. They’re hoping to get a deal signed before the trade. The list provided really bad 1 team with a legit possibility to make it work, IF they wanted, which they never.

 

[JD1]

Im coming at it from a biased view without a doubt, I’ve looked at the list as a sham ever since it was announced, knew it would have a near impossible success rate with teams actually looking for him and actually able to fit/want him. Turns out that’s how it played out. Somehow I was told I was freaking out and going off the deep-end because I said that DBC wasn’t going to be providing a list that benefited the Sens by including teams that realistically could get him.

Garrioch saying that the team specifically asked for the list, when he has no trade protection whatsoever, sealed it for me, in my opinion. The team knows an unsigned DBC isn’t an appealing asset at 8 million for 1 year, it may literally be very tough to move. They’re hoping to get a deal signed before the trade. The list provided really bad 1 team with a legit possibility to make it work, IF they wanted, which they never.

I'm perfectly fine going to arbitration and signing him and moving him next season at the TDL.

He will return a 1st plus one high end young player that's unlikely to dress in a playoff run

 

[Do Make Say Think]

He was trying to give the city some excitement. It was time to compete. He got us Giroux, DBC, Talbot and finally Chychrun. It didn't work because of injuries and goaltending but I think Dorion did a pretty good job trying to get us there.

This is fair but he also used up almost every single asset to get us to make the playoffs and failed.

When people complain about Dorion it isn't that he hasn't done any good; it is his penchant for going for the big move when most of them seriously backfired. I liked most of them when they happened but eventually the track record becomes established and impossible to ignore.

 

[Micklebot]

I'm perfectly fine going to arbitration and signing him and moving him next season at the TDL.

He will return a 1st plus one high end young player that's unlikely to dress in a playoff run

That's probably the best option in terms of getting value back, we could even boost the return by retaining a bit, but it would be a tough decision to move a top 6 fwd when we're fighting for a playoff berth, or if we think we have a shit in the playoffs.

Then there's the whole issue of fitting him under the cap, with the Korpisalo signing, that will be tough.

 

[JD1]

or if we think we have a shit in the playoffs.

Hopefully were not trying to replicate the Toronto model

 

[Micklebot]

Hopefully were not trying to replicate the Toronto model

Stupid auto complete...