Management GM Pierre Dorion/Front Office Thread - Part IX [Mod Warning in post 1)

[AchtzehnBaby]

And not a girlfriend worth remembering…. Like at all…..

One night stand.

 

[JD1]

Dorion had Jack Hughes contract to work with. There has been far more bad than good. The only reason they even have Stutzle is an anomaly of a team collapsing. It's not hard to see the body of work it's well documented. He had the opportunity to burn down a team that went to the conference finals with the best players in their prime. They have missed the playoffs for 6 years has no prospect depth and no picks.

The Zibanejad, Duchene, Hoffman, Stone, Murray and now potentially the debrincat trades are all timers. Not even mentioning the Stepan, and Gustavsson trades. Unable to identify good players when they are here like Demelo and Duclair. He hit big on one that was luck. There is no way they projected that pick to be top 3.

Was Zibanejad a hockey trade or a money trade? We pinning that on Melnyk or Dorion?

Was Hoffman a compromised player? Would you be praising that move if Hoffman was traded for draft picks? Neither return was good if you look at Hoffman's numbers. Why? I think we know why.

Duchene. Bad to acquire him or bad return moving him? I liked the move to get him. It clearly didn't pan out. We didn't get much for him when we moved him though.

Murray clearly didn't work out. But he was moved to Toronto after imo cementing his rep as unreliable. And it was Dubas the great that acquired him. NHL GMs have a long history of chasing former glory.

Stone was a misplaced hand. But as much as this fanbase loved Stone, he also gave the fanbase a bit of the middle finger in my view.

And as critical as you are of Dorion, consider what you would have done. You would have kept Karlsson. That would have been devastating to this franchise.

One night stand.

One night stand where you swear the next day you're never going to drink alcohol again

 

[GCK]

Same can be said for Dorion as much as DJ imo.

So much more vital to change Dorion immediately than DJ.

 

[GCK]

Was Zibanejad a hockey trade or a money trade? We pinning that on Melnyk or Dorion?

Was Hoffman a compromised player? Would you be praising that move if Hoffman was traded for draft picks? Neither return was good if you look at Hoffman's numbers. Why? I think we know why.

Duchene. Bad to acquire him or bad return moving him? I liked the move to get him. It clearly didn't pan out. We didn't get much for him when we moved him though.

Murray clearly didn't work out. But he was moved to Toronto after imo cementing his rep as unreliable. And it was Dubas the great that acquired him. NHL GMs have a long history of chasing former glory.

Stone was a misplaced hand. But as much as this fanbase loved Stone, he also gave the fanbase a bit of the middle finger in my view.

And as critical as you are of Dorion, consider what you would have done. You would have kept Karlsson. That would have been devastating to this franchise.


One night stand where you swear the next day you're never going to drink alcohol again

If Zibanejad was a money deal it was still a bad return.

Taking Boedker back in the Hoffman deal was utterly idiotic for a team on a tight budget.

No issues with Duchene trade.

Trading Stone for a tiny D was dumb but Stone wasn’t staying.

 

[Micklebot]

If Zibanejad was a money deal it was still a bad return

Agreed. How on earth were we the ones adding a second in that deal...

Taking Boedker back in the Hoffman deal was utterly idiotic for a team on a tight budget.

Agree, while they needed a way body to fill Hoffman's spot, sure they could have found other options imo

No issues with Duchene trade.

Value was good, however imo we should have been targeting help on the backend rather than upgrading Turris if we really wanted to extend our window.

Trading Stone for a tiny D was dumb but Stone wasn’t staying.

What was the alternative, Beauvillier from NYI? The issue there was holding out hope he'd re-sign after giving him a 1 year deal, he should have been trade back then if they couldn't extend him with term.

 

[JungleBeat]

Dorion your time is almost up buddy! New owners should fire him by tonight!

 

[Senscore]

Dorion shredding papers like it's the last days of Saigon

 

[Oscar The Grouch]

Any chance Dorion is indicted?

 

[YouGotAStuGoing]

What was the alternative, Beauvillier from NYI? The issue there was holding out hope he'd re-sign after giving him a 1 year deal, he should have been trade back then if they couldn't extend him with term.

We were also slightly hamstrung by the fact that Stone’s camp would only negotiate extension with a tentative trade in place. Led to teams bidding on him as a rental, not a long-term asset. It also wasn’t exactly a secret that Vegas was his preference in NHL circles. Hard to justify cutting bait with him post-arbitration, I don’t believe the decision to blow it up had been made then. And you’re never going to recoup value moving a guy like Stone without tremendous amounts of good luck on your side.

 

[JungleBeat]

We were also slightly hamstrung by the fact that Stone’s camp would only negotiate extension with a tentative trade in place. Led to teams bidding on him as a rental, not a long-term asset. It also wasn’t exactly a secret that Vegas was his preference in NHL circles. Hard to justify cutting bait with him post-arbitration, I don’t believe the decision to blow it up had been made then. And you’re never going to recoup value moving a guy like Stone without tremendous amounts of good luck on your side.

Karlsson and Brassard were traded for futures, obviously the team was rebuilding and Stone/Duchene wanted no parts in it. Dorion should have traded Stone is the summer to more potential suitors, the return he got was pathetic.

All this doesn’t matter though because Dorion’s tenure in Ottawa is finally over!

 

[Tnuoc Alucard]

Dorion shredding papers like it's the last days of Saigon

 

[Icelevel]

I will be jumping up and down.
What an exciting year this would be.
Leafs lose, melnyks gone, Dorion sent away. Wowee fresh start.

 

[inthewings]

Dorion being fired would be an excellent cherry on top of this great day.

Dude must be sweating PERFUSELY today

 

[Icelevel]

Dorion being fired would be an excellent cherry on top of this great day.

Dude must be sweating PERFUSELY today

He should have been sweating since the day he was hired. Terrible gm

 

[xVolchenkov]

I like Dorian. Would be sad to see him leave tbh.

 

[Tap on the Ankle]

Dorion being fired would be an excellent cherry on top of this great day.

Dude must be sweating PERFUSELY today

doubt he would get fired right before the draft
more likely the new people are brought in and the old ones remain to work through the draft with them and then permanent staffing changes like that are made afterwards

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

All over but the crying.

 

[PlayersLtd]

Can we put the pitchforks away and do this with a little bit of dignity?

 

[Micklebot]

We were also slightly hamstrung by the fact that Stone’s camp would only negotiate extension with a tentative trade in place. Led to teams bidding on him as a rental, not a long-term asset. It also wasn’t exactly a secret that Vegas was his preference in NHL circles. Hard to justify cutting bait with him post-arbitration, I don’t believe the decision to blow it up had been made then. And you’re never going to recoup value moving a guy like Stone without tremendous amounts of good luck on your side.

The move is give the player a deadline to extend long term otherwise you'll start the process of trading him. It should never have gotten to arbitration, that's really the issue.

I get that you won't get full value trading Stone, but you can't let what happened happen either.

 

[inthewings]

Can we put the pitchforks away and do this with a little bit of dignity?

No

 

[YouGotAStuGoing]

The move is give the player a deadline to extend long term otherwise you'll start the process of trading him. It should never have gotten to arbitration, that's really the issue.

I get that you won't get full value trading Stone, but you can't let what happened happen either.

Yeah, point taken. I think no matter which way we look at this, there's no single thing we can point to as having led to the debacle... it was a comedy of errors that led us there.

On a brighter note, Steve Staios was President (since 2015) and GM (since 2016) for the Andlauer-owned Hamilton Bulldogs until 2022. Made the playoffs every year and won two Memorial Cups. Also had player dev stints with the Leafs and Oilers, and of course his playing career. If he's who Andlauer is reportedly interested in bringing in, we could do far worse.

 

[LevelingSolo]

Dorion has been here 6 seasons and has only made the playoffs once, like DJ its crazy how he remains employed and should be let go almost immediately

 

[BondraTime]

Not sure there has been a GM in the past 30 years that had been given as much rope.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Can we put the pitchforks away and do this with a little bit of dignity?

Start a Pierre Dorion appreciation thread

 

[inthewings]

Yeah, point taken. I think no matter which way we look at this, there's no single thing we can point to as having led to the debacle... it was a comedy of errors that led us there.

On a brighter note, Steve Staios was President (since 2015) and GM (since 2016) for the Andlauer-owned Hamilton Bulldogs until 2022. Made the playoffs every year and won two Memorial Cups. Also had player dev stints with the Leafs and Oilers, and of course his playing career. If he's who Andlauer is reportedly interested in bringing in, we could do far worse.

Yeah, he seems like a good fit. But I'm most excited about the prospect of having a robust front office and coaching/training staff. The league has evolved, and great teams have great people in place all over the org: dedicated cap specialists, analytics teams, ideally top tier performance teams. It starts with a great leader as GM/POTUS. Hopefully Andlauer is willing to build up the team's infrastructure beyond the bare bones we've seen under Melnyk.

In a cap world you need an edge. You need to outcompete other teams in some capacity to have meaningful success. We didn't have an edge under Melnyk - we excelled at nothing. And the result was 15 years of wheel-spinning.