Proposal: Free agency edition Trade Rumours/Proposals [MOD - Stay on Topic] 5

[bert]

super risky from Ottawa. I personally wouldnt do it and look to extend Chychrun who looks fine on RD

If CHyrhcun wants to go then I would consider it

Then they're trading Chabot, what do you think he's worth in a deal? It's really hard to find physical stay at home RD who have size and top 4 upside.

 

[HSF]

Then they're trading Chabot, what do you think he's worth in a deal? It's really hard to find physical stay at home RD who have size and top 4 upside.

I just don't think getting another young defensemen who is still learning the game at. the NHL level is the move for us.

 

[Laphroaig]

Braden Schneider is a third pairing dman at the moment. He may become more than that but it's highly unlikely that he will ever be as good as Chychrun.

 

[Bileur]

Love the Schneider idea, much more interested in Laf than Kakko. Don’t know what they’d need to balance that out.

 

[frightenedinmatenum2]

I know most of you have said you want the Senators to give up a 1st for Tanev and sign him to a 3-4 year extension. The hope is still alive. Apparently, Vancouver almost got him, but they did not want to give up an additional 1st on top of their current package.

We could probably swing, Tanev, Vladar, Gilbert, and CGY 2024 4th Round Pick for Brannstrom, Kubalik, Forsberg, and BOS 2024 1st Round Pick.

Tanev 4.5M x 1
Vladar 2.2M x 2
Gilbert .7625 x 1
Total: 7.4625

Kubalik 2.5M x 1
Forsberg 2.75M x 2
Brannstrom 2M x 1
Total: 7.25M

That's very close to cap in/cap out. So it works within our current cap situation. We just need to make sure Tanev is signed to less than 2 years and doesn't have a full NMC or NTC so that when we end up rebuilding next year, we can recoup a 2nd round pick for him.

Love the Schneider idea, much more interested in Laf than Kakko. Don’t know what they’d need to balance that out.

Can't see them moving Lafreniere unless it is a give to get situation. Almost like us moving Pinto.

Kakko is available because of his contract status. They will have a difficult time qualifying him with their cap situation and what they can expect from him. It's similar to Brannstrom. If Brannstrom had another year without arbitration, we probably would not be hearing his name in trade rumors.

 

[Bileur]

I know most of you have said you want the Senators to give up a 1st for Tanev and sign him to a 3-4 year extension. The hope is still alive. Apparently, Vancouver almost got him, but they did not want to give up an additional 1st on top of their current package.

We could probably swing, Tanev, Vladar, Gilbert, and CGY 2024 4th Round Pick for Brannstrom, Kubalik, Forsberg, and BOS 2024 1st Round Pick.

Tanev 4.5M x 1
Vladar 2.2M x 2
Gilbert .7625 x 1
Total: 7.4625

Kubalik 2.5M x 1
Forsberg 2.75M x 2
Brannstrom 2M x 1
Total: 7.25M

That's very close to cap in/cap out. So it works within our current cap situation. We just need to make sure Tanev is signed to less than 2 years and doesn't have a full NMC or NTC so that when we end up rebuilding next year, we can recoup a 2nd round pick for him.



Can't see them moving Lafreniere unless it is a give to get situation. Almost like us moving Pinto.

Kakko is available because of his contract status. They will have a difficult time qualifying him with their cap situation and what they can expect from him. It's similar to Brannstrom. If Brannstrom had another year without arbitration, we probably would not be hearing his name in trade rumors.

That makes sense but Goodrow is a negative asset at this point, worse contract than Joseph and people were saying we’d have to add a high pick to move him this offseason.

Kakko has slim value and Schneider isn’t exactly blue chip anymore.

Sens can sure get great value for Chychrun (considering guys like Chiarot go for 1sts+ at the deadline and the haul Calgary just got) and Tarasenko (at 50%).

Don’t need to force a trade if one isn’t there.

 

[frightenedinmatenum2]

That makes sense but Goodrow is a negative asset at this point, worse contract than Joseph and people were saying we’d have to add a high pick to move him this offseason.

Kakko has slim value and Schneider isn’t exactly blue chip anymore.

Sens can sure get great value for Chychrun (considering guys like Chiarot go for 1sts+ at the deadline and the haul Calgary just got) and Tarasenko (at 50%).

Don’t need to force a trade if one isn’t there.

I think people are overvaluing Schneider as far as his trade value goes as an asset, but I could be wrong.

Kakko has very little value relative to his draft position. He will either get a 2nd or he will be subbed in for a 2nd in a rental trade.

I agree that I do not think that original proposal makes sense value wise. Goodrow's contract has negative value. I don't think Schneider or Kakko are valued as highly as other people in this thread think. As always, I could be wrong.

 

[bert]

I just don't think getting another young defensemen who is still learning the game at. the NHL level is the move for us.

He's not the last D man they go get.

I think people are overvaluing Schneider as far as his trade value goes as an asset, but I could be wrong.

Kakko has very little value relative to his draft position. He will either get a 2nd or he will be subbed in for a 2nd in a rental trade.

I agree that I do not think that original proposal makes sense value wise. Goodrow's contract has negative value. I don't think Schneider or Kakko are valued as highly as other people in this thread think. As always, I could be wrong.

They're both worth much more than you are suggesting. RHD men who are 6'3 220 that can make a first pass who are also cheap and young are few and far between. Go find a list of rhd that are competent top 4 players. It's a unicorn position.

Kakko has been injured this year. Has 5 goals in 28 games. Last year he had 40 points as a 21 year old with no first pp time. He's a power forward who's still developing thinking he's only worth a 2nd is laughable.

 

[Sensators]

I would be all over kakko. Not sure how it would work but think those high upside guys don't come around often at that age.

 

[HSF]

I think Kakko returns something. He did put up 40 points

If the Sens do move away from Drake and or Tarasenko I wouldn't mind trying him out even if we have to move our later first

 

[aragorn]

Braden Schneider is a third pairing dman at the moment. He may become more than that but it's highly unlikely that he will ever be as good as Chychrun.

If you want a RD that is going to be a pt producer than Schneider is not that guy, but if you want a shutdown RD in the Tanev mold than Schneider is quickly becoming that in the NHL. Depends what they want, but it seems they want a shutdown guy & I would prefer a younger guy with tons of upside to an older guy on his way out at 34 yrs old. And what I like most is that Schneider is learning from Trouba.

 

[HSF]

If you want a RD that is going to be a pt producer than Schneider is not that guy, but if you want a shutdown RD in the Tanev mold than Schneider is quickly becoming that in the NHL. Depends what they want, but it seems they want a shutdown guy & I would prefer a younger guy with tons of upside to an older guy on his way out at 34 yrs old. And what I like most is that Schneider is learning from Trouba.

Sens need someone who actually has experience in a higher role though.

They need to make a move where they actually get someone who can come in a fit right into a top 4 role like Van did with Hronek

If that is not avaliable then keep Chychrun

 

[The Devilish Buffoon]

Ryan Rezmierski - Anaheim, Pro Scout
Mark Craig - Carolina, Dir. of Pro Scouting
Billy Powers - Calgary, Amateur Scout
David Burstyn - Carolina, Pro Scout
Jim McKellar - Chicago, Head Scout
Ryan Barr - Colorado, Pro Scout
Todd White - Columbus, Pro Scout
Paul McIntosh - Dallas, Pro Scout (former Head of Pro Scouting & Dir. of Pro Scouting)
Warren Rychel - Edmonton, Pro Scout
Reid Simpsons - Montreal, Pro Scout
David MacLean - Minnesota, Pro Scout
Stan Drulia - Nashville, Head of Pro Scouting
Bob Hoffenmayer - NYI, Pro Scout
Craig Channell - NYR, Pro Scout
Steve Eminger - NYR, Pro Scout
John Goodwin - Seattle, Pro Scout
Tim Taylor - St. Louis, Dir. Player Personnel
Jim Roque - Toronto, Pro Scout
Jim McKenzie - Vegas, Pro Scout
Vaugh Karpan - Vegas, Dir. Player Personnel & Assistant GM

 

[aragorn]

Sens need someone who actually has experience in a higher role though.

They need to make a move where they actually get someone who can come in a fit right into a top 4 role like Van did with Hronek

If that is not avaliable then keep Chychrun

Do they? They are not making the playoffs this yr & bringing in a good young RD to grow with the team & can move up into the top 4 next yr is not out of the question, we still have Zub in the top 4. They could also get a RD in free agency over the summer given I think they make several moves this summer. And I think they draft a top 4 RD in this yr's draft who might be NHL ready in a few yrs or sooner. It will certainly be interesting to see how this new group does at the trade deadline, the draft & over the summer in their first yr at the helm.

 

[Senator Stanley]

Ryan Rezmierski - Anaheim, Pro Scout
Mark Craig - Carolina, Dir. of Pro Scouting
Billy Powers - Calgary, Amateur Scout
David Burstyn - Carolina, Pro Scout
Jim McKellar - Chicago, Head Scout
Ryan Barr - Colorado, Pro Scout
Todd White - Columbus, Pro Scout
Paul McIntosh - Dallas, Pro Scout (former Head of Pro Scouting & Dir. of Pro Scouting)
Warren Rychel - Edmonton, Pro Scout
Reid Simpsons - Montreal, Pro Scout
David MacLean - Minnesota, Pro Scout
Stan Drulia - Nashville, Head of Pro Scouting
Bob Hoffenmayer - NYI, Pro Scout
Craig Channell - NYR, Pro Scout
Steve Eminger - NYR, Pro Scout
John Goodwin - Seattle, Pro Scout
Tim Taylor - St. Louis, Dir. Player Personnel
Jim Roque - Toronto, Pro Scout
Jim McKenzie - Vegas, Pro Scout
Vaugh Karpan - Vegas, Dir. Player Personnel & Assistant GM

Worth noting:

https://x.com/PxPOttawa/status/1752871781101088935?s=20

 

[HSF]

Do they? They are not making the playoffs this yr & bringing in a good young RD to grow with the team & can move up into the top 4 next yr is not out of the question, we still have Zub in the top 4. They could also get a RD in free agency over the summer given I think they make several moves this summer. And I think they draft a top 4 RD in this yr's draft who might be NHL ready in a few yrs or sooner. It will certainly be interesting to see how this new group does at the trade deadline, the draft & over the summer in their first yr at the helm.

If Ottawa can get a haul for Chychrun like Van did with Lindholm then I might be open to it. I am not sure if another young D is needed on our blue line though unless they also move out Hamonic and Branny/JBD and replace them in the summer with a player with a bit more experience.


Sens are kinda in a sticky situation I probably just move Tarasenko and Kubalik and wait for the draft/free agency where some unexpected players may become avaliable due to cap or other reasons

 

[Burrowsaurus]

Then they're trading Chabot, what do you think he's worth in a deal? It's really hard to find physical stay at home RD who have size and top 4 upside.

Yea you have a legit point. But is Schneider still seen as such?d men do take longer to develop. Why do they want to trade him? I dono.

 

[frightenedinmatenum2]

If Ottawa can get a haul for Chychrun like Van did with Lindholm then I might be open to it. I am not sure if another young D is needed on our blue line though unless they also move out Hamonic and Branny/JBD and replace them in the summer with a player with a bit more experience.


Sens are kinda in a sticky situation I probably just move Tarasenko and Kubalik and wait for the draft/free agency where some unexpected players may become avaliable due to cap or other reasons

If the Lindholm return is on the table I might just wait. I guess it depends on how you evaluate the prospect and whether you think he has done enough to be considered a 1st round talent type prospect.

Kuzmenko has upside but with his cap hit, he was a cap dump. Similar to Beauvillier in the Horvat trade last year. While he could bounce back, I'm sure Calgary would have rather had the cap space.

The big difference with Chychrun is that he isn't a 1 year rental. So I'd expect something greater than a rental return.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

If Ottawa can get a haul for Chychrun like Van did with Lindholm then I might be open to it. I am not sure if another young D is needed on our blue line though unless they also move out Hamonic and Branny/JBD and replace them in the summer with a player with a bit more experience.


Sens are kinda in a sticky situation I probably just move Tarasenko and Kubalik and wait for the draft/free agency where some unexpected players may become avaliable due to cap or other reasons

You think this is a haul?

Kuzmenko ; what is he where does he play. He was healthy scratched numerous times
2 very maybe 3rd round picks
A late 1st.

I would be very disappointed.

 

[Burrowsaurus]

If Ottawa can get a haul for Chychrun like Van did with Lindholm then I might be open to it. I am not sure if another young D is needed on our blue line though unless they also move out Hamonic and Branny/JBD and replace them in the summer with a player with a bit more experience.


Sens are kinda in a sticky situation I probably just move Tarasenko and Kubalik and wait for the draft/free agency where some unexpected players may become avaliable due to cap or other reasons

I move tarasenko Kubalik brannstrom and jbd. Frees up 10 ish.

I’m not a cap guy. To me that just gets eaten up by Sandersons raise. 3 mil left to work with. Makes no sense to me. And then pintos raise the next year. And Greigs raise the year after.

Confuses me not built for this sort of stuff.

 

[HSF]

I don't even think the sens need to make any massive changes.

Last year Toronto go Mccabe and Lafferty. A good defensive defensemen and a good center who can play 3C and move up IF someone if having a bad night.

Those are the type of moves I would make on the RD and down the middle.


Even Demelo going for a 2nd from us and the jets. Some of these steady defensemen can be found. Just have to make the right move

 

[Xspyrit]

I think you're overlooking the assets we'd be adding through those trades. So when those contracts are expiring in three years, those trade assets would be starting to contribute. And those guys you're worried about resigning would be expendable (i.e, tradable for even more assets).

Like what would the return look like for unloading all of norris + giroux + chych + tank + kubalik + brann look like, if we only took back picks, prospects and expiring cap dumps? Im assuming that return is equivalent to like 4 2024 firsts and a couple seconds at minimum.

we'd still have a top six core of brady, bath, stu, pinto, greig, and joseph. Plus a boatload of cash to pay top dollar for some short term ufa talent to build around that.

Then add six 2024 first rounders who would start contributing in 1-3 years.

In three years we'd be so overloaded with young talent that the pieces you're worried about resigning would be superficial at that point.

It's like layering two cascading rebuilds on top of each other.

You could literally build a 2027 roster that looks like:

Brady-stu-bath
Greig-pinto-joseph
2024 first-2024 first-2024 first
4th line

Sanderson- 2024 1st
Chabot - 2024 1st
2025 1st - 2024 2nd

Sorry it took a bit of time to get back to you on this

I was not against the trades you mentioned (Tarasenko, Norris, Brannstrom, Kubalik, Giroux and Chychrun)

I was against trading Giroux though because we desperately need his experience, leadership, work ethic, talent and 2-way ability. Ex NHLers like Roussel, Lapierre, Leclaire, Latendresse, Picard, Fichaud, Lalime, etc all go in the same sense, Sens NEED MORE veterans like Giroux, not less.

Regarding Norris, I think we need to be more patient. His defensive metrics are slowly getting back to the top of the league. He only has 4 pts in the 7 games since coming back but 2 at ES and 1 SH. He'll need to start scoring on the PP to get his value up but keep in mind he got back from a long term injury in a discombobulated mess and the PP is still ineffective right now.

I think trading Chychrun, Tarasenko, Brannstrom and Kubalik is already a good start but IMO we should not target FUTURES for 2 reasons

- We need to start being more competitive YESTERDAY, there's no more time to waste, Tkachuk will be 25 y/o next season.

- Getting a lot of assets (while creating massive holes in the roster) would just start to offset the incredible amount of assets wasted by Dorion PUTRID asset management. So basically it would be taking many steps back just to get back to where we should be in terms of organizational wealth. Very frustrating. Example, the 1st gotten for Tarasenko or in a Norris trade would just offset the 1st we will have to lose because of the Dadonov fiasco.

I understand all of what you're saying but keep in mind than banking on 1st round picks to develop the way you hope or signing the best UFA in a market like Ottawa (known as one of the less attractive for NHLers) is more GAMBLING, which was Dorion's specialty.

 

[HSF]

You think this is a haul?

Kuzmenko ; what is he where does he play. He was healthy scratched numerous times
2 very maybe 3rd round picks
A late 1st.

I would be very disappointed.

Hunter Brzustewicz is a really good prospect who is breaking out this year. Kuzy is a 39 goal scorer last year who has another year left and can be flipped next year and a late 1st is pretty good for a 2C rental (so far)

I move tarasenko Kubalik brannstrom and jbd. Frees up 10 ish.

I’m not a cap guy. To me that just gets eaten up by Sandersons raise. 3 mil left to work with. Makes no sense to me. And then pintos raise the next year. And Greigs raise the year after.

Confuses me not built for this sort of stuff.

Cap going up this year and next aswell

Sorry it took a bit of time to get back to you on this

I was not against the trades you mentioned (Tarasenko, Norris, Brannstrom, Kubalik, Giroux and Chychrun)

I was against trading Giroux though because we desperately need his experience, leadership, work ethic, talent and 2-way ability. Ex NHLers like Roussel, Lapierre, Leclaire, Latendresse, Picard, Fichaud, Lalime, etc all go in the same sense, Sens NEED MORE veterans like Giroux, not less.

Regarding Norris, I think we need to be more patient. His defensive metrics are slowly getting back to the top of the league. He only has 4 pts in the 7 games since coming back but 2 at ES and 1 SH. He'll need to start scoring on the PP to get his value up but keep in mind he got back from a long term injury in a discombobulated mess and the PP is still ineffective right now.

I think trading Chychrun, Tarasenko, Brannstrom and Kubalik is already a good start but IMO we should not target FUTURES for 2 reasons

- We need to start being more competitive YESTERDAY, there's no more time to waste, Tkachuk will be 25 y/o next season.

- Getting a lot of assets (while creating massive holes in the roster) would just start to offset the incredible amount of assets wasted by Dorion PUTRID asset management. So basically it would be taking many steps back just to get back to where we should be in terms of organizational wealth. Very frustrating. Example, the 1st gotten for Tarasenko or in a Norris trade would just offset the 1st we will have to lose because of the Dadonov fiasco.

I understand all of what you're saying but keep in mind than banking on 1st round picks to develop the way you hope or signing the best UFA in a market like Ottawa (known as one of the less attractive for NHLers) is more GAMBLING, which was Dorion's specialty.

If we do target futures in these deals hopefully we move some of those picks to improve the roster in the summer.

Some of these teams will only want to give futures but I agree that futures don't mean much to us in terms of actually building this roster.

 

[frightenedinmatenum2]

Kuzmenko probably would not get a 1 year 5.5M contract if he were a UFA this offseason.

He could end up working out for Calgary, but at best he has neutral value.

It's a late 1st, a 4th, and a player picked in the third round who has apparently improved on his +1 season for Lindholm as a rental and 5.5M of cap space next season.

Unless you're super high on the prospect, that's not an outstanding return. Although, Lindholm didn't do them any favors this season by not producing near his previous highs

 

[ottawagm]

CGY should move Kuzmenko to WSH or another team @50% for more assests.