GDT: Free Agency Day 1: You're from Boston? Come on down

  • Xenforo Cloud has scheduled an upgrade to XenForo version 2.2.16. This will take place on or shortly after the following date and time: Jul 05, 2024 at 05:00 PM (PT) There shouldn't be any downtime, as it's just a maintenance release. More info here

Jules Winnfield

Fleurymanbad
Mar 19, 2010
8,920
1,965
JFC,

Does anyone else want Rutherford back? Sure, we dealt 1st round pick after 1st round pick but at least he had a plan to compete and it made sense. Hextall was absolute garbage and set us back 10 years.

Dubas as GM looks like he's schizophrenic. Last year before the start of the season he talked all that shit about gunning for cups to take advantage of the final years of the big guys, went out and made a big splash for EK, Graves, Smith, signing Jarry to a bloated contract, Eller, and a few other bottom six guys he loves, etc.

This year he sends mixed messages. The Pens as configured right now are an injury away from being a top lottery team. He talked about competing for a cup again with Crosby, Malkin, Letang, etc and then with the limited cap space he has, he does something a rebuilding team does with bringing on an underperforming player that was a cap dump just to get a 2nd round pick and hope Hayes does well to dump him at the deadline.

One of our problems last year was we had too many underperforming bottom six players. What does Dubas do? He brings in more underperforming bottom six players. He doesn't try to get a LW for Sid. DOC on a good team is in the bottom six. On a shitty team with no depth he's playing in the top 6.

Lizotte is a solid 4th line C but how many 4th line C's do we need? We have so much money tied up in repetitive players and/or players that don't produce near the AAV of their contracts.


4th Line C's:

Lizotte: $1.85m (No issue with him - good 4th line C on a good team)
Eller: $2.45m (3rd line C on a shitty team but good 4th line C on a good team)
Acciari: $2m (Injured most of the year and didn't do shit when he did play)

No room for young kids to come up and tackle the 4th line C with the current logjam.

$6.3m for 4th line C's right now.

Let's start on defensemen right now also. I'm not going to go into EK, Letang or Petterson. They are fine for the money. We have like 10 different guys who can play the 5-6 roles, and just signed Grzelcyk for $2.75m while we have Graves around for $4.5m. One of these guys is a luxury at this point because of salary/one spot in the top 4.

Now we have goaltending where everyone knows that Ned took over the starting job from Jarry. Jarry is an expensive luxury at $5.375m when we have other young players waiting in the wings here to come up. Jarry does well starting the season and shits the bed each year after the all star break.

Decisions like this are why we can't have nice things.

We have excess money tied into luxury things like 4th line C, whoever the 4th defenseman is, and our starting goalie that lost the starting job. If Dubas was SERIOUS about competing instead of talking from both sides of his mouth, he would've been trying to get more top 6 depth for the top 6 and to drive down into the 3rd line.

Dubas is doing shit that reminds me of what frustrated me with the Pirates all these years. Instead of signing low quality nickle and dime players to round out your roster and have an over abundance of them, take a larger portion of that money and get a player or two that is going to bring an impact into your lineup. For example, take out Hayes and Acciari and you have Debrusk. Was a 2nd round pick at a hitrate of <10% to play in the NHL worth giving up that cap space for a soft old player when you already have a soft old lineup?

Do better Dubas. We expect better from you. We gave you the first season to assess everything. You are trying to gain muscle and lose fat at the same time and right now you have no muscle and are just getting fatter.
 

Empoleon8771

Registered User
Aug 25, 2015
83,271
82,651
Redmond, WA
JFC,

Does anyone else want Rutherford back? Sure, we dealt 1st round pick after 1st round pick but at least he had a plan to compete and it made sense. Hextall was absolute garbage and set us back 10 years.

Dubas as GM looks like he's schizophrenic. Last year before the start of the season he talked all that shit about gunning for cups to take advantage of the final years of the big guys, went out and made a big splash for EK, Graves, Smith, signing Jarry to a bloated contract, Eller, and a few other bottom six guys he loves, etc.

This year he sends mixed messages. The Pens as configured right now are an injury away from being a top lottery team. He talked about competing for a cup again with Crosby, Malkin, Letang, etc and then with the limited cap space he has, he does something a rebuilding team does with bringing on an underperforming player that was a cap dump just to get a 2nd round pick and hope Hayes does well to dump him at the deadline.

One of our problems last year was we had too many underperforming bottom six players. What does Dubas do? He brings in more underperforming bottom six players. He doesn't try to get a LW for Sid. DOC on a good team is in the bottom six. On a shitty team with no depth he's playing in the top 6.

Lizotte is a solid 4th line C but how many 4th line C's do we need? We have so much money tied up in repetitive players and/or players that don't produce near the AAV of their contracts.


4th Line C's:

Lizotte: $1.85m (No issue with him - good 4th line C on a good team)
Eller: $2.45m (3rd line C on a shitty team but good 4th line C on a good team)
Acciari: $2m (Injured most of the year and didn't do shit when he did play)

No room for young kids to come up and tackle the 4th line C with the current logjam.

$6.3m for 4th line C's right now.

Let's start on defensemen right now also. I'm not going to go into EK, Letang or Petterson. They are fine for the money. We have like 10 different guys who can play the 5-6 roles, and just signed Grzelcyk for $2.75m while we have Graves around for $4.5m. One of these guys is a luxury at this point because of salary/one spot in the top 4.

Now we have goaltending where everyone knows that Ned took over the starting job from Jarry. Jarry is an expensive luxury at $5.375m when we have other young players waiting in the wings here to come up. Jarry does well starting the season and shits the bed each year after the all star break.

Decisions like this are why we can't have nice things.

We have excess money tied into luxury things like 4th line C, whoever the 4th defenseman is, and our starting goalie that lost the starting job. If Dubas was SERIOUS about competing instead of talking from both sides of his mouth, he would've been trying to get more top 6 depth for the top 6 and to drive down into the 3rd line.

Dubas is doing shit that reminds me of what frustrated me with the Pirates all these years. Instead of signing low quality nickle and dime players to round out your roster and have an over abundance of them, take a larger portion of that money and get a player or two that is going to bring an impact into your lineup. For example, take out Hayes and Acciari and you have Debrusk. Was a 2nd round pick at a hitrate of <10% to play in the NHL worth giving up that cap space for a soft old player when you already have a soft old lineup?

Do better Dubas. We expect better from you. We gave you the first season to assess everything. You are trying to gain muscle and lose fat at the same time and right now you have no muscle and are just getting fatter.

I'm not reading all of that, but the Penguins are a rebuilding team right now so the idea of signing Jason DeBrusk to a 7 year, $5.5 million deal is absolute lunacy.

Dubas has been abundantly clear that this team is in a transition phase and building for the future. He's not trying to build a contending roster anymore.
 

xlm34

Registered User
Dec 1, 2008
2,948
2,896
JFC,

Does anyone else want Rutherford back? Sure, we dealt 1st round pick after 1st round pick but at least he had a plan to compete and it made sense. Hextall was absolute garbage and set us back 10 years.

Dubas as GM looks like he's schizophrenic. Last year before the start of the season he talked all that shit about gunning for cups to take advantage of the final years of the big guys, went out and made a big splash for EK, Graves, Smith, signing Jarry to a bloated contract, Eller, and a few other bottom six guys he loves, etc.

This year he sends mixed messages. The Pens as configured right now are an injury away from being a top lottery team. He talked about competing for a cup again with Crosby, Malkin, Letang, etc and then with the limited cap space he has, he does something a rebuilding team does with bringing on an underperforming player that was a cap dump just to get a 2nd round pick and hope Hayes does well to dump him at the deadline.

One of our problems last year was we had too many underperforming bottom six players. What does Dubas do? He brings in more underperforming bottom six players. He doesn't try to get a LW for Sid. DOC on a good team is in the bottom six. On a shitty team with no depth he's playing in the top 6.

Lizotte is a solid 4th line C but how many 4th line C's do we need? We have so much money tied up in repetitive players and/or players that don't produce near the AAV of their contracts.


4th Line C's:

Lizotte: $1.85m (No issue with him - good 4th line C on a good team)
Eller: $2.45m (3rd line C on a shitty team but good 4th line C on a good team)
Acciari: $2m (Injured most of the year and didn't do shit when he did play)

No room for young kids to come up and tackle the 4th line C with the current logjam.

$6.3m for 4th line C's right now.

Let's start on defensemen right now also. I'm not going to go into EK, Letang or Petterson. They are fine for the money. We have like 10 different guys who can play the 5-6 roles, and just signed Grzelcyk for $2.75m while we have Graves around for $4.5m. One of these guys is a luxury at this point because of salary/one spot in the top 4.

Now we have goaltending where everyone knows that Ned took over the starting job from Jarry. Jarry is an expensive luxury at $5.375m when we have other young players waiting in the wings here to come up. Jarry does well starting the season and shits the bed each year after the all star break.

Decisions like this are why we can't have nice things.

We have excess money tied into luxury things like 4th line C, whoever the 4th defenseman is, and our starting goalie that lost the starting job. If Dubas was SERIOUS about competing instead of talking from both sides of his mouth, he would've been trying to get more top 6 depth for the top 6 and to drive down into the 3rd line.

Dubas is doing shit that reminds me of what frustrated me with the Pirates all these years. Instead of signing low quality nickle and dime players to round out your roster and have an over abundance of them, take a larger portion of that money and get a player or two that is going to bring an impact into your lineup. For example, take out Hayes and Acciari and you have Debrusk. Was a 2nd round pick at a hitrate of <10% to play in the NHL worth giving up that cap space for a soft old player when you already have a soft old lineup?

Do better Dubas. We expect better from you. We gave you the first season to assess everything. You are trying to gain muscle and lose fat at the same time and right now you have no muscle and are just getting fatter.

Rutherford is probably the biggest reason why this team is in the position it’s in.
 

Turin

Erik Karlsson is good
Feb 27, 2018
23,406
27,405
JFC,

Does anyone else want Rutherford back? Sure, we dealt 1st round pick after 1st round pick but at least he had a plan to compete and it made sense. Hextall was absolute garbage and set us back 10 years.

Dubas as GM looks like he's schizophrenic. Last year before the start of the season he talked all that shit about gunning for cups to take advantage of the final years of the big guys, went out and made a big splash for EK, Graves, Smith, signing Jarry to a bloated contract, Eller, and a few other bottom six guys he loves, etc.

This year he sends mixed messages. The Pens as configured right now are an injury away from being a top lottery team. He talked about competing for a cup again with Crosby, Malkin, Letang, etc and then with the limited cap space he has, he does something a rebuilding team does with bringing on an underperforming player that was a cap dump just to get a 2nd round pick and hope Hayes does well to dump him at the deadline.

One of our problems last year was we had too many underperforming bottom six players. What does Dubas do? He brings in more underperforming bottom six players. He doesn't try to get a LW for Sid. DOC on a good team is in the bottom six. On a shitty team with no depth he's playing in the top 6.

Lizotte is a solid 4th line C but how many 4th line C's do we need? We have so much money tied up in repetitive players and/or players that don't produce near the AAV of their contracts.


4th Line C's:

Lizotte: $1.85m (No issue with him - good 4th line C on a good team)
Eller: $2.45m (3rd line C on a shitty team but good 4th line C on a good team)
Acciari: $2m (Injured most of the year and didn't do shit when he did play)

No room for young kids to come up and tackle the 4th line C with the current logjam.

$6.3m for 4th line C's right now.

Let's start on defensemen right now also. I'm not going to go into EK, Letang or Petterson. They are fine for the money. We have like 10 different guys who can play the 5-6 roles, and just signed Grzelcyk for $2.75m while we have Graves around for $4.5m. One of these guys is a luxury at this point because of salary/one spot in the top 4.

Now we have goaltending where everyone knows that Ned took over the starting job from Jarry. Jarry is an expensive luxury at $5.375m when we have other young players waiting in the wings here to come up. Jarry does well starting the season and shits the bed each year after the all star break.

Decisions like this are why we can't have nice things.

We have excess money tied into luxury things like 4th line C, whoever the 4th defenseman is, and our starting goalie that lost the starting job. If Dubas was SERIOUS about competing instead of talking from both sides of his mouth, he would've been trying to get more top 6 depth for the top 6 and to drive down into the 3rd line.

Dubas is doing shit that reminds me of what frustrated me with the Pirates all these years. Instead of signing low quality nickle and dime players to round out your roster and have an over abundance of them, take a larger portion of that money and get a player or two that is going to bring an impact into your lineup. For example, take out Hayes and Acciari and you have Debrusk. Was a 2nd round pick at a hitrate of <10% to play in the NHL worth giving up that cap space for a soft old player when you already have a soft old lineup?

Do better Dubas. We expect better from you. We gave you the first season to assess everything. You are trying to gain muscle and lose fat at the same time and right now you have no muscle and are just getting fatter.
The reason the message changed is because the Pens were embarrassing last year. I appreciate what JR did and his go for it attitude, but the Pens were left with literally nothing in the pipeline. Like 80% of the Pens top 10 prospects are guys that have just been brought in within the last year. I don’t think they’ll be bad enough to tank, especially if the power play gets going, but I don’t mind keeping things conservative and trying to accumulate assets for now.
 

SEALBound

Fancy Gina Carano
Sponsor
Jun 13, 2010
41,571
19,903
Detroit seems primed to take advantage of Nashville, Toronto, and Edmonton.

They need forward and have a ton of space.
Nyquist+2nd for space
Robertson/2nd and Reaves or Jarnkrok or McCabb for space
Kane+Holloway/Broberg/2nd for space

All guys that could slip into the Detroit forward group while getting decent assets back. Truth be told, that is something we could do as well.

I would love to do something like here as well. Nyquist+2nd fits what we want to do decently well. Especially if we can waive or trade Eller out to someone like Buffalo.

Wish list:
Eller to Buffalo for a 5th
Acciari to Detroit for a 6th
Nyqvist+2nd to us for SJS 3rd

Nyqvist-Sid-Rust
Bunting-Malkin-Rakell
Beau-Hayes-DOC
Poulin-Lizotte-Puusty/Poolparty

My general assumption is that Nyqvist's slot in the top 6 as LW is being usurped by Stammer and Marchy.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Buddy Bizarre

SEALBound

Fancy Gina Carano
Sponsor
Jun 13, 2010
41,571
19,903
I have such respect for Brisebois, prioritizing winning at any emotional cost.
"16 years in Tampa? Sorry Steven, we think we can get to a Cup faster without you. Good luck in Nashville."
They still have a young enough team though:

Kuch - 31
Point - 29
Cirelli - 26
Hagel - 25
Hedman - 33
Vasi - 29

They are in Pens 2016/17 mode and they nabbed Guentzel to bolster it. We took that similar approach by not signing Guentzel, no?
 

Big Friggin Dummy

Registered User
Feb 22, 2019
25,035
23,798
JFC,

Does anyone else want Rutherford back? Sure, we dealt 1st round pick after 1st round pick but at least he had a plan to compete and it made sense. Hextall was absolute garbage and set us back 10 years.

Dubas as GM looks like he's schizophrenic. Last year before the start of the season he talked all that shit about gunning for cups to take advantage of the final years of the big guys, went out and made a big splash for EK, Graves, Smith, signing Jarry to a bloated contract, Eller, and a few other bottom six guys he loves, etc.

This year he sends mixed messages. The Pens as configured right now are an injury away from being a top lottery team. He talked about competing for a cup again with Crosby, Malkin, Letang, etc and then with the limited cap space he has, he does something a rebuilding team does with bringing on an underperforming player that was a cap dump just to get a 2nd round pick and hope Hayes does well to dump him at the deadline.

One of our problems last year was we had too many underperforming bottom six players. What does Dubas do? He brings in more underperforming bottom six players. He doesn't try to get a LW for Sid. DOC on a good team is in the bottom six. On a shitty team with no depth he's playing in the top 6.

Lizotte is a solid 4th line C but how many 4th line C's do we need? We have so much money tied up in repetitive players and/or players that don't produce near the AAV of their contracts.


4th Line C's:

Lizotte: $1.85m (No issue with him - good 4th line C on a good team)
Eller: $2.45m (3rd line C on a shitty team but good 4th line C on a good team)
Acciari: $2m (Injured most of the year and didn't do shit when he did play)

No room for young kids to come up and tackle the 4th line C with the current logjam.

$6.3m for 4th line C's right now.

Let's start on defensemen right now also. I'm not going to go into EK, Letang or Petterson. They are fine for the money. We have like 10 different guys who can play the 5-6 roles, and just signed Grzelcyk for $2.75m while we have Graves around for $4.5m. One of these guys is a luxury at this point because of salary/one spot in the top 4.

Now we have goaltending where everyone knows that Ned took over the starting job from Jarry. Jarry is an expensive luxury at $5.375m when we have other young players waiting in the wings here to come up. Jarry does well starting the season and shits the bed each year after the all star break.

Decisions like this are why we can't have nice things.

We have excess money tied into luxury things like 4th line C, whoever the 4th defenseman is, and our starting goalie that lost the starting job. If Dubas was SERIOUS about competing instead of talking from both sides of his mouth, he would've been trying to get more top 6 depth for the top 6 and to drive down into the 3rd line.

Dubas is doing shit that reminds me of what frustrated me with the Pirates all these years. Instead of signing low quality nickle and dime players to round out your roster and have an over abundance of them, take a larger portion of that money and get a player or two that is going to bring an impact into your lineup. For example, take out Hayes and Acciari and you have Debrusk. Was a 2nd round pick at a hitrate of <10% to play in the NHL worth giving up that cap space for a soft old player when you already have a soft old lineup?

Do better Dubas. We expect better from you. We gave you the first season to assess everything. You are trying to gain muscle and lose fat at the same time and right now you have no muscle and are just getting fatter.
No.
 

SomeDude

Registered User
Mar 6, 2006
17,569
29,111
Pittsburghish
The reason the message changed is because the Pens were embarrassing last year.
the ultimate irony is that we are likely in the playoffs if Dubas had the stones to, at a bare minimum, fire Todd mid-season to at least try to fix the PP.

We may be the only team in the league who would just sit there watching a fixable problem destroy the team night in and night out.
 

Big Friggin Dummy

Registered User
Feb 22, 2019
25,035
23,798
I think it's too convenient and lazy to say it's any one person. It's a combined effort of Sullivan's coaching since 2018, JR's brainrot from 2017 through 2020, Hextall's buffoonery, and now Dubas wasting a year on bullshit "Hi guys! We can still contend!" moves.

It's over. It's dead. Didn't have to be this ugly, but it is. Let it go. Accept that this already aggressively mediocre and boring team is gonna keep getting worse until Sid retires, then it'll really get awful as they rake in the top-3 picks and hope to luck into a superstar talent to build around.
 
  • Like
Reactions: EVGENIMERLIN

SEALBound

Fancy Gina Carano
Sponsor
Jun 13, 2010
41,571
19,903
Just Armchaired GM'ed this:

Eller to Buffalo for a 5th
Acciari to Detroit for a 6th (or we waive him and he gets picked up)
Robertson+Jarnkrok for BUF 5th + Bemstrom
Nyqvist + 2nd for SJS 3rd
Resign Robertson $1.5mil x 1yr

Nyqvist-Sid-Rust
Bunting-Malkin-Rakell
DOC-Hayes-Robertson
Jarnkrok-Lizotte-Beauvillier

Petts-EK
Gryz-Letang
Graves-JSI

TJ/Neds

$2.8mil left in space. Adds a 2nd, Robertson, and give you Nyqvist and Jarnkork who could be both sent out at the TDL for extra assets.

That said, I believe that's a relatively competitive team as well...just saying...
 

Big Friggin Dummy

Registered User
Feb 22, 2019
25,035
23,798
Brannstrom to Colorado for dirt cheap ofc. At least we got an older D for 3x much!
I'd go to Colorado too. No idea why people think any FAs of value, let alone young guys, would want to come here. Even on a one year deal. You're potentially f***ing up your future deal if you have a bad year under a dogshit coach on a dead team. Why bother? :laugh:
 

SEALBound

Fancy Gina Carano
Sponsor
Jun 13, 2010
41,571
19,903
Brannstrom to Colorado for dirt cheap ofc. At least we got an older D for 3x much!
As meh as he is, Gryz is a better dman than Brannstrom at this point.

There's a reason Brannstrom was not qual'd and why he just signed for 900k on the 2nd day of FA.
 

Your Boy Troy

Registered User
Sep 19, 2013
2,826
769
Brampton, Ontario
Brannstrom to Colorado for dirt cheap ofc. At least we got an older D for 3x much!
Yeah, I don’t get it. The perception is that
Grzelcyk is better defensively and plays harsher minutes (the latter being true), but the underlying stats are so much worse than Brannstrom’s both offensively and defensively.

This has Sullivan written all over it. He needs his Massachusetts undersized players. It wouldn’t surprise me if Sheary was brought back.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Andy99

Gurglesons

Registered User
Dec 18, 2009
94,179
75,979
Joshua Tree, CA
last-train-tocool.blogspot.com
Yeah, I don’t get it. The perception is that
Grzelcyk is better defensively and plays harsher minutes (the latter being true), but the underlying stats are so much worse than Brannstrom’s both offensively and defensively.


This has Sullivan written all over it. He needs his Massachusetts undersized players. It wouldn’t surprise me if Sheary was brought back.

I'm not incredibly excited about the Grzelcyk signing, but tbh Brannstrom isn't a sure thing.

Gryz has been a 17-19 minute defenseman on a really good Boston team.

Brannstrom was a 16 minute guy on a terrible Ottawa team that had lots of LHD to insulate him.
 

Turin

Erik Karlsson is good
Feb 27, 2018
23,406
27,405
the ultimate irony is that we are likely in the playoffs if Dubas had the stones to, at a bare minimum, fire Todd mid-season to at least try to fix the PP.

We may be the only team in the league who would just sit there watching a fixable problem destroy the team night in and night out.
That’s true.
 

Turin

Erik Karlsson is good
Feb 27, 2018
23,406
27,405
Difference between Branstrom and Gryz is that one is decent in sheltered minutes and has never proved he can play above it, while the other has been bad in bigger minutes but before two years ago was a real #4 defenseman.
 

AuroraBorealis

Back-to-back hater
Oct 16, 2018
19,565
16,955
Vancouver, British Columbia
They still have a young enough team though:

Kuch - 31
Point - 29
Cirelli - 26
Hagel - 25
Hedman - 33
Vasi - 29

They are in Pens 2016/17 mode and they nabbed Guentzel to bolster it. We took that similar approach by not signing Guentzel, no?
The Guentzel move was correct, for sure. Not going scorched earth is not though.
Why re-sign Sid until he's 40 when you're not really trying to win anymore? Dubas' excuse is he'll mentor the young guys who will become the core here.
Bullshit. We're nowhere near that close, where that will end up mattering.
From a contender building perspective, it's very clear what you do here.
You ask him to waive, which he would.
Then after he's traded, everyone else we need to waive would too. Then everything gets easier and you can get serious about a rebuild.

But FSG is against that because Sid is their brand. So we're kinda half-in, half-out, not loading up the cupboards like we could.
Plus Sid being here makes us draft lower. Same goes with this incoming Petts extension. Makes no sense. This is Dubas feigning standings relevance for FSGs sake, and it's lame.

Tampa management and ownership have no such reservations. All-in to win ASAP. No one is safe if they're a roadblock. That's how it should be. It's a GMs job to win, not prioritize the feels.
 

Ad

Upcoming events

Ad

Ad