Bieksa is worst then Lovejoy. I don't have the English vocabulary to explain to you how bad Bieksa is and English is my first language.
Proposal: Fowler to the devils
- Thread starter lelo07
- Start date
Bieksa is worst then Lovejoy. I don't have the English vocabulary to explain to you how bad Bieksa is and English is my first language.
Goose of Reason
El Zilcho
- May 1, 2013
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Last year Lindholm/Beauchemin took the main shutdown duties that Fowler/Bieksa had this year which might contribute. Also, Ben Lovejoy is a way better defenseman than Kevin Bieksa.
Zajacs Bowl Cut
Lets Go Baby
which is why I said ALMOST.
doubtful that he would supplant Greene, to be honest.
- Apr 27, 2005
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Machinehead
HFNYR MVP
This is another classic appeal to authority that you see all the time on this site: "look! NHL teams are doing it so it must be right!"
It's Edmonton. They don't do anything right. They absolutely **** all over themselves trading Hall straight up for Larsson.
dracom
Registered User
But it still happened, so the price for a player like Fowler has been set. Just because some internet armchair GMs think the deal was bad doesn't mean real life GMs are going to agree.
Machinehead
HFNYR MVP
Well I think a good handful of real-life GM's are morons.
But if we're talking in terms of value, Fowler has a lot of value. I don't disagree.
People really gotta take these possesion stats and corsi numbers with a grain of salt. when the habs traded subban for weber its all you heard about. later you read that subban led the league with 106 giveaways and even played 14 less games then the guy who was second. if weber doesnt waste any time with the puck and moves it quickly does this not hurt his possession numbers ? is it conceivable that fowler could truly be a stud ?
Machinehead
HFNYR MVP
You think we should take possession stats with a grain of salt, but you're using turnovers which have openly been exposed as random and depending almost entirely on the arena?
are you serious ? a guy leads the league in giving the puck away and thats random ? Turning the puck over has something to do with the arena being played in ? Your not being serious are you ?
- Sep 28, 2014
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Avs44
Registered User
- May 16, 2011
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Turnovers and what counts as one are determined in-house in each arena by the staff there. They aren't an objective stat. I believe massive variances in turnovers based on each arena has been displayed before.
AfroThunder396
[citation needed]
The same people, real time stats are not standardized and each arena has different criteria as to what constitutes a "hit" or "takeaway" or "shot attempt".
Classic case is the "Brodeur's 1,000 saves" study, where a math guy found that Brodeur's SV% was lower at home even though he allowed less goals. The author suggests that due to poor shot counting, Brodeur never got credit for roughly 1,000 saves over his career.
This is why you ALWAYS have to be wary when someone introduces stats with no context and you can never take advanced stats at face value.
MartyOwns
thank you shero
- Apr 1, 2007
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he's far from perfect, but he becomes our best defenseman immediately. if anaheim was stupid enough to make the deal for boucher, we would and should accept without hesitation
Well said.
Okeeeyyyy
^
AfroThunder just completely rekt your stat watching narrative. Even your precious possessions stats are subject to variability and they're certainly not collected in a way that is better than turnover rates or hits
All stats are taken in-house and vary dramatically, that includes the shot attempts FOR and shot attempts AGAINST used to calculate Corsi, and the blocked shots that are removed from Fenwick calculations.
glenbuis is absolutely correct in saying possession stats don't tell most of the story and, thus, shouldn't be used to tell the WHOLE story i.e. players can't be judged based on a stat sheet. Anyone with half a brain knows this, but too many people on here have egos that just won't let them accept the fact they cannot know the ins and outs of every player in the league.
Ducks in a row
Go Ducks Quack Quack
Fowler isn't overrated he is underrated because hero charts said he is worse then Schultz which is crazy.
People need to watch the player more and stop looking at advanced stats like that as if they are all you need to know. Watching players are important that is why every team has scouts.
i understand now where your coming from though with variances and all. id be curious to see how the corsi people could measure heart, character , guts and team player level a guy has. three guys that come to mind for me would be crosby toews and weber. gotta go but understand now where your coming from.
Machinehead
HFNYR MVP
According to the NHL Dan Girardi had 58 turnovers last year. That's not even one a game. He has one a shift. It's a stat that's not even close to being accurate.
from the sounds of it that (turnover ) would be one of the easier stats to monitor. if the simpler stats are not accurate how can we pretend to believe that the fancy corsi stats are so much more accurate ?
Sure about that?
It's 'worse than'. However, Bieksa is definitely worse than almost any RHD at this point.
Tecumseh
Scorched Earth
OP's proposal might not even get Simon Despres let alone Cam Fowler. Lol at these drones citing HERO charts and taking them as gospel.
VoidCreature
Before you see the light, you must die.
Fowler plays the left side, it's not like he'd be blocking Sevs. Compare him to Jon Merrill or John Moore instead.
He would also have lead our D in scoring last year by a healthy margin.
