Proposal: Fowler to the devils
- Thread starter lelo07
- Start date
MrLouniverse
frontline internet hero
Given our relative cap situations I would much rather offer sheet Lindholm and see what Bob Murray can do about it rather than trade for any of the Ducks blueline also-rans.
I don't like really like much of anything out there that the Devils are able to afford, see if Shero has it in him to be a wildcard, *****es.
I guess we could fall backwards into Zids again for a year but that's hardly a solution.
I don't like really like much of anything out there that the Devils are able to afford, see if Shero has it in him to be a wildcard, *****es.
I guess we could fall backwards into Zids again for a year but that's hardly a solution.
Pennaduck
Registered User
It's pretty shocking to me to read all these posts on this site that knock Fowler and give absolutely no reason for it aside from stats because the posters clearly do not watch him enough to evaluate his game.
He has been a top four defenseman on one of the better teams in the league virtually since his rookie season, and has taken on the responsibilities of a top pairing defenseman more often that not in the past few years. Fowler is an integral part of our defense. I would say most Ducks fans would rank him second on our team in terms of his responsibilities and importance to our defense (after Lindholm), if not first. You don't get those responsibilities if you aren't good enough to handle them.
He is very good at passing the puck out of the D-zone, particularly when pressured. When he has open ice he is one of the better Dmen I've seen at skating the puck through the neutral zone. When his partner is getting pressured he is excellent at making himself available for an outlet pass. He has solid positioning away from the puck and his skating allows him to keep forwards from getting behind him into the dangerous areas. He is not infallible, but I would say he is easily above average in these abilities.
If I have any criticism against him, it would be a tentativeness to engage in physical contact, particularly along the boards and in the crease area. This is why in a perfect world he would be paired with a physical #1 dman to handle those responsibilities. One could also criticize his PP production, slow-ish release of his shots from the blue line, and subsequent difficultly getting his shots through as a result. These are, imo, fair critiques of his game and elements of his game that prevent him from being a true #1. They are not great enough flaws to keep him from being considered a 2/3 type guy on most teams in the league, especially with the right partner.
He has not had a great D partner since Beauchemin, and even this pairing had some difficulty due to handedness. He made Ben Lovejoy look like a solid top four defenseman. His pairing with Simon Despres helped him look more like a solid top four defenseman. He has been saddled with Bieksa a lot lately and still plays an effective game despite this. A lot of his responsibility is playing against top six competition in the D zone, so his possession numbers suck because he is often out there just long enough to gain possession and get the puck up ice before going to the bench and he does it with a boat anchor for a D partner.
And yes, he does get a lot of offensive zone starts as well, but you need to consider that much of the Ducks style of play is a cycle game, so our forwards can have the puck in the Dzone for a prolonged period of time yet still only get zero or one shot on goal because of it. They try to wear the opposition down and then get the puck back to the point with someone in front of the net for a quality scoring chance, or they cycle long enough to get someone open in the low slot. Often this results in turnovers rather than scoring chances, which is why the Ducks advanced stats almost never depict how good the team actually is. We don't generate a lot of scoring chances off the rush and our players tend to give the puck away a lot (getzlaf in particular had 75 last season).
So I guess what I am saying is if you are going to criticize, consider the context that he is playing in, and come up with actual critiques to his game based on watching him and the ducks play rather than citing the same worn out retorts based on flawed analytics.
And as a final note, I know that rinks credit things like turnovers differently so its a tough stat to use gauge a players effectiveness, but you should all consider that the HF Boards darling Hampus Lindholm had a -47 turnover differential last season in about 1760 minutes played, while Fowler had -15 differential in 1571 minutes played. To put this in context, Kesler led our team with a +5 differential. We turned the puck over A LOT last season. Fowler also led us in average TOI (22.47) and was second behind Lindholm in blocked shots. Do with this info what you want, but stop assuming based on fancy stats and other peoples opinions that Fowler is anything but a damn good #2/3 Dman
He has been a top four defenseman on one of the better teams in the league virtually since his rookie season, and has taken on the responsibilities of a top pairing defenseman more often that not in the past few years. Fowler is an integral part of our defense. I would say most Ducks fans would rank him second on our team in terms of his responsibilities and importance to our defense (after Lindholm), if not first. You don't get those responsibilities if you aren't good enough to handle them.
He is very good at passing the puck out of the D-zone, particularly when pressured. When he has open ice he is one of the better Dmen I've seen at skating the puck through the neutral zone. When his partner is getting pressured he is excellent at making himself available for an outlet pass. He has solid positioning away from the puck and his skating allows him to keep forwards from getting behind him into the dangerous areas. He is not infallible, but I would say he is easily above average in these abilities.
If I have any criticism against him, it would be a tentativeness to engage in physical contact, particularly along the boards and in the crease area. This is why in a perfect world he would be paired with a physical #1 dman to handle those responsibilities. One could also criticize his PP production, slow-ish release of his shots from the blue line, and subsequent difficultly getting his shots through as a result. These are, imo, fair critiques of his game and elements of his game that prevent him from being a true #1. They are not great enough flaws to keep him from being considered a 2/3 type guy on most teams in the league, especially with the right partner.
He has not had a great D partner since Beauchemin, and even this pairing had some difficulty due to handedness. He made Ben Lovejoy look like a solid top four defenseman. His pairing with Simon Despres helped him look more like a solid top four defenseman. He has been saddled with Bieksa a lot lately and still plays an effective game despite this. A lot of his responsibility is playing against top six competition in the D zone, so his possession numbers suck because he is often out there just long enough to gain possession and get the puck up ice before going to the bench and he does it with a boat anchor for a D partner.
And yes, he does get a lot of offensive zone starts as well, but you need to consider that much of the Ducks style of play is a cycle game, so our forwards can have the puck in the Dzone for a prolonged period of time yet still only get zero or one shot on goal because of it. They try to wear the opposition down and then get the puck back to the point with someone in front of the net for a quality scoring chance, or they cycle long enough to get someone open in the low slot. Often this results in turnovers rather than scoring chances, which is why the Ducks advanced stats almost never depict how good the team actually is. We don't generate a lot of scoring chances off the rush and our players tend to give the puck away a lot (getzlaf in particular had 75 last season).
So I guess what I am saying is if you are going to criticize, consider the context that he is playing in, and come up with actual critiques to his game based on watching him and the ducks play rather than citing the same worn out retorts based on flawed analytics.
And as a final note, I know that rinks credit things like turnovers differently so its a tough stat to use gauge a players effectiveness, but you should all consider that the HF Boards darling Hampus Lindholm had a -47 turnover differential last season in about 1760 minutes played, while Fowler had -15 differential in 1571 minutes played. To put this in context, Kesler led our team with a +5 differential. We turned the puck over A LOT last season. Fowler also led us in average TOI (22.47) and was second behind Lindholm in blocked shots. Do with this info what you want, but stop assuming based on fancy stats and other peoples opinions that Fowler is anything but a damn good #2/3 Dman
Number1RedWingsFan52
Registered User
So D-man for D-man when Anaheim needs a top 6 LW, So how does this help them. Fowler is far better then Merrill.
dracom
Registered User
Because people think real life is like NHL 16 where they can just add their 1st to any deal and get what they want.
Ducks in a row
Go Ducks Quack Quack
Fowler joins Devils and they become a better team who knows what spot that 1st lands at. We want a better main piece then that we are a win now team so that should be expected yet some people throw out stuff that doesn't help us now. Merrill is a defenseman we have too many defenseman even after trading Fowler we don't want more.
If you don't have your 1st 2nd and 3rd, you will have to offer a lot. I think New Jersey is the only team who can offer sheet Ducks and not be in cap trouble.
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