Proposal: Flyers and Jets

[Whileee]

While I have no doubt the organization feels strongly about him, he’ll be a bottom 6 player in the NHL. It’s not like we can’t afford to part with him, but if we did I don't think it would be for someone like Hagg.

I agree with this. I think Lemieux projects as an effective bottom 6 forward. Hagg has too many question marks about his potential at this point.

 

[broc]

Nope. Can't afford Meyers unless you take back AMac.

Edit: and who even knows what he'll look like after coming back from surgery.

Only Macdonald has horrible contract with negative value and is hardly an nhler... while Myers has been good to great for us, albeit recovering from surgery this offseason.

This is like saying, "can't afford Johnny Boychuk... Unless you take back David clarkson"

Just ridiculous to say even..

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Again, it's clear that you're out of your element on this topic. Sanheim and Gostisbehere are just as well, if not better, on their off sides. It's not of utmost importance to have LHD-RHD pattern from the first to the bottom pairs. Besides, I doubt that the Flyers won't have at least one RHD in the corps. Gudas is signed to the next four years. Midway through that contract, Myers and Friedman should be up.

Does a LHD give and take passes on his backhand or doesn't he?

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Look at the post I responded to. They used Myers rookie season to try and put down Sanheim...I assume saying that Sanheim isn't even in the NHL.

I SARCASTICALLY wrote the exact same thing using hand examples of Yak's rookie season and Connor not being in the NHL.

BOTH are ridiculous comments....but mine was sarcasm, his was serious.

And I said Connor had a great season, but let's not pretend that Sanheim did not as well. He posted the best PPG in the WHL by a Dman in 20 years.

As got Morrisey....yup...had a great 18 year old season. Then had a much worse 19 year old season getting 38 points in 47 games.

It doesn't matter in the end. You guys want and will keep Connor, we will do hand same with Sanheim. And both fanbases will be quite happy.

I still have no idea what your Yak comments mean. Sorry. Whatever you were trying to do there didn't work.

 

[ponder719]

Only Macdonald has horrible contract with negative value and is hardly an nhler... while Myers has been good to great for us, albeit recovering from surgery this offseason.

How, exactly, does the relative skill level of the players involved have anything to do with what he said? He's absolutely right: we mathematically cannot fit Tyler Myers under our cap unless you take back a big contract, like Andrew MacDonald. Whether you want MacDonald or not is irrelevant; the issue is that if you're sending us significant cap hits and getting prospects back, you need to take cap or the deal will be illegal.

 

[Curufinwe]

There are pros and cons to playing each side. Some left shots have played the right side all their lives and vice versa. It is more natural for them just because of being used to it. Being on the off-side is better in the O zone which is why a lot of D swap sides on the PP. OTOH that first pass out of the D zone has to be made on the back hand. No amount of practice changes that.

I never said that D can't play their off-side. Plenty do it successfully but they will never be 100% as good as they are on their natural sides. Sanheim on the left is better than Sanheim on the right no matter how good Sanheim on the right may be.

If the Flyers want to go forward with 6 LHD go ahead. But there are better options possible.

The Flyers just signed Gudas to a four year extension, plus they have an open protection slot for a veteran RHD if Hextall decides to trade for one and not keep MDZ. And we do have two good RHD prospects.

1. Provorov, Ivan (88%) LHD
2. Sanheim, Travis (75%) LHD
3. Konecny, Travis (85%) RW
4. Morin, Sam (54%) LHD
5. Rubtsov, German (79%) C
6. Myers, Phil (56%) RHD
7. Lindblom, Oskar (54%) LW/RW
8. Laberge, Pascal (68%) C/RW
9. Aube-Kubel, Nicolas (63%) LW/RW
10. Allison, Wade (44%) RW
11. Hagg, Robert (55%) LHD
12. Friedman, Mark (52%) RHD
13. Vorobyov, Mikhail (49%) C
14. Leier, Taylor (58%) LW
15. Fazleev, Radel (60%) C

 

[Curufinwe]

Nope.

Philly might just trade a pick for Dano though.

If they do that before the ED it means they can only protect one of Raffl, Weise, Laughton and Cousins.

I think if Hextall makes a trade it'll be for a dman since right now Ghost and Gudas are the only dmen we need to protect.

 

[Cootsfanclub]

If they do that before the ED it means they can only protect one of Raffl, Weise, Laughton and Cousins.

I think if Hextall makes a trade it'll be for a dman since right now Ghost and Gudas are the only dmen we need to protect.

We need to protect MDZ too, if we plan to re-sign him.

 

[Curufinwe]

If being the operative word.

 

[whitstifier]

Does a LHD give and take passes on his backhand or doesn't he?

It's baffling as to why you're having so much difficulty with this. Sure, most D are better on their natural sides. Gostisbehere and Samheim have skill sets--plus skating, puck protection, and awareness--that make them exceptions to that trend. Sanheim has played RD in juniors for the past couple years. He and Bean have accounted for much of Calgary's offense over that time. He'll probably remain a RD in the AHL next season and the NHL the following season, since he's thrived on that side.

 

[Starat327]

Only Macdonald has horrible contract with negative value and is hardly an nhler... while Myers has been good to great for us, albeit recovering from surgery this offseason.

This is like saying, "can't afford Johnny Boychuk... Unless you take back David clarkson"

Just ridiculous to say even..

I'm sorry, can you enlighten me on what is 'ridiculous' about being cap compliant? I'm having trouble understanding what exactly is 'ridiculous' about wanting to operate within the rules of the game. Surely, I must be missing something.

 

[Weezeric]

I'm sorry, can you enlighten me on what is 'ridiculous' about being cap compliant? I'm having trouble understanding what exactly is 'ridiculous' about wanting to operate within the rules of the game. Surely, I must be missing something.

It's ridiculous to suggest that anyone would take on amac's contract, no matter how "legal" it would be. It's an albatross. If more salary can't be taken on that's fine. The deal won't happen.

 

[Starat327]

It's ridiculous to suggest that anyone would take on amac's contract, no matter how "legal" it would be. It's an albatross. If more salary can't be taken on that's fine. The deal won't happen.

I'm not sure what's difficult to understand about 'not being able to afford' Myers, which is what i stated. The only way that deal could go through is if we were able to give back an equal amount of salary. The only player that fits the cap hit, and position, is AMac. I wasnt suggesting that it be done, just that its the only way it could work. There is nothing ridiculous about that. Only on HF is logic considered 'ridiculous'.

The ridiculous thing to suggest was that it would be worthwhile for the Flyers to completely alter their roster for a prospect who is going to be an "expansion casualty" and a D man who is coming off of two major surgeries for one of the top D prospects in the world.

 

[whitstifier]

It's ridiculous to suggest that anyone would take on amac's contract, no matter how "legal" it would be. It's an albatross. If more salary can't be taken on that's fine. The deal won't happen.

MacDonald's contract is bad, but not nearly as bad as Clarkson's. MacDonald at fair value is probably worth around $3MM, Clarkson around $1.5MM. MacDonald's contract doesn't have a NMC or NTC like Clarkson's, and can actually get bought out for cap savings.

 

[broc]

I'm sorry, can you enlighten me on what is 'ridiculous' about being cap compliant? I'm having trouble understanding what exactly is 'ridiculous' about wanting to operate within the rules of the game. Surely, I must be missing something.

The ridiculousness is saying a team give up a good player with a great contract... And as part of the deal take back a horrible contract for a bad player.

Here, florida wants Brayden Schenn.. but you'll have to take back Dave Bolland. Just to malike the $$ work, ya know.

 

[NitHeel]

The ridiculousness is saying a team give up a good player with a great contract... And as part of the deal take back a horrible contract for a bad player.

Selective blindness?

I'm not sure what's difficult to understand about 'not being able to afford' Myers, which is what i stated. The only way that deal could go through is if we were able to give back an equal amount of salary. The only player that fits the cap hit, and position, is AMac. I wasnt suggesting that it be done, just that its the only way it could work. There is nothing ridiculous about that. Only on HF is logic considered 'ridiculous'.

The ridiculous thing to suggest was that it would be worthwhile for the Flyers to completely alter their roster for a prospect who is going to be an "expansion casualty" and a D man who is coming off of two major surgeries for one of the top D prospects in the world.

 

[Starat327]

The ridiculousness is saying a team give up a good player with a great contract... And as part of the deal take back a horrible contract for a bad player.

Here, florida wants Brayden Schenn.. but you'll have to take back Dave Bolland. Just to malike the $$ work, ya know.

I'm beginning to feel like i'm talking to a wall. Or in a foreign language. I'm not sure which.

Lots of trades these days are contingent on the other team taking back a contract to make it work for the first team. The contract isn't there to add value, its their simply to keep the receiving team compliant. This is called a cap dump.

Flyers can not afford whatever Myers cap hit is. So if the Jets were interested in acquiring Sanheim (because im willing to bet that the Flyers aren't calling the jets about Myers. This also assumes that the Flyers would be remotely interested in trading Sanheim, which is a whole different flaw in this proposal, but i digress), Andrew Macdonald, due to the fact that he has a cap hit roughly equivalent to Myers, as well as being one of the like, 8 nhl d man on our roster currently, would have to be included. Otherwise, the Flyers are over the cap, and have 9 NHL d-men on their roster. That isnt good, and leaves the Flyers in a pretty bad situation.

If thats a sticking point for the Jets organization, then no deal can be made. I made it very clear that the Jets probably shouldnt do that. I am in no way trying to 'sell' andrew macdonald. But the reality of the situation is that Andrew Macdonald would need to be included in any proposal bringing in another defender who is not on an ELC.

 

[Tripod]

Does a LHD give and take passes on his backhand or doesn't he?

So then why is a Trouba moving to the left side to do the exact same thing?

I still have no idea what your Yak comments mean. Sorry. Whatever you were trying to do there didn't work.

Read the below quote....

Sanheim had a dominant season in the whl last year. That's indisputable. When Tyler Myers was his age he was putting up a 48 point Calder season.... Connor is definitely a better prospect

....then I responded with this SARCASTICALLY.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tripod
Connor had a dominant season in college. That's undispuatable. When Yakupov was his age, he was putting up a 53 point pace Calder season.....Sanheim is definately a better prospect.

Got it now?

 

[Sasso09]

The problem being Sanheim is no where near as valuable as Connor

Lol stop it

 

[JetsHomer]

Lol stop it

Haha you think a guy that wasn't even a top 5 player in the WHL was better than the best player in the NCAA?

Not. Even. Close

 

[Curufinwe]

Sanheim led all CHL dmen in points per game and did so on a team with with very little forward talent.

 

[JetsHomer]

Sanheim led all CHL dmen in points per game and did so on a team with with very little forward talent.

This is a valid arguments. Certainly the best way to judge dmen is too look at their ppg pace

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

So then why is a Trouba moving to the left side to do the exact same thing?



Read the below quote....



....then I responded with this SARCASTICALLY.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tripod
Connor had a dominant season in college. That's undispuatable. When Yakupov was his age, he was putting up a 53 point pace Calder season.....Sanheim is definately a better prospect.

Got it now?

Trouba moving to the left is an adequate band-aid solution for the Jets. Adequate, not ideal. Preferrably only temporary.

You didn't answer the question. Is a D playing his off side hampered by making and receiving passes with his backhand or not?

Still don't get the Yak comment. Don't get the sarcastic claim of things that simply never happened either. Sorry.

Moving D to their off side sometimes works, sometimes doesn't. Some are successful at and some struggle. It can't be taken for granted that it will work out. Even when it works there is at least some small loss in effectiveness.

 

[tony d]

Seems like equal value to me here.

 

[Starat327]

This thread just needs to die. Nothing good has, or will come, out of this discussion.