Proposal: Flyers and Jets

[SnoopDogg]

Sabres fan here, why does Winnipeg need another defenseman?

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

It's fine if you aren't happy with Hagg as the basis for a trade for him (you shouldn't be), but please don't begin to think that there is any package with Lemieux as the main piece that gets you Sanheim. There is a wide chasm between their values that isn't made up by anything reasonable.

Also - Most of our LHD prospects have been playing on the right side with minimal issue, so the NEED to trade one for a RHD is a bit overblown. It would be great, yes. But not to the point where we are selling our prospects for pennies on the dollar to do it.

Fair enough. What would interest you in return for Sanheim? We could talk F prospects if that is your need. We could do a RHD. Keep in mind that we aren't looking to be taken to the cleaners and that Sanheim is still only a prospect though a good one. He is unproven at the NHL level so just keep it within reason.

 

[Hunter368]

While I'm not adverse to seeing the Jets trade assets for a top 4 LHD, Hagg is not the answer we have lots of depth guys and they're easy to find. Sooner keep Lemieux.

Anyone offers us a young top 4 LHD, then we can talk about a trade of some kind.

 

[Dabest]

While I'm not adverse to seeing the Jets trade assets for a top 4 LHD, Hagg is not the answer we have lots of depth guys and they're easy to find. Sooner keep Lemieux.

Anyone offers us a young top 4 LHD, then we can talk about a trade of some kind.

Who would offer an established young top 4 defenseman for a guy like Lemieux?

 

[Gecklund]

Who would offer an established young top 4 defenseman for a guy like Lemieux?

I think he means trade in general. Winnipeg would only make a trade for a quality young top 4 LHD.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Sabres fan here, why does Winnipeg need another defenseman?

We have 3 top 4 RHD and only 1 LHD and he is aging. We have 1 top 4 LHD prospect in our system who is near NHL ready. Nothing else on the horizon. This is forcing us to play Trouba on the left side. He has done well there but that is less than ideal. There is some hint that he may not like that.

The expansion draft is another factor. Right now we have to protect 4D which means we can only protect 4 F. If we could acquire an exempt LHD we could move Myers and only have to protect 3 D and therefore protect 7 F.

 

[Starat327]

Fair enough. What would interest you in return for Sanheim? We could talk F prospects if that is your need. We could do a RHD. Keep in mind that we aren't looking to be taken to the cleaners and that Sanheim is still only a prospect though a good one. He is unproven at the NHL level so just keep it within reason.

On paper, trading prospects seems like a good idea,as we both have depth at the other's need. But I'm not sure there's a good fit, that we'd all be agreeable to. Most Flyers fans dont see Sanheim as a step too far down from Provorov, so it'll be hard to find common ground. Sanheim has a little more risk, but also more reward.

My guess is this conversation goes something like this:

Flyers: For Sanheim? We want Ehlers or Connor.
Jets: LOL, you're crazy. You want them, we want Provorov.
Flyers: Lulz. Keep Dreaming, you want Provorov, better start talking Laine.

I'm not good at doing proposals - so I never do. But I imagine you won't find any flyers fans going below the Connor/Ehlers threshold for Sanheim. Even with Ghost and Provo around, Sanheim is still going to play a pretty integral piece to our future D core, if all pans out. The assumption is Ghost and Sanheim will get the PP Time, and Provorov, who is better defensively, will see more PK time. Who knows though. We're still a few years out from seeing what we really have.

 

[Hunter368]

Who would offer an established young top 4 defenseman for a guy like Lemieux?

Where did I say anything about trading Lemieux for a top 4. Read my post again, you read it wrong.

 

[JetsWillFly4Ever]

On paper, trading prospects seems like a good idea,as we both have depth at the other's need. But I'm not sure there's a good fit, that we'd all be agreeable to. Most Flyers fans dont see Sanheim as a step too far down from Provorov, so it'll be hard to find common ground. Sanheim has a little more risk, but also more reward.

My guess is this conversation goes something like this:

Flyers: For Sanheim? We want Ehlers or Connor.
Jets: LOL, you're crazy. You want them, we want Provorov.
Flyers: Lulz. Keep Dreaming, you want Provorov, better start talking Laine.

I'm not good at doing proposals - so I never do. But I imagine you won't find any flyers fans going below the Connor/Ehlers threshold for Sanheim. Even with Ghost and Provo around, Sanheim is still going to play a pretty integral piece to our future D core, if all pans out. The assumption is Ghost and Sanheim will get the PP Time, and Provorov, who is better defensively, will see more PK time. Who knows though. We're still a few years out from seeing what we really have.

I see this going the exact same way haha.

 

[Starat327]

I see this going the exact same way haha.

Just seems like a natural progression. I'm sure if a trade was done between the two teams along those lines (Sanheim + for Ehlers/Connor+), we'd all be reasonably content, but it would take some time to 'accept' it.

And no, i have no intention on speculating, or commenting on, what the+ would be from either side, lol.

 

[Toronto makebeleifs]

The value isn't awful, but why would the Jets need Hagg? Lemeuix is more valuable (to the Jets org) than Hagg would be. Now if it was armia, probably a different story.

 

[Hockeypete49]

I wouldn't do Morin for Lemieux myself as a Jets fan.

I as a Flyer's fan do not do that deal either. Morin, when ready is going to be a beast. Ron has to much invested in this young man. Hagg for Lemieux I do but doubt the jets do it.

 

[JetsWillFly4Ever]

Just seems like a natural progression. I'm sure if a trade was done between the two teams along those lines (Sanheim + for Ehlers/Connor+), we'd all be reasonably content, but it would take some time to 'accept' it.

And no, i have no intention on speculating, or commenting on, what the+ would be from either side, lol.

Yea, I don't think you'll find any Jets fan that would do Ehlers for Sanheim or even Sanheim+ without the + being significant. I would consider doing a deal around Connor and Sanheim but who knows what the + would have to be on either side, probably just better to stick with your own player at this point.

 

[Rebels57]

Hagg looks like a bust where Lemiuex looks like a top prospect though? Why do the Jets do it

Hagg does not look like a bust, but he isn't far enough along with a high enough ceiling for Winnipeg to part with Lemieux.

I don't see the Flyers-Jets as good partners on this one because the only LHD the Jets would be interested in from the Flyers would be worth way more than Lemieux (Ghost, Provorov, Sanheim, and Morin).

Guys like Mark Streit and Nick Schultz are too old and Andrew MacDonald is on a brutal contract and isn't worth trading Lemieux for even at 50% retained.

 

[Starat327]

Hagg does not look like a bust, but he isn't far enough along with a high enough ceiling for Winnipeg to part with Lemieux.

I don't see the Flyers-Jets as good partners on this one because the only LHD the Jets would be interested in from the Flyers would be worth way more than Lemieux (Ghost, Provorov, Sanheim, and Morin).

Guys like Mark Streit and Nick Schultz are too old and Andrew MacDonald is on a brutal contract and isn't worth trading Lemieux for even at 50% retained.

MDZ would be a pretty decent fit, actually. If people would realize he actually played pretty damn well last season, that is.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Who would offer an established young top 4 defenseman for a guy like Lemieux?

That's not what he said. He didn't specify 'established' and he didn't mention Lemieux.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

On paper, trading prospects seems like a good idea,as we both have depth at the other's need. But I'm not sure there's a good fit, that we'd all be agreeable to. Most Flyers fans dont see Sanheim as a step too far down from Provorov, so it'll be hard to find common ground. Sanheim has a little more risk, but also more reward.

My guess is this conversation goes something like this:

Flyers: For Sanheim? We want Ehlers or Connor.
Jets: LOL, you're crazy. You want them, we want Provorov.
Flyers: Lulz. Keep Dreaming, you want Provorov, better start talking Laine.

I'm not good at doing proposals - so I never do. But I imagine you won't find any flyers fans going below the Connor/Ehlers threshold for Sanheim. Even with Ghost and Provo around, Sanheim is still going to play a pretty integral piece to our future D core, if all pans out. The assumption is Ghost and Sanheim will get the PP Time, and Provorov, who is better defensively, will see more PK time. Who knows though. We're still a few years out from seeing what we really have.

Nailed it.

With Ghost and Provo you should have Hagg/other for your 3rd pair. Sanheim would be wasted there. He is valuable but surplus.

OTOH he could bring you a good asset for use somewhere else. Most Jets fans probably disagree with me but I think he is worth Myers. Or we could talk wingers not named Ehlers, Laine or Connor. Maybe a package.

 

[Starat327]

Nailed it.

With Ghost and Provo you should have Hagg/other for your 3rd pair. Sanheim would be wasted there. He is valuable but surplus.

OTOH he could bring you a good asset for use somewhere else. Most Jets fans probably disagree with me but I think he is worth Myers. Or we could talk wingers not named Ehlers, Laine or Connor. Maybe a package.

As I said, if those three names aren't involved, there isn't anything worth discussing from our end. Sanheim is seen as a blue chip prospect here, just like Provorov.

Sanheim and Provorov both played some RD this past year, and didn't look too terrible, from what i'm told(maybe someone up there can elaborate?). Ghost was also playing RD last year, and we know that he didn't do too bad either. It Probably looks something more like this if all goes to plan:

Ghost - Provo
Sanheim - Morin
Meyer/Gudas -Alt/Friedman/AMac (sadly).

EDIT: Not to mention, there's no reason to rush it. We really don't know what we have. Provorov looks like a lock, but what if it goes sideways after we trade away Sanheim? I'd much rather let them all develop and see what happens. If it works out, and everyone hits their ceiling, we have a spare top 4/2 D man to trade off. Those are worth more than a prospect who could get there. If it doesnt pan out, well, that's the risk you take with prospects. But we can afford to wait.

 

[Curufinwe]

MDZ would be a pretty decent fit, actually. If people would realize he actually played pretty damn well last season, that is.

MDZ for Stuart + Lemieux.

 

[Jack de la Hoya]

MDZ for Stuart + Lemieux.

Unless they can't sign MDZ, that selling low IMO

 

[Tripod]

As I said, if those three names aren't involved, there isn't anything worth discussing from our end. Sanheim is seen as a blue chip prospect here, just like Provorov.

Sanheim and Provorov both played some RD this past year, and didn't look too terrible, from what i'm told(maybe someone up there can elaborate?). Ghost was also playing RD last year, and we know that he didn't do too bad either. It Probably looks something more like this if all goes to plan:

Ghost - Provo
Sanheim - Morin
Meyer/Gudas -Alt/Friedman/AMac (sadly).

EDIT: Not to mention, there's no reason to rush it. We really don't know what we have. Provorov looks like a lock, but what if it goes sideways after we trade away Sanheim? I'd much rather let them all develop and see what happens. If it works out, and everyone hits their ceiling, we have a spare top 4/2 D man to trade off. Those are worth more than a prospect who could get there. If it doesnt pan out, well, that's the risk you take with prospects. But we can afford to wait.

You have the pairings backwards. For 2017/18

LD RD
MDZ Ghost
Provy Gudas
Morin Sanheim

This is assuming MDZ is re-signed of course.

Ghost has more than proven he can play the right side as he played it all year. So that leaves Sanheim who played all year on the right side this year with Bean on the left.

The Flyers don't need to moved any of Provy, Sanheim, Ghost or Morin. All could be in the lineup in 2017. Then as Myers or Friedman progresses, they could take Gudas's roster spot, but start on the 3rd pairing and others move up.

Having 2 guys who can play either side gives us lots of options.

And really, with Konecny close to making he team and then with Lindblom and Aube Kubel close too, I personally don't see the need for a winger. Personally, I would much rather look to add a #3 C that I can trust to bridge the gap until Rubstov is ready.

 

[Gabe Kupari]

MDZ for Stuart + Lemieux.

Why do the jets do this? Stuart sucks but he's not worth trading if it means losing a guy on his elc who they specifically wanted in the Kane deal for a guy who is ufa in a year.

Jets easily say no. It's not even close actually

 

[Curufinwe]

Why do the jets do this? Stuart sucks but he's not worth trading if it means losing a guy on his elc who they specifically wanted in the Kane deal for a guy who is ufa in a year.

Jets easily say no. It's not even close actually

Because they want to make the playoffs but their current LHD situation is terrible, Stuart still has two years left, and MDZ will have value at the deadline if they don't expect to keep him.

 

[Gabe Kupari]

Because they want to make the playoffs but their current LHD situation is terrible, Stuart still has two years left, and MDZ will have value at the deadline if they don't expect to keep him.

Bottom line.... Jets won't give up a guy on his elc for a soon to be ufa

It won't happen. Lemieux is NOT available

The LHD problem is exaggerated.

Jets top 4 will be buff myers trouba Toby.

 

[Starat327]

You have the pairings backwards. For 2017/18

LD RD
MDZ Ghost
Provy Gudas
Morin Sanheim

This is assuming MDZ is re-signed of course.

Ghost has more than proven he can play the right side as he played it all year. So that leaves Sanheim who played all year on the right side this year with Bean on the left.

The Flyers don't need to moved any of Provy, Sanheim, Ghost or Morin. All could be in the lineup in 2017. Then as Myers or Friedman progresses, they could take Gudas's roster spot, but start on the 3rd pairing and others move up.

Having 2 guys who can play either side gives us lots of options.

And really, with Konecny close to making he team and then with Lindblom and Aube Kubel close too, I personally don't see the need for a winger. Personally, I would much rather look to add a #3 C that I can trust to bridge the gap until Rubstov is ready.

I was planning on the assumption that MDZ is not resigned, as he may become a bit redundant with the influx of talent. I think it also depends on where we stand this year, and what the goal is. I could easily see MDZ traded with some retention for a decent return at the deadline if he continues his play from last year.

I was also looking a little further down the road than just the next year or two, as we aren't really sure if any of the 'kids' will be ready for top-line duty next year. Your point stands though.

But yes, you are correct, I clearly don't know my left from right anymore. Lol,