Five members from Canada’s 2018 world junior team (Hart, McLeod, Dube, Foote and Formenton) told to surrender to police, facing sexual assault charges

[The Grim Reaper]

Third shift mods reporting for thread duty

 

[Hank Plank]

Again I ask, if nothing happened, why is there a police investigation and criminal charges coming?

How much did you think about this before posting?

 

[HockeyGuy1964]

5 eh?
Weird.

 

[LokiDog]

Again I ask, if nothing happened, why is there a police investigation and criminal charges coming?

I don’t think anyone said nothing happened. But if consent was given multiple times and it’s only after the fact that you regret being a bit… adventurous last night… it’s happened plenty of times in the past. Not to mention there’s a life changing amount of money at stake when you’re dealing with professional athletes. Remember the Patrick Kane fiasco years ago with like the stolen rape kit that the girls mom removed from the hospital and they found it at her house and stuff? I’m not saying nothing happened - the writing on the wall seems to be pretty evident that at least a couple of these guys will indeed be charged with legitimate crimes - and I hope that all of the involved parties get what they deserve, but addressing your question semantically, women have regretted behaviors in the past and used their regret to bring about accusations of non-consent which were eventually proven to be untrue.

 

[Maplebeasts]

Everyone charged criminally is guilty? Wow.

Never knew that.

Not necessarily. People are not charged criminally unless the police/prosecution have evidence. This is not the kind of situation where the players are going to come out looking good either way. The players themselves obviously had a guilty conscience or else they wouldn't have felt the need to try and film consent.

 

[Hank Plank]

Not necessarily. People are not charged criminally unless the police/prosecution have evidence. This is not the kind of situation where the players are going to come out looking good either way. The players themselves obviously had a guilty conscience or else they wouldn't have felt the need to try and film consent.

Better hope you are never on the wrong end of this kind of thinking.

 

[LokiDog]

Not necessarily. People are not charged criminally unless the police/prosecution have evidence. This is not the kind of situation where the players are going to come out looking good either way. The players themselves obviously had a guilty conscience or else they wouldn't have felt the need to try and film consent.

By the same token, say you’re Connor McDavid or Patrick Mahomes and single. The smartest thing in the world that you could do is get explicit, provable consent from every single woman you ever touch because in an instant a steamy night can turn into - at minimum - your reputation being drug through the mud and at worst seriously damage or end your career. So you could say that filming consent on multiple instances was the right thing to do.

 

[Maplebeasts]

I don’t think anyone said nothing happened. But if consent was given multiple times and it’s only after the fact that you regret being a bit… adventurous last night… it’s happened plenty of times in the past. Not to mention there’s a life changing amount of money at stake when you’re dealing with professional athletes. Remember the Patrick Kane fiasco years ago with like the stolen rape kit that the girls mom removed from the hospital and they found it at her house and stuff? I’m not saying nothing happened - the writing on the wall seems to be pretty evident that at least a couple of these guys will indeed be charged with legitimate crimes - and I hope that all of the involved parties get what they deserve, but addressing your question semantically, women have regretted behaviors in the past and used their regret to bring about accusations of non-consent which were eventually proven to be untrue.

This makes sense. I don't think it's fair to label the players involved as rapists until they have their day in court, but there is genuinely no way they come out of this looking good guilty verdict or not. The sexual acts definitely happened, the girl definitely went to the police and claimed she was raped, the players definitely recorded themselves getting consent, and then again later. At best they displayed terrible judgement, at worst they are criminals.

Better hope you are never on the wrong end of this kind of thinking.

Not yet thankfully.

 

[Tobias Kahun]

If it was consensual, there wouldn't be an investigation and pending charges. Anyone in her shoes would say anything to get out of that room safely.

That's not always the case, it could be one thing and she could say another.

Not the case here though I dont think.

like I said early. Google this guy name Kyle Rittenhouse who was charged with murder and there was video evidence.

Damn your mind will be blown on the results of the court case. It will open your mind up.

I feel like most people who follow the news know of who and what happened in that case.

 

[Hank Plank]

Johnny Depp.

 

[Maplebeasts]

I think the point I'm trying to make is that criminal charges require a certain baseline of proof. Investigations are a thorough process involving physical evidence and testimony. London police did the work and determined that there was a sufficient amount of proof to bring charges forward. You are allowed to think the players involved did it, so long as you can acknowledge that they are innocent if the courts find them so.

 

[ZachaFlockaFlame]

Next level garbage from the Devils

 

[Hank Plank]

I think the point I'm trying to make is that criminal charges require a certain baseline of proof. Investigations are a thorough process involving physical evidence and testimony. London police did the work and determined that there was a sufficient amount of proof to bring charges forward. You are allowed to think the players involved did it, so long as you can acknowledge that they are innocent if the courts find them so.

Proof is determined in a court of law.

 

[TheNumber4]

Alleged vitcim passes a lie detector on the events that happened but according to a TSN article there is video and texts proving it was consensual.

Police believe they have enough evidence to press charges

One thing that stood our for me was this statement

E.M. describing it in the following way: ‘I don’t want to be doing this anymore,’ but also did not verbalize it to the guys inside the hotel room.

E.M. told police that no one physically stopped her from leaving the room.

In one six-second video recorded at about 3:25 am, an unidentified player asks E.M., “You’re okay with this”

“I’m okay with this,” she responds.

A second video, 12 seconds long, was filmed at 4:26 am.

“Are you recording me?” E.M. said on the video. “Okay, good. It was all consensual. You are so paranoid. Holy. I enjoyed it. It was fine. It was all consensual.


Why does it sound like it was consensual sex?

This is gonna be longgggg trial.

 

[Gregor Samsa]

I don’t think anyone said nothing happened. But if consent was given multiple times and it’s only after the fact that you regret being a bit… adventurous last night… it’s happened plenty of times in the past. Not to mention there’s a life changing amount of money at stake when you’re dealing with professional athletes. Remember the Patrick Kane fiasco years ago with like the stolen rape kit that the girls mom removed from the hospital and they found it at her house and stuff? I’m not saying nothing happened - the writing on the wall seems to be pretty evident that at least a couple of these guys will indeed be charged with legitimate crimes - and I hope that all of the involved parties get what they deserve, but addressing your question semantically, women have regretted behaviors in the past and used their regret to bring about accusations of non-consent which were eventually proven to be untrue.

What if she was scared? The whole interaction was extremely skeevy and awkward at absolute best. I don’t think this whole thing comes about if it’s simply regret. This was some weird degenerate shit that went down

 

[TheNumber4]

oilers winning the mcdavid lottery.

Oh yeh what a dark day. He should have gone to Toronto, where the media could have ran his dads name through the ground and where he could have won no playoffs series and probably lost out on a lot of hall of fame hardware too.

 

[ZachaFlockaFlame]

Alleged vitcim passes a lie detector on the events that happened but according to a TSN article there is video and texts proving it was consensual.

Police believe they have enough evidence to press charges

One thing that stood our for me was this statement

E.M. describing it in the following way: ‘I don’t want to be doing this anymore,’ but also did not verbalize it to the guys inside the hotel room.

E.M. told police that no one physically stopped her from leaving the room.

In one six-second video recorded at about 3:25 am, an unidentified player asks E.M., “You’re okay with this”

“I’m okay with this,” she responds.

A second video, 12 seconds long, was filmed at 4:26 am.

“Are you recording me?” E.M. said on the video. “Okay, good. It was all consensual. You are so paranoid. Holy. I enjoyed it. It was fine. It was all consensual.


Why does it sound like it was consensual sex?

You can't use those as evidence in a criminal case

 

[Spawn]

Better hope you are never on the wrong end of this kind of thinking.

How hard do you think it is to not participate in a gang bang with someone so intoxicated that they're slurring their speech?

 

[ZachaFlockaFlame]

This whole situation is ugly.

Like many sexual assault cases this could be a my-word-against-yours situation. We may never see closure here and if we do get names they will be stained in the eyes of many even without a conviction

That's not how criminal cases work, you don't bring up these cases without evidence since the entire burden of proof is on the prosecution. If it was civil then yeah

 

[Hank Plank]

How hard do you think it is to not participate in a gang bang with someone so intoxicated that they're slurring their speech?

WAIT until everyone has their day in court. Stop assuming, unless you want a certain thing to have happened.

 

[toddkaz]

You can't use those as evidence in a criminal case

I am just quoting the TSN article. I never said anything about using it in a court of law.

 

[Mark Stones Spleen]

For a second I was thinking maybe the NHLs new mental health program is now getting players actually getting help for their problems....

That's what they wanted you to think.

 

[ZachaFlockaFlame]

By the same token, say you’re Connor McDavid or Patrick Mahomes and single. The smartest thing in the world that you could do is get explicit, provable consent from every single woman you ever touch because in an instant a steamy night can turn into - at minimum - your reputation being drug through the mud and at worst seriously damage or end your career. So you could say that filming consent on multiple instances was the right thing to do.

I mean, can we be honest here? We know when something is over the line with a random hookup. I feel like people who say that "every athlete should watch their back" don't understand social cues, you can tell when another person is super uneasy about a situation.

 

[Gregor Samsa]

The law and the public are two different thing. If there are rumors that a creepy dude down the street is a pedophile even though he’s never been convicted, no one would let their children near him. If someone constantly has to look towards the law to make judgment calls, they’ll run into trouble. Maybe more will be released that show the defendants in a better light but right now it doesn’t pass the smell test.

 

[Spawn]

WAIT until everyone has their day in court. Stop assuming, unless you want a certain thing to have happened.

I'm not assuming anything. I'm referring strictly to what has been reported.