Fire Shanahan/Dubas (Yay or Nay)

[Cobra777]

Dang almost a week after the loss, Im still pissed, I do not trust the management, the coaches, or the players at this point, what a disgrace....

don't blame ya one bit bro, I'm still angry with this whole ball of wax that will not get fixed and management and half the peeps here not honest with themselves about certain players.

Mitch Marner gets bounced off the puck too easy and is not effective when post season hockey gets very physical and time and space are taken away, makes too many errors and give aways because he tries to force passes and plays of low percentage value. Seen in previous series in the past and some reg season very tight checking games. Again because of points and stats reg season management does not want to come to terms with reality

Willy although he stepped up this series granted with goals and overall play has the skills and ability skating, puck possession, shot and now size at 200lbs.to be a dominant force when he decides to play hard but sorry too many times has disappeared and is a non factor in previous yrs. of play off rounds in past, because lets be honest he does not totally embrace the physical play either, even this series I wish I could show some vids of him glaringly pulling up from being 1st to a puck because he was going to get hit but then correct himself and get into some dirty areas. Reg season guilty of too many one handed stick checks and fly by's but puts up points and goals and like Kovalev used to do, show up when he decided to. Not just me but hockey pundits after games and during intermissions throughout seasons have pointed this out.

Quite a few guys on the team just don't want to finish with a hard body check to make their opponents cough up the puck and make a mistake hearing skates coming and let other teams off the hook and I can't figure out why this team seems so squeemish to do that which is part of fundamental post season high adrenaline hockey.

AM has incorporated taking the body this series which is nice to see because he is of decent size or he was frustrated

Now problem is many will argue Nylander this, that and everything I stated but pls. take off the rose glasses and be honest.

Some here do watch other playoff hockey and intensity levels are far superior and every time someone touches the puck they get hammered with a check take no prisoners style of hockey with a pace of up and down hockey that is just a pleasure to behold. Our series against Mtl looked more like a regular season series but yet again their defense and forwards knocked us around and blanketed our offense and capitalized on their chances.

Can't win no cup with this formula, can't even get passed one round. Either this core grows a pair and gets physically stronger and mentally and physically engaged in what it takes to fight through and play post season hockey with a never satisfied hunger or you simply have to move on.

Question is, is it possible for this group to attain that mindset in the very near future? They have to date obviously not shown that

Coaching at very least should be changed, not that Keefe is totally bad but we need to find a coach that is a tactician that has had success to hold respect, creates a positive atmosphere for success, and has bonifide systems in place to counter other teams and holds players not willing accountable with no meddling in those areas from our GM. Having a rookie coach is not the high percentage to get this damn monkey off our back even though he had a good reg season.

 

[Menzinger]

Please read the tax code. He has to file his taxes in the place he makes his money. Canada is not as lenient as the U.S. in allowing bogus write-offs. Check it out. Taxes are just another reason sports guys hate playing in Canada.

I'd suggest you do the same. It's much more complicated than you're saying here.

Auston Matthews Shoots and Scores Tax Savings | Crowe Soberman LLP

Again, things like residency duration in a country + the form of income (ie signing bonuses vs salary) can play a large factor in determining a players tax liability. The fact that Matthews spends most of the year in the US plus the fact he has huge bonuses will significantly reduce the amount of taxes he will pay. His total amount due is likely nowhere near where you were suggesting earlier.


.

 

[mikeyz]

Yeah the Leafs haven't come back from multi goal deficits in any important games recently.

How many of those games did they win?

 

[rumman]

It pretty much happens every single playoffs every year, everyone likes to act like the leafs lost cause of this or the leafs were out coached or this is why the leafs lost.

Sometimes the other team is just better and yeah it would have been nice to make it another round, but it wouldn't matter if they don't win the cup.

Any who tear the team apart, keep whichever prospect which hasn't played yet because he will be the greatest player ever until he isn't, get players other teams are willing to trade because they are just amazing until they aren't, whatever you do don't keep trying with what you have cause what can loyalty and continuing to try ever get you.

 

[rumman]

Dang almost a week after the loss, Im still pissed, I do not trust the management, the coaches, or the players at this point, what a disgrace....

Without change, nothing changes......

 

[rumman]

don't blame ya one bit bro, I'm still angry with this whole ball of wax that will not get fixed and management and half the peeps here not honest with themselves about certain players.

Mitch Marner gets bounced off the puck too easy and is not effective when post season hockey gets very physical and time and space are taken away, makes too many errors and give aways because he tries to force passes and plays of low percentage value. Seen in previous series in the past and some reg season very tight checking games. Again because of points and stats reg season management does not want to come to terms with reality

Willy although he stepped up this series granted with goals and overall play has the skills and ability skating, puck possession, shot and now size at 200lbs.to be a dominant force when he decides to play hard but sorry too many times has disappeared and is a non factor in previous yrs. of play off rounds in past, because lets be honest he does not totally embrace the physical play either, even this series I wish I could show some vids of him glaringly pulling up from being 1st to a puck because he was going to get hit but then correct himself and get into some dirty areas. Reg season guilty of too many one handed stick checks and fly by's but puts up points and goals and like Kovalev used to do, show up when he decided to. Not just me but hockey pundits after games and during intermissions throughout seasons have pointed this out.

Quite a few guys on the team just don't want to finish with a hard body check to make their opponents cough up the puck and make a mistake hearing skates coming and let other teams off the hook and I can't figure out why this team seems so squeemish to do that which is part of fundamental post season high adrenaline hockey.

AM has incorporated taking the body this series which is nice to see because he is of decent size or he was frustrated

Now problem is many will argue Nylander this, that and everything I stated but pls. take off the rose glasses and be honest.

Some here do watch other playoff hockey and intensity levels are far superior and every time someone touches the puck they get hammered with a check take no prisoners style of hockey with a pace of up and down hockey that is just a pleasure to behold. Our series against Mtl looked more like a regular season series but yet again their defense and forwards knocked us around and blanketed our offense and capitalized on their chances.

Can't win no cup with this formula, can't even get passed one round. Either this core grows a pair and gets physically stronger and mentally and physically engaged in what it takes to fight through and play post season hockey with a never satisfied hunger or you simply have to move on.

Question is, is it possible for this group to attain that mindset in the very near future? They have to date obviously not shown that

Coaching at very least should be changed, not that Keefe is totally bad but we need to find a coach that is a tactician that has had success to hold respect, creates a positive atmosphere for success, and has bonifide systems in place to counter other teams and holds players not willing accountable with no meddling in those areas from our GM. Having a rookie coach is not the high percentage to get this damn monkey off our back even though he had a good reg season.

Word......dead bang on.

 

[Racer88]

As the Habs sail through the Jets like a hot knife thru butter I would fire both those loser before noon today.
It blows my mind that people on here still defend this entire team and management.
Incompetent management and a whole team of delusional heartless players.
The entire group disgust me

 

[17 Clark]

I don’t think this gets said enough. Both of there press conf was like taking gasoline and pouring it over a raging fire. It was “Kyle and the coaches were excellent” and “we will keep the core intact”. I mean did these guys not go to PR school? You haven’t won a playoff round in 17years, 5 consecutive 1st rd exits where one was a play in so you didn’t even make the playoffs against an inferior Columbus team, and you blew a 3-1 lead against the Montreal canadiens. And all you come up with is defiance, let’s stay the course, everyone is doing great! They didn’t need to come out and single out anyone, but they could have said especially shanahan, “we are dissapointed as much as the fans, we had high expectations, we fell short, and so I will do a review of the organization from coaches to players and make the necessary adjustments to try and meet those goals”. Was that so hard to say!?? FML

Five first round exit Last year was on the qualifier it wasn’t even the playoffs if I remember right so it’s even worse I don’t think they made the playoffs last year am I wrong

 

[pld459666]

Not sure how Dubas gets a pass here.

Hes no less responsible for the failures of the Franchise as is Shanny or the players.

How many 1st round exits?

Both need to get gone.

 

[17 Clark]

don't blame ya one bit bro, I'm still angry with this whole ball of wax that will not get fixed and management and half the peeps here not honest with themselves about certain players.

Mitch Marner gets bounced off the puck too easy and is not effective when post season hockey gets very physical and time and space are taken away, makes too many errors and give aways because he tries to force passes and plays of low percentage value. Seen in previous series in the past and some reg season very tight checking games. Again because of points and stats reg season management does not want to come to terms with reality

Willy although he stepped up this series granted with goals and overall play has the skills and ability skating, puck possession, shot and now size at 200lbs.to be a dominant force when he decides to play hard but sorry too many times has disappeared and is a non factor in previous yrs. of play off rounds in past, because lets be honest he does not totally embrace the physical play either, even this series I wish I could show some vids of him glaringly pulling up from being 1st to a puck because he was going to get hit but then correct himself and get into some dirty areas. Reg season guilty of too many one handed stick checks and fly by's but puts up points and goals and like Kovalev used to do, show up when he decided to. Not just me but hockey pundits after games and during intermissions throughout seasons have pointed this out.

Quite a few guys on the team just don't want to finish with a hard body check to make their opponents cough up the puck and make a mistake hearing skates coming and let other teams off the hook and I can't figure out why this team seems so squeemish to do that which is part of fundamental post season high adrenaline hockey.

AM has incorporated taking the body this series which is nice to see because he is of decent size or he was frustrated

Now problem is many will argue Nylander this, that and everything I stated but pls. take off the rose glasses and be honest.

Some here do watch other playoff hockey and intensity levels are far superior and every time someone touches the puck they get hammered with a check take no prisoners style of hockey with a pace of up and down hockey that is just a pleasure to behold. Our series against Mtl looked more like a regular season series but yet again their defense and forwards knocked us around and blanketed our offense and capitalized on their chances.

Can't win no cup with this formula, can't even get passed one round. Either this core grows a pair and gets physically stronger and mentally and physically engaged in what it takes to fight through and play post season hockey with a never satisfied hunger or you simply have to move on.

Question is, is it possible for this group to attain that mindset in the very near future? They have to date obviously not shown that

Coaching at very least should be changed, not that Keefe is totally bad but we need to find a coach that is a tactician that has had success to hold respect, creates a positive atmosphere for success, and has bonifide systems in place to counter other teams and holds players not willing accountable with no meddling in those areas from our GM. Having a rookie coach is not the high percentage to get this damn monkey off our back even though he had a good reg season.

I totally agree with your the post but the one problem is if they find a coach that tries to teach them by Toughlove they’ll stop playing and he’ll get fired who would want to coach here If you’re sitting on pins and needles ask yourself that

 

[ottomaddox]

It used to be that all leaf fans were interested in was tanking and drafting high to "right this ship". A lot it was reactionary because some of the previous GM's traded draft picks (no salary cap), and then 2 GMs refused to acknowledge the salary cap. In comes Shinny (Shanahan) and then eventually Duabs (Dubas). Shinny promises a new era. Long term pain for for a better future. So Kyle Duabs is left to his own devices to sign young up and coming stars/UFAs. Now we are back to a sweet combination of a GM ignoring the salary cap and trading away 1st round draft picks. How the Hell did we get here again? We have very little money to fill out the roster and very few draft picks! I can't believe it.

 

[justashadowof]

Back in 2016 this franchise really had a vibe of the Chicago Blackhawks circa 2009. They had these great young scoring forwards plus several above average experienced star/support forwards (JVR, Bozak, Kadri, Komarov). The defense was a little scattered. This doesn't usually happen when a team makes a big leap due an influx of young talent. It was a marvellous opportunity that got wasted over 3 seasons.

 

[sparxx87]

I totally agree with your the post but the one problem is if they find a coach that tries to teach them by Toughlove they’ll stop playing and he’ll get fired who would want to coach here If you’re sitting on pins and needles ask yourself that

This was always the danger with firing Babcock after they paid big money for kids who hadn’t won anything, shipped out veterans, then promptly quit on the coach. Even if you wanted a new warden, they still needed a warden. Inmates can’t run the asylum.

Major red flags should have been visible to all.

To this day, their performance in Kaskisuo’s one and only NHL start is the most disgraceful effort I’ve ever seen. Contrast that with a team like Carolina and a Zamboni driver in net - 20 players committed to doing whatever necessary to help him.

 

[Superstar]

Yeah the Leafs haven't come back from multi goal deficits in any important games recently.

How does a team lack the fortitude, will and desire to put an opponent away after being up 3-1 in a series? It's ridiculous...the Leafs spotted the Habs 3-0, 2-0 and 3-0 leads in elimination games...that's unacceptable.

 

[justashadowof]

This was always the danger with firing Babcock after they paid big money for kids who hadn’t won anything, shipped out veterans, then promptly quit on the coach. Even if you wanted a new warden, they still needed a warden. Inmates can’t run the asylum.

Major red flags should have been visible to all.

To this day, their performance in Kaskisuo’s one and only NHL start is the most disgraceful effort I’ve ever seen. Contrast that with a team like Carolina and a Zamboni driver in net - 20 players committed to doing whatever necessary to help him.

Thanks for that reminder. There just doesn't seem to be any rallying around a cause in this team's DNA. A rookie goalie in over his head gets a defeated performance from the team. They don't instinctively swarm and chase after the opposition goes after one of the star players. Most of the time they turn and skate away then leave it to the current paid mercenary to handle. The young stars seem to be an island to themselves able to share a little joy during good times with their teammates but not that sacrifice or disregard for personal safety that kicks in with competitive talents.

 

[Garthinater]

Back in 2016 this franchise really had a vibe of the Chicago Blackhawks circa 2009. They had these great young scoring forwards plus several above average experienced star/support forwards (JVR, Bozak, Kadri, Komarov). The defense was a little scattered. This doesn't usually happen when a team makes a big leap due an influx of young talent. It was a marvellous opportunity that got wasted over 3 seasons.

I had a lot of hope for this team back in 2016. Over the next 2 years we made the playoffs and improved both seasons. Even set a franchise record.

Fast forward 3 years and we still haven't won a round, maxed out cap, bottom 3rd prospect pool, barely any draft picks, etc.

Why do 50% still want to keep a perennial loser here in charge? How much more damage do you want him to do?

 

[DuklaNation]

2 months after being GM: Matt Martin for Eoman McAdam. LOL, a sign of things to come.

Connor Brown thrown into a salary dump deal. These 2 alone would make the team so much better. But is a symptom of meeting the core's salary demands.

Who's to blame? Dubas.

 

[ToneDog]

2 months after being GM: Matt Martin for Eoman McAdam. LOL, a sign of things to come.

Connor Brown thrown into a salary dump deal. These 2 alone would make the team so much better. But is a symptom of meeting the core's salary demands.

Who's to blame? Dubas.

Cleared the decks that summer in order to overplay a small, winger with no shot and no playoff goals in 18 straight games and paint himself in a corner. Thanks Kyle.

 

[All Mod Cons]

2 months after being GM: Matt Martin for Eoman McAdam. LOL, a sign of things to come.

Connor Brown thrown into a salary dump deal. These 2 alone would make the team so much better. But is a symptom of meeting the core's salary demands.

Who's to blame? Dubas.

These European UFAs seem like a waste of time as well. Apparently we keep signing the best (insert position here) outside of the NHL and they turn out to be extremely mediocre. Not sure it's a tactic worth pursuing.

 

[justashadowof]

Wasn't Matt Martin traded at the behest of Babcock? I remember almost no one believing Martin could contribute to the team. How wrong they were.

 

[Menzinger]

Wasn't Matt Martin traded at the behest of Babcock? I remember almost no one believing Martin could contribute to the team. How wrong they were.

Martin was a mid-season healthy scratch by Babcock while Lou was still GM. It's a bit funny how it get misremembered that Dubas' drove him out of town.

 

[egd27]

To this day, their performance in Kaskisuo’s one and only NHL start is the most disgraceful effort I’ve ever seen. Contrast that with a team like Carolina and a Zamboni driver in net - 20 players committed to doing whatever necessary to help him.

Add JT's return to the Island to your list

 

[socko]

Back in 2016 this franchise really had a vibe of the Chicago Blackhawks circa 2009. They had these great young scoring forwards plus several above average experienced star/support forwards (JVR, Bozak, Kadri, Komarov). The defense was a little scattered. This doesn't usually happen when a team makes a big leap due an influx of young talent. It was a marvellous opportunity that got wasted over 3 seasons.

It's almost like someone planted a macro-virus in our spreadsheet.

 

[sparxx87]

Add JT's return to the Island to your list

so many.

I started to write a list of all the ‘wtf’ moments where Dubas clearly exposed his fundamental lack of understanding but my mobile browser refreshed somewhere in the 20’s and I was too annoyed to start again.

I might do that again later on desktop.

 

[justashadowof]

It's almost like someone planted a macro-virus in our spreadsheet.

Lou's on the Island waiting for the Bitcoin ransom to be paid.