Speculation: Fire Glen Sather

[Bleed Ranger Blue]

What about Renney? I don't think the style of play was drastically different. What changed is that, for a couple of seasons, the level of skill and talent was at least respectable. Renney never had that. Renney's teams had a couple of players and a ton of garbage.

I almost put Renney - I enjoyed the job he did here with a lot of crap. But he always seemed to come off a professorial yes-man who was just happy to have an NHL head-coaching job.

One thing that Renney and Tortorella have in common is that Sather ****ed up the rosters/character they tried to build so badly, that both were victims of ill-advised player mutinies.

 

[SingnBluesOnBroadway]

I almost put Renney - I enjoyed the job he did here with a lot of crap. But he always seemed to come off a professorial yes-man who was just happy to have an NHL head-coaching job.

One thing that Renney and Tortorella have in common is that Sather ****ed up the rosters/character they tried to build so badly, that both were victims of ill-advised player mutinies.

If you want to go back, for right or for wrong, Renney and Torts were asked to do different jobs. Renney was wonderful at injecting youth into the lineup, restoring a sense of pride to the jersey, never getting too high or too low, and being classy. He caught lightning in a bottle with the Straka-Nylander-Jagr line and Lundqvist becoming more than anyone could have foreseen.

Torts was asked to take the team and move it forward. The Keenan to Renney's Roger Nielson.

 

[Brooklyn Rangers Fan]

I almost put Renney - I enjoyed the job he did here with a lot of crap. But he always seemed to come off a professorial yes-man who was just happy to have an NHL head-coaching job.

One thing that Renney and Tortorella have in common is that Sather ****ed up the rosters/character they tried to build so badly, that both were victims of ill-advised player mutinies.

The difference being that Torts was a bully, a clown and just an all-around *******. And whether or not that bothers you as much as it does me, the fact is that those guys ALWAYS have a short shelf life, regardless of how well the team performs under them initially. The only exception I have ever seen to this rule is Tom Coughlin - and that was because he was actually able to effect a personality change to somewhat de-*******-ify himself and, in so doing, keep his job.

 

[Off Sides]

Tanking is not the answer when you just signed a goaltender for $60M.

Re-tooling is. This team should sell anything thats not nailed down at the deadline.

Girardi, Callahan, Del Zotto, Brassard, Boyle -- buh-bye.

If the by-product is tanking into a high draft pick, great. But tanking shouldn't be the strategy here.

Which is why the Lundqvist contract bothers me so much, it basically is saying the Rangers are never going to sell or rebuild and will only retool when forced to because of free agents walking out or coming in.

 

[KreiMeARiver*]

Which is why the Lundqvist contract bothers me so much, it basically is saying the Rangers are never going to sell or rebuild and will only retool when forced to because of free agents walking out or coming in.

dude he's the best goalie the team has ever had. We are an original 6 team. that's a long time. get it?

 

[Bleed Ranger Blue]

Which is why the Lundqvist contract bothers me so much, it basically is saying the Rangers are never going to sell or rebuild and will only retool when forced to because of free agents walking out or coming in.

Regardless of the Lundqvist contract, an organizational plan to tank should be an absolute last resort. Something that is enacted when theres absolutely no bright spots on the roster to build around. That was the case for the Rangers in 2004, then Sather went and traded for/kept Jagr like an idiot, but thats besides the point.

The Rangers have some pieces to re-tool around. But a total tank? No. That'd be the equivalent of buying a lottery ticket. People love to point to Pittsburgh and Chicago now, but don't really think about just how badly they sucked for a long time. And those are the shining examples, what about teams like the Oilers, Islanders, and Panthers who have had higher picks in the draft year after year and STILL stink?

 

[Ail]

Tanking is not the answer when you just signed a goaltender for $60M.

Re-tooling is. This team should sell anything thats not nailed down at the deadline.

Girardi, Callahan, Del Zotto, Brassard, Boyle -- buh-bye.

If the by-product is tanking into a high draft pick, great. But tanking shouldn't be the strategy here.

That's what I am getting at. I don't think they should tank out-right but they need to sell big and go from there. I have a feeling that would equate to a top-5 pick this year at the least. At this juncture it is palatable when the alternative is the never ending cycle of failure.

 

[KreiMeARiver*]

That's what I am getting at. I don't think they should tank out-right but they need to sell big and go from there. I have a feeling that would equate to a top-5 pick this year at the least. At this juncture it is palatable when the alternative is the never ending cycle of failure.

I'm with you 100%

Callahan is always hurt, and he's gonna get a contract he probably isn't worth....same with Girardi.

SELL

hmm...I'm wondering if there are any contending teams out there that have an acquired early first round pick we could go after?

 

[Off Sides]

Regardless of the Lundqvist contract, an organizational plan to tank should be an absolute last resort. Something that is enacted when theres absolutely no bright spots on the roster to build around. That was the case for the Rangers in 2004, then Sather went and traded for/kept Jagr like an idiot, but thats besides the point.

The Rangers have some pieces to re-tool around. But a total tank? No. That'd be the equivalent of buying a lottery ticket. People love to point to Pittsburgh and Chicago now, but don't really think about just how badly they sucked for a long time. And those are the shining examples, what about teams like the Oilers, Islanders, and Panthers who have had higher picks in the draft year after year and STILL stink?

But I don't think that is what the Rangers are going to do. I don't think this team changes very much between now and next year. I think they try a trade this year to make the playoffs, maybe even a rental. They overpay to keep the UFAs they have for the most part this summer, they maybe bring in the yearly leftover UFA or two and the same stink stank stunk mediocrity remains.

I'd prefer they sold and sold every free agent to be this year at the deadline and really rebuilt, they could have had a kings(pun) ransom for Lundqivst alone. Add in the picks for the other free agent sales, along with their own picks, this team could be good again with a real direction in 4-5 years under competent management (I know they do not have it)

Instead they will be the same, just like they are the same right now as they were 5 years ago, like the same as they were 5 years before that.

 

[True Blue]

The difference being that Torts was a bully, a clown and just an all-around *******.

BRF, If you look at it realistically, those types of coaches have had the most success in the last 30 odd years of Rangerdom.

 

[McRanger]

BRF, If you look at it realistically, those types of coaches have had the most success in the last 30 odd years of Rangerdom.

That might have more to do with the type of players the Rangers have rostered. Especially those brought in as free agents.

 

[Bleed Ranger Blue]

The difference being that Torts was a bully, a clown and just an all-around *******. And whether or not that bothers you as much as it does me, the fact is that those guys ALWAYS have a short shelf life, regardless of how well the team performs under them initially. The only exception I have ever seen to this rule is Tom Coughlin - and that was because he was actually able to effect a personality change to somewhat de-*******-ify himself and, in so doing, keep his job.

I dont particularly agree with that in the first place, but more importantly, how does that effect you exactly?

Those guys have a short shelf life because mentally weak players tend to tune them out and look for a coach that'll handle shortcuts with a smile on his face, which is what we're seeing now.

 

[McRanger]

If you want to go back, for right or for wrong, Renney and Torts were asked to do different jobs. Renney was wonderful at injecting youth into the lineup, restoring a sense of pride to the jersey, never getting too high or too low, and being classy. He caught lightning in a bottle with the Straka-Nylander-Jagr line and Lundqvist becoming more than anyone could have foreseen.

Torts was asked to take the team and move it forward. The Keenan to Renney's Roger Nielson.

Agreed. And in many ways they both succeeded.

So whats AV's mandate? Was there even one? Or was he just the "best" option available when the team unexpectedly had to fire Torts? Will the team transitioning to a more offensive style like Sather seems to want? Or is the priority still going to be goaltending/defense which is what every organizational move seems to indicate?

 

[SingnBluesOnBroadway]

Agreed. And in many ways they both succeeded.

So whats AV's mandate? Was there even one? Or was he just the "best" option available when the team unexpectedly had to fire Torts? Will the team transitioning to a more offensive style like Sather seems to want? Or is the priority still going to be goaltending/defense which is what every organizational move seems to indicate?

There's too much minutia, words, thinking and good questions here. The goal is to win the Stanley Cup.

 

[KreiMeARiver*]

BRF, If you look at it realistically, those types of coaches have had the most success in the last 30 odd years of Rangerdom.

...and in general. How many Mr. Nice Guy country club hacks like AV win cups?

Yeah, not many.

AV SUCKS

 

[Mikos87]

BRF, If you look at it realistically, those types of coaches have had the most success in the last 30 odd years of Rangerdom.

Because when athletes are young and rich in NYC, they focus solely on their craft right?

The Devils get it, they only employee those types of coaches. You can live 30 min of NYC and still play in Jersey no problem.

 

[Mikos87]

Regardless of the Lundqvist contract, an organizational plan to tank should be an absolute last resort. Something that is enacted when theres absolutely no bright spots on the roster to build around. That was the case for the Rangers in 2004, then Sather went and traded for/kept Jagr like an idiot, but thats besides the point.

The Rangers have some pieces to re-tool around. But a total tank? No. That'd be the equivalent of buying a lottery ticket. People love to point to Pittsburgh and Chicago now, but don't really think about just how badly they sucked for a long time. And those are the shining examples, what about teams like the Oilers, Islanders, and Panthers who have had higher picks in the draft year after year and STILL stink?

Bingo. All it takes is a Benoit Pouliot being taken 4th overall, or a Cam Barker 3rd to have an entire year be completely wasted for the sake of a draft pick. How about a Svitov at number 3?

Throw away playoff games, ticket sales, ratings for a shot at an 18 year old right?

 

[BBKers]

Interesting Stats

FORWARDS TO NYR THROUGH ACQUISITIONS (11 players)
Richards - 35 GP - 9 goals - 26 points - UFA - $6,666,666
Brassard - 34 GP - 6 goals - 15 points - Trade for Gaborik - $3,200,000
Nash - 18 GP - 6 goals - 12 points - Trade for 3 homies & a first - $7,800,000
Pouiliot - 33 GP - 3 goals - 8 points - UFA - $1,300,000
Boyle - 35 GP - 1 goals - 7 points - Trade for 3rd - $1,700,000
Dorsett - 30 GP - 2 goals - 3 points - Trade for Gaborik - $1,633,333
Moore - 27 GP - 1 goals - 3 points - UFA - $1,000,000
Pyatt - 22 GP - 0 goals - 1 point - UFA - $1,550,000
Asham - 6 GP - 0 goals - 0 points - UFA - $1,000,000
Mashinter* - 6 GÃ… - 0 goals - 0 points - trade for 7th/Grant - $605.000
Powe - 1 GP - 0 goals - 0 points - trade for Rupp - $1,066,667

TOTAL = 247 GP - 29 goals - 75 points - 0,303 PPG - $27,471,667 ($366,288/point)

* Has now been traded for a player yet to sniff NHL ice (K Beach)

HOMEGROWN FORWARDS (7 players)
Zuccarello - 34 GP - 7 goals - 23 points - signed undrafted - $1,150,000
Stepan - 35 GP - 6 goals - 22 points - 2nd round pick - $3,075,000
Kreider - 28 GP - 8 goals - 18 points - 1st round pick - $800,000 (ELC)
Callahan - 24 GP - 7 goals - 13 points - 4th round pick - $4,275,000
Hagelin - 25 GP - 7 goals - 13 points - 6th round pick - $2,250,000
Miller - 17 GP - 1 goal - 2 points - 1st round pick - $894,167 (ELC)
Fast - 8 GP - 0 goals - 0 points - 6th round pick - $805,000 (ELC)

TOTAL - 171 GP - 36 goals - 91 points - 0,532 PPG - $13,249,167 ($145,595/point)

The above clearly shows how Cigar Man has done a horrific job bringing in external talent in regards to forwards on this team. Simply awful. His building around a homegrown core has been a disaster. FIRE HIM

PS - do not bother debating if MZA is home grown or not. He is in this example. PERIOD.

 

[StepansLabyrinth]

Dominic Moore is arguably "home grown" but I get your point and agree that we should be supplementing our home grown talent better.

 

[Off Sides]

Bingo. All it takes is a Benoit Pouliot being taken 4th overall, or a Cam Barker 3rd to have an entire year be completely wasted for the sake of a draft pick. How about a Svitov at number 3?

Throw away playoff games, ticket sales, ratings for a shot at an 18 year old right?

And all it takes is Ladd who was taken after Barker and Price who was taken after Pouliot for them to rebuild with a purpose.

Also they are currently out of the playoff picture, and even if they make them, it's the same old thing, maybe win a round and out.

All they do is spin their wheels with the way the run the organization.

 

[Mikos87]

And all it takes is Ladd who was taken after Barker and Price who was taken after Pouliot for them to rebuild with a purpose.

Also they are currently out of the playoff picture, and even if they make them, it's the same old thing, maybe win a round and out.

All they do is spin their wheels with the way the run the organization.

And how many years does it take for the average 18 yearold draft pick to be an impact player?

 

[Mikos87]

FORWARDS TO NYR THROUGH ACQUISITIONS (11 players)
Richards - 35 GP - 9 goals - 26 points - UFA - $6,666,666
Brassard - 34 GP - 6 goals - 15 points - Trade for Gaborik - $3,200,000
Nash - 18 GP - 6 goals - 12 points - Trade for 3 homies & a first - $7,800,000
Pouiliot - 33 GP - 3 goals - 8 points - UFA - $1,300,000
Boyle - 35 GP - 1 goals - 7 points - Trade for 3rd - $1,700,000
Dorsett - 30 GP - 2 goals - 3 points - Trade for Gaborik - $1,633,333
Moore - 27 GP - 1 goals - 3 points - UFA - $1,000,000
Pyatt - 22 GP - 0 goals - 1 point - UFA - $1,550,000
Asham - 6 GP - 0 goals - 0 points - UFA - $1,000,000
Mashinter* - 6 GÃ… - 0 goals - 0 points - trade for 7th/Grant - $605.000
Powe - 1 GP - 0 goals - 0 points - trade for Rupp - $1,066,667

And of those external acquisitions, how many of them are actually going to be here next year? Just Nash?

I think some people might be okay with him being moved too.

 

[Wolfy*]

The old man really needs to retire now.

He fired Torts, turned out to be a huge mistake. Hires a coach whose style does not fit the players.

He took the awful contract, money-wise, of a lazy player like Rick Nash who struggled as a Blue Jacket. I'm sure they are happy to get rid of him.

He locked up Henrik Lundqvist for almost 60 million dollars over the next 7 years, a goalie who seems to have reached the top, and now on his way down...

 

[RangersHank*]

The old man really needs to retire now.

He fired Torts, turned out to be a huge mistake. Hires a coach whose style does not fit the players.

He took the awful contract, money-wise, of a lazy player like Rick Nash who struggled as a Blue Jacket. I'm sure they are happy to get rid of him.

He locked up Henrik Lundqvist for almost 60 million dollars over the next 7 years, a goalie who seems to have reached the top, and now on his way down...

The Hank thing made your post go on the way down

 

[Wolfy*]

The Hank thing made your post go on the way down

We'll see about that. Interesting how Hank's game went down rapidly after the signing. It's like he doesn't give a **** anymore, cuz he got a truckload of $ no matter what happens.