StoicSensFan
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- Feb 6, 2014
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OT: Failure of a team, Failure of a rebuild
- Thread starter Adrianopolous
- Start date
Adrianopolous
Registered User
Not really at least they are in the playoffs but we're not
I turned 30 last year and feel old af. It's been so long lol since I've seen the Sens not be utter shite.
StoicSensFan
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- Feb 6, 2014
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No, only a Sens fan can hate their own team as much as he does.
AchtzehnBaby
Global Matador
AchtzehnBaby
Global Matador
I think it is because of the chumps that spent 6 months bitching about it is all DJ, and now that the JM train is falling off the tracks it's obvious it wasn't
One thing that worries me that no one really talks about is how little difference the coaching change made in the overall team play. I don't mean wins and losses or goaltending, I mean how the team plays, breakdowns, structure.
This team has clearly given up and I'm not sure how they get motivated coming into next season if the energy from the offseason changes didn't work for them this season. I'm not confident in this group at all if they can't even be committed to playing better hockey under a new coach. To the contrary, I think the players kind of gave up when Martin took over initially and you could clearly see they didn't like him as much as DJ. You can see the players have been referencing to Martin as a much "different personality". While he is a different personality I'm sure, who gives a f*** about his personality? The guy has a Stanley Cup ring behind the bench and the goal here is to win at all cost.
I think one of the big issues is actually the character in the room. When you're in 27th place and a 36 year old cares more about winning and scoring when games are close than your "core players", you are in deep deep trouble. I really have no belief in this group. If everyone worked as hard as Giroux does this team would be in the playoffs but you can't teach that.
Stutzle is immature in his play. Norris is injured all the time. Batherson is playing half the time. Tkachuk is not good defensively and effort is often not there. Chychrun looks like Mike Reilly.
This is a big part of the "core". Won't go far with that no matter who's the coach. The only guys who have taken steps with Martin under the bench are Chabot and the 4rth liners. That's it.
People are fooling themselves in thinking that goaltending is the main issue. It's not. It's one of the issues. The fact that this team has not tightened up under a new coach and has made no improvements is a major red flag.
This team has clearly given up and I'm not sure how they get motivated coming into next season if the energy from the offseason changes didn't work for them this season. I'm not confident in this group at all if they can't even be committed to playing better hockey under a new coach. To the contrary, I think the players kind of gave up when Martin took over initially and you could clearly see they didn't like him as much as DJ. You can see the players have been referencing to Martin as a much "different personality". While he is a different personality I'm sure, who gives a f*** about his personality? The guy has a Stanley Cup ring behind the bench and the goal here is to win at all cost.
I think one of the big issues is actually the character in the room. When you're in 27th place and a 36 year old cares more about winning and scoring when games are close than your "core players", you are in deep deep trouble. I really have no belief in this group. If everyone worked as hard as Giroux does this team would be in the playoffs but you can't teach that.
Stutzle is immature in his play. Norris is injured all the time. Batherson is playing half the time. Tkachuk is not good defensively and effort is often not there. Chychrun looks like Mike Reilly.
This is a big part of the "core". Won't go far with that no matter who's the coach. The only guys who have taken steps with Martin under the bench are Chabot and the 4rth liners. That's it.
People are fooling themselves in thinking that goaltending is the main issue. It's not. It's one of the issues. The fact that this team has not tightened up under a new coach and has made no improvements is a major red flag.
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No Fan hates their own Team. It's called criticism when your team is continuously losing for a good half decade
You clearly have no seen Soccer or Cricket Fan, or even fans from NBA and NFL
Cricket players have received legitimate death threats for losing tournaments and have their homes vandalized, harassed at public places while being there with their little kids
Adrianopolous
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UglyPuckling
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StoicSensFan
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- Feb 6, 2014
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I've hated this team at times in the last 20 years, so I guess I'm not really a fan?
Pierre from Orleans
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Folks have been talking about needing a major shakeup and that includes trading away pieces of the core...
You don't hate the Team in its true essence of its meaning where you don't wish anything good upon it and take satisfaction in it's failures
What you feel is more inline with being upset or disgusted by the results and how the Team is performing, or even how the Team is even constructed, because you want it to be better! So I guess that does make you fan
JungleBeat
Registered User
Like it or hate it, @Adrianopolous is just speaking facts. I think a majority of posters on here are too hyper focused on what other fans think of them and how they’re perceived. All that doesn’t matter.
PoutineSp00nZ
Electricity is really just organized lightning.
Any of those top 5 draft projections reeady to step into the lineup?
Maybe getting lucky with the lottery for once, bringing in a quality rookie, making a significant trade, and signing a decent free agent can all be done to revamp this team in one offseason.
Probably a tad optimistic lol
Maybe getting lucky with the lottery for once, bringing in a quality rookie, making a significant trade, and signing a decent free agent can all be done to revamp this team in one offseason.
Probably a tad optimistic lol
AchtzehnBaby
Global Matador
Tuna99
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- Sep 26, 2009
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Undeniable the rebuild of the RD was a failure. JBD and Thomson didn’t turn into top 6 Dman - I think we even had modest expectations of Demelo/Hamonic type of dman who can just play in the NHL z and be stable - and it’s cost us massively.
Of course rebuilding the goaltending is / was a complete disaster.
Of course rebuilding the goaltending is / was a complete disaster.
Alex1234
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- Oct 14, 2014
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Hellebuyk for Vezina ainec
Brossoit could be a good target come July 1st
Even slightly better stats than Hellebuyk in his 20 games as starter with Winni
Tuna99
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Disagree- when I see rhem
Play they have reduced shots against. They control the O zone way better and of course the neutral zone is way better. It’s not all on The goalies of course but they suck - if you have a coach who gets his Damn into the right spot on the ice but the Dman doesn’t take the stick of the body and is just in the right spot doing nothing else - that’s not coaching it’s the players
For sure Ottawa needs to add stable solid players who can at least contest pucks in the high danger scoring areas and at best keep those pucks and players to the outside and a goalie who can make NHL saves across his entire net we will improve dramatically.
I think we are closer then people think. These games they look good in a lot of the game and with a few right moves they can really make their structure way more air tight
I see a team really doing well to keep structure. Once they eliminate the players that allow all the leaks and dreakdowns they are going to improve by leaps not baby steps
Golden_Jet
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- Sep 21, 2005
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Disagree, they have played better defensively under JM.
Tnuoc Alucard
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Excellent “Take”… totally agree that J Martin has failed to move the needle, and most of the players have NOT responded as professionals, expect the exceptions you pointed out.
The majority of posters seem to have a warm and fuzzy nostalgic feeling for J Martin, and can’t seem to separate that from his current stint behind the bench…. And are cutting him way too much slack, and along with the rookie GM, have thrown in their towels for this season a month or two ago.
Constantly looking backwards and assigning blame, to allow a “pass” for the last 57 games of the season to be wasted, and not hold the current management and coaching staff accountable, is not serving this franchise well….. and will be a huge setback come training camp.
I still maintain that the rookie GM should have hired someone like Berube, as head coach, no substitute teacher, and should have begun the hard lifting back in mid December with 57 games left to go…. Instead of kicking the can down the road to September…. Waste of time.
Xspyrit
DJ Dorion
It was to be expected but I always underestimate bad faith arguments. Of course some posters with an agenda were going to count the coaching change record since day 1, like if it was REALISTIC that Martin/Alfredsson could have fixed everything overnight.
Personally, I have seen clear improvement in the way they play. It's partial, it's not always consistent and sometimes they crawl back to bad habits and fall apart but it's been there and it has been reflected in advanced stats after an adjustment period. Sens have had the 3rd lowest expected goals against ratio in the league since mid January.
Goaltending has been even worse though, Norris has been shut down, Tarasenko is gone and they have nothing to play for (Giroux is kinda mailing it in). They might still be far from being a contender but many things have been trending in the right direction, which is something Jacques Martin has been talking about himself too.
2024 - 2018 = 6 years
If you count the 2017-18 when things fell apart, it's the 7th season but only 6 years still.
Personally, I have seen clear improvement in the way they play. It's partial, it's not always consistent and sometimes they crawl back to bad habits and fall apart but it's been there and it has been reflected in advanced stats after an adjustment period. Sens have had the 3rd lowest expected goals against ratio in the league since mid January.
Goaltending has been even worse though, Norris has been shut down, Tarasenko is gone and they have nothing to play for (Giroux is kinda mailing it in). They might still be far from being a contender but many things have been trending in the right direction, which is something Jacques Martin has been talking about himself too.
Interesting how I called it the Darkest Hour in 2018, but it's now more like the Darkest 7 Years since then:
Ottawa Senators : Darkest Hour
Has it ever been worse than this? I've been a fan since 2002, and I don't think i've seen anything quite like this.. Even for other teams.forums.hfboards.com
2024 - 2018 = 6 years
If you count the 2017-18 when things fell apart, it's the 7th season but only 6 years still.
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jbeck5
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- Jan 26, 2009
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I try to talk about it all the time.
Goaltending is crap, but there's a lot of other issues with this team that no one talks about.
This team has a lot more holes than people are willing to admit.
It why I often question if we even have the organizational asset capital to win in the next few years.
We may need to sell a bunch of assets off and recover prospects and picks and try again with a better strategy and foundation and not buy useless players prematurely like debrincat and chychrun.
jbeck5
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The problem is half the team allow all the leaks and breakdowns.
I think we have at least 6 moves needed...which is a lot.
I'd add 2 RHD, 3 two way forwards who are gritty, and add a solid goalie.
6 moves means we're still pretty far away.
We probably make half the moves required this year and hopefully half next year.
But this to make the playoffs. Does this team have the capital to win a cup with this core? If not, why waste our time.
