F Joakim Kemell - JYP, FIN JRS (2022, 17th, NSH)

[izzy]

Even worse against czechia.

whats your issue with him anyway

 

[LaMasquerade]

Not his best game yesterday. Had couple of good looks (one of these hit goal post), but was IMHO kind of left in the shadow of Raty and Hirvonen in the latter half of the game. Also didn't get any minutes during OT, but that is mostly due to our "great" coaching in this tournament.

 

[bsu]

A bit like (very) poor man's Brett Hull and Paul Kariya those two. Partially overlapping skills as shooters and while Lekkerimäki oozes skill the way Kemell doesn't necessarily, he makes it up by reading the game very well. Going by his strong results at the combine he also has the athletic ability to make it work at the highest level.

He doesn't play like Kariya.

 

[Albatros]

He doesn't play like Kariya.

Lekkerimäki? A small, fast, skilled skater with a very good shot.

 

[Zub]

Kemell isnt the player that stands out on the screen, he can score points while not making much impact overall, not really a dynamic forward, apparently saying anything that isn't praise is unacceptable in this thread. To me he seems like another Tolvanen + more physicality, never saw anything NHL quality like in his game other than his shot and maybe skating. Just doesn't show good enough Hockey IQ to convince me otherwise.

 

[Albatros]

More physicality than Tolvanen would already be a legit power forward, considering that Eeli's already in the top 30 among forwards in hits thrown and that with not a whole lot of ice time.

 

[Ippenator]

Kemell isnt the player that stands out on the screen, he can score points while not making much impact overall, not really a dynamic forward, apparently saying anything that isn't praise is unacceptable in this thread. To me he seems like another Tolvanen + more physicality, never saw anything NHL quality like in his game other than his shot and maybe skating. Just doesn't show good enough Hockey IQ to convince me otherwise.

You really don’t seem to like him. I honestly don’t see a lack of hockey IQ at all, and he is doing just fine with his playmaking for a sniper type of player. I’m not sure really how you watch hockey, because sometimes your comments on some players are very much contradicting with what most people can see easily on the ice. Especially in Kemell’s case very much so.

 

[MarVell]

whats your issue with him anyway

A lot of forced plays. Questionable iq.

 

[Zub]

You really don’t seem to like him. I honestly don’t see a lack of hockey IQ at all, and he is doing just fine with his playmaking for a sniper type of player. I’m not sure really how you watch hockey, because sometimes your comments on some players are very much contradicting with what most people can see easily on the ice. Especially in Kemell’s case very much so.

This is what i'm talking about, almost a year ago you was saying the same thing to me just because i barely saw him has a top 10, and you was hyping him to be a top 3 pick, like i said, i have watched him alot and he has yet to made me go wow this guy is very good aside from his hot scoring streak last year, which indeed was just a streak that he happened to have when the season started, where you and others started steaming the hype train, he's just not that special yeah he has a good shot and finishing ability but that's it i'm sorry to break it to you pal.

 

[Ippenator]

This is what i'm talking about, almost a year ago you was saying the same thing to me just because i barely saw him has a top 10, and you was hyping him to be a top 3 pick, like i said, i have watched him alot and he has yet to made me go wow this guy is very good aside from his hot scoring streak last year, which indeed was just a streak that he happened to have when the season started, where you and others started steaming the hype train, he's just not that special yeah he has a good shot and finishing ability but that's it i'm sorry to break it to you pal.

He’s a lot better than you are desperately trying to picture here. He fell in the draft so much mostly because of the injury that made his end of the season very bad. BS with just about some hot streak. He was playing consistently very good in almost all the games before his injury. And he has now 5 points already after only 2 games as a double underager at the U20 WJC tournament.

And when you tell that you don’t see that he is constantly making mostly good decisions with the puck and don’t see how great passes he makes quite often and especially some cheeky backhand saucers, it seriously makes me question what games you are really watching?

If someone is low IQ and can’t pass well it’s Lambert, whose tires of course you have been trying to pump here occasionally, and that makes me question even more what games you are really watching, or do you really understand what you see when watching hockey.

 

[Zub]

He’s a lot better than you are desperately trying to picture here. He fell in the draft so much mostly because of the injury that made his end of the season very bad. BS with just about some hot streak. He was playing consistently very good in almost all the games before his injury. And he has now 5 points already after only 2 games as a double underager at the U20 WJC tournament.

And when you tell that you don’t see that he is constantly making mostly good decisions with the puck and don’t see how great passes he makes quite often and especially some cheeky backhand saucers, it seriously makes me question what games you are really watching?

If someone is low IQ and can’t pass well it’s Lambert, whose tires of course you have been trying to pump here occasionally, and that makes me question even more what games you are really watching, or do you really understand what you see when watching hockey.

Why do you even need to put Lambert into this argument? Yeah Kemell can do sauce backhanders, doesn't change my view of him that is clearly different then yours, Kemell played the exact same after his injury i honestly couldn't see any difference, he went cold after his hot start, and with the way he was getting his points it was clear it wouldn't be sustainable, keep blaming the injury though.

 

[Steve Kournianos]

Why do you even need to put Lambert into this argument? Yeah Kemell can do sauce backhanders, doesn't change my view of him that is clearly different then yours, Kemell played the exact same after his injury i honestly couldn't see any difference, he went cold after his hot start, and with the way he was getting his points it was clear it wouldn't be sustainable, keep blaming the injury though.

People who don’t like players from the get-go will nit pick anything they do wrong thereafter. So instead of looking for the good things, they focus on the occasional mistakes. That seems to be the case here.

Asking a 17-year-old kid to sustain a goal-per-game rate after a serious shoulder injury in an elite league is one heck of a standard. And he still led JyP in goals per game despite a second-half slump.

And why are we ignoring his tournament numbers against peers?

Including these two games, Kemell has 17 goals and seven assists in 22 international games dating back to the 2021 U18 WC.

 

[ijuka]

Why do you even need to put Lambert into this argument? Yeah Kemell can do sauce backhanders, doesn't change my view of him that is clearly different then yours, Kemell played the exact same after his injury i honestly couldn't see any difference, he went cold after his hot start, and with the way he was getting his points it was clear it wouldn't be sustainable, keep blaming the injury though.

If he played the same after the injury, why was the overwhelming opinion on the JYP forums that he played quite differently and much more timid after returning? Were they all collectively seeing things or..?

 

[gifted88]

i barely saw him has a top 10

Just curious, what are the reasons you see him as a top 10 pick?

Seems odd to me someone would say he looks bad on the ice and has a low IQ but would still pick them top 10.

 

[Rengorlex]

If he played the same after the injury, why was the overwhelming opinion on the JYP forums that he played quite differently and much more timid after returning? Were they all collectively seeing things or..?

I didn't watch any games, but goals influence our perception a lot. That's why the eye test tends to be so flawed if it's not supported by data. Every good scout should collect some data on their viewings.

 

[Zub]

People who don’t like players from the get-go will nit pick anything they do wrong thereafter. So instead of looking for the good things, they focus on the occasional mistakes. That seems to be the case here.

Asking a 17-year-old kid to sustain a goal-per-game rate after a serious shoulder injury in an elite league is one heck of a standard. And he still led JyP in goals per game despite a second-half slump.

And why are we ignoring his tournament numbers against peers?

Including these two games, Kemell has 17 goals and seven assists in 22 international games dating back to the 2021 U18 WC.

Again, I never saw him actually create these goals much himself, I don't think he'll be more than a 25g 10a player in the NHL, good scorer but lacks in all other departments to be a good top 6.

 

[Zub]

Just curious, what are the reasons you see him as a top 10 pick?

Seems odd to me someone would say he looks bad on the ice and has a low IQ but would still pick them top 10.

This was when he was on a hot streak and I couldn't not say that he could be a top 10, but overall he never really did look like a top 10 player imo, some people here were too quick on the hype train on his streak and can't accept other opinions, I just don't see what is so special about him other than his finishing abilities, physicality.

 

[Albatros]

Why would he be trying to create goals by himself when he was playing with Kalapudas and Turkulainen? Not-a-noted-goal-scorer and a guy measuring 5'7" with his skates on? Kemell was the shooter and did his job better than anyone could reasonably expect. Ten more goals and three more assists than the 1st overall pick had in the same league.

 

[Zub]

Why would he be trying to create goals by himself when he was playing with Kalapudas and Turkulainen? Not-a-noted-goal-scorer and a guy measuring 5'7" with his skates on? Kemell was the shooter and did his job better than anyone could reasonably expect. Ten more goals and three more assists than the 1st overall pick had in the same league.

Flukey hot streaks can happen with bad teammates too, i just don't see him being a good top 6 in the NHL, he's a good finisher but meh overall, Slafkovsky has a much better overall game which is why he went 1st.

 

[Ippenator]

Flukey hot streaks can happen with bad teammates too, i just don't see him being a good top 6 in the NHL, he's a good finisher but meh overall, Slafkovsky has a much better overall game which is why he went 1st.

So I guess he’s having a flukey streak against his peers again? Practically his whole international career must be one long flukey streak? You truly don’t seem to understand how awfully weak and bitter your comments really sound.

 

[Siludin]

Kemell has been on the top-prospect radar for years - he didn't just rise this past year. He would have been on lists from years prior because he has been seen as a top prospect since his early teens

 

[ijuka]

Something interesting about Joakim Kemell is his height.

When he was playing his U16 season in late 2017, I thought he looked pretty tall. Even at the time, he was listed at 5'10", and I imagine it was somewhat accurate considering how big he looked at the level. So in these 5 years, he seems to not have grown at all. At the combine, he was listed at 5'9.5".

I think that it's unlikely he'll grow anymore.

 

[SaekkiPaelli]

The one thing I worry about is that before the injury his play without the puck was more fearless and physical. It looks like he shy's away a bit from that kind of physical play after the injury. I hope he regains that this year.

 

[Kopitar11]

That line with Kemell - Raty - Hirvonen is such a great line.
Love their chemestry togheter and even if i am Swede i do feel like Finland is better then us now.
They have been winning alot of tournaments and their youths looking great.
Simontaival always produce, Finland has a good chance of winning this tournament.

 

[Steve Kournianos]

Again, I never saw him actually create these goals much himself, I don't think he'll be more than a 25g 10a player in the NHL, good scorer but lacks in all other departments to be a good top 6.

25 goals and “good scorer” but not top six? How many third liners scored 25 goals last year?

You also have to consider the teammates he’ll have in Nashville. The Preds have a strong prospect pool or young scorers with a lot of offense — Svechkov, L’Hereux, Parssinen, Tomasino, Evangelista, Campbell, plus a bunch of playmaking dmen. If Kemell scores 20-plus at a young age, he’ll make the top six and get more than 10 assists a season almost by default.

FWIW, I have InStat and access to literally every goal Kemell has scored since 2021. He works hard for his goals and has an elite shot. Don’t know how you can come to the conclusion that Samuel Helenius or Lassila were the ones doing all the work. He’s a physical scoring wing who battles in corners, jams the net, and knows how to get open.