OT: Everything COVID19 - PART 8

[Here I Pageau Again]

I wonder what happens when these people vaccine shop as well

If they want a vaccine now, they won't vaccine shop. Because they are ineligible for other vaccines. Anyone who signs up, will be ok getting this vaccine, imo.

The issue is 55+ is many regions are vaccinating 60+ (or even 55+). So these people have that option. But for a 40 year old, they will likely have to wait 4-6 weeks minimum to be vaccinated. But could be vaccinated now if they choose to.

 

[DueDiligence]

Nobody 55+ was going to get it, I don’t think it’s going to change much going to 40... I hope I’m wrong

Slight exaggeration don't you think.

 

[Sensmileletsgo]

Yes but is there a downside to vaccinating as many people as possible over going by risk?

I think that vaccinating anyone who wants to helps more than vaccinating by age group. Especially when you consider that the people who are more likely to spread the virus are on the younger end of the spectrum.

For sure. I think with the vaccine hesitancy they’ll be quick to open it up to everyone soon. But before they do that I think they still want to give the more vulnerable and older folks a chance to get the vaccine. Once they open it up to everyone it’ll likely be more of a gong show then it already is.

 

[Rhaegar Targaryen]

Lowering the age to 40 for the AZ vaccine in pharmacies is great. Around that age is where I kind of expect to see the line drawn between conspiracy theorists and people who do their research and understand the math and science behind the numbers. Of course, this doesn't go for everyone, because there's exceptions on both sides.

My Mom got her vaccine on Saturday - the AZ one. She was originally against it and hoping for the Pfizer, but I called her and had a talk with her. I wanted her to make the decision and also feel safe. It was clear that she had been a little scared by what she's read online...you hear about blood clots and such. I presented the numbers and told her it was a bigger risk not getting the vaccine than actually getting serious medical issues because of it.



I'm hoping this means the Ontario government has actually decided to put peoples' lives above politics (in this instance at least), or Trudeau is planning on using some sort of Prime Minister executive power over Ford. Denying the Red Cross and any other sort of help is a massive slap in the face to our hard-working healthcare workers. You talk to any of them...they are exhausted, mentally and physically. They need help, and the more the better.

 

[Fandlauer]

Oh god, Trudeau enacting executive powers over Ford?

 

[JD1]

Lotta politics going on here

As far as i can tell, AZ is approved for anyone over 18 but that federal body (can't remember the name) was only recommending it for 55+

It's kind of challenging to start injecting people with shit that a federal body suggests you only inject into 55+

 

[Billy Bridges]

Lotta politics going on here

As far as i can tell, AZ is approved for anyone over 18 but that federal body (can't remember the name) was only recommending it for 55+

It's kind of challenging to start injecting people with shit that a federal body suggests you only inject into 55+

NACI makes the recommendations. A group of very smart people. When the vaccines were first arriving in Dec., everyone was concerned about untested, unsafe products causing harm. This group is exercising extreme caution to ensure safety > benefit > risk of disease. Now that our cases and hospitals are so high, it's unsafe to get sick, we are moving to a benefit > safety > risk recommendation to get vaccinated.

 

[JD1]

NACI makes the recommendations. A group of very smart people. When the vaccines were first arriving in Dec., everyone was concerned about untested, unsafe products causing harm. This group is exercising extreme caution to ensure safety > benefit > risk of disease. Now that our cases and hospitals are so high, it's unsafe to get sick, we are moving to a benefit > safety > risk recommendation to get vaccinated.

Right. NACI. Recommending AZ for 55 only.

Health Canada approved it for 18+

Ontario now going to use it for 40+

I'll hang a lot of stupid shit on the provinces, including Ontario, but not this particular issue with federal guidance being shall we say confusing

 

[Micklebot]

Right. NACI. Recommending AZ for 55 only.

Health Canada approved it for 18+

Ontario now going to use it for 40+

I'll hang a lot of stupid shit on the provinces, including Ontario, but not this particular issue with federal guidance being shall we say confusing

It all comes down to the math.

NACI made the recommendation of suspending AZ to those under 55 because AZ was not expected to be a large portion of our vaccination strategy, and the likelihood of catching Covid during the extra couple months this pause would have caused was low enough that the risk of blood clots outweighed it. But if the risk factors have changed since those recommendations were made, transmission has increased and likelihood of severe illness has increased because of the variants, the math may need to be adjusted. Hesitancy for the over 55 group likely plays into the calculation too, idk.

It's only been what, 3 weeks since the initial recommendation was made? Seems pretty quick but it is possible. I'd like to believe they consulted with NACI prior to adjusting the plan, but again, who knows. Left hand not talking to the right hand has always been a bit of a problem with stuff like this.

I'll be getting my shot, whether it's AZ or one of the others I don't really care too much.

 

[JD1]

It all comes down to the math.

NACI made the recommendation of suspending AZ to those under 55 because AZ was not expected to be a large portion of our vaccination strategy, and the likelihood of catching Covid during the extra couple months this pause would have caused was low enough that the risk of blood clots outweighed it. But if the risk factors have changed since those recommendations were made, transmission has increased and likelihood of severe illness has increased because of the variants, the math may need to be adjusted. Hesitancy for the over 55 group likely plays into the calculation too, idk.

It's only been what, 3 weeks since the initial recommendation was made? Seems pretty quick but it is possible. I'd like to believe they consulted with NACI prior to adjusting the plan, but again, who knows. Left hand not talking to the right hand has always been a bit of a problem with stuff like this.

I'll be getting my shot, whether it's AZ or one of the others I don't really care too much.

Ok...for the record i have already had an AZ shot

But imagine this...Ontario injects a 50 year with AZ. As unlikely as it may be, that person dies.

You'd need to disconnect your phone because of all of the personal injury lawyers calling you wanting to initiate a lawsuit against the Ontario government for using AZ ona younger than 55 against NACI recommendations

That's not even getting into is the f***ing thing safe or isn't it. The province wants to inject you, the feds don't recommend it

You see how this is an issue ?

 

[AchtzehnBaby]

Before Ontario's announcement, the vaccine was only available to people aged 55 and older in Ontario in line with recommendations from the National Advisory Council on Immunization (NACI) earlier this spring.

On Sunday, however, the federal government said the provinces and territories were free to expand eligibility for the AstraZeneca-Oxford vaccine to any adult over the age of 18 as some pharmacists warned they had doses sitting idle because of the age restrictions.

"Provinces and territories are free to use AstraZeneca in any population over 18 per Health Canada's license for use in Canada," federal Health Minister Patty Hajdu told reporters.

 

[FunkySeeFunkyDoo]

There were reports on Friday that NACI is close to changing their guidance on AZ. Wouldn’t surprise me if they don’t announce a change in the next day or two,

 

[Micklebot]

Ok...for the record i have already had an AZ shot

But imagine this...Ontario injects a 50 year with AZ. As unlikely as it may be, that person dies.

You'd need to disconnect your phone because of all of the personal injury lawyers calling you wanting to initiate a lawsuit against the Ontario government for using AZ ona younger than 55 against NACI recommendations

That's not even getting into is the f***ing thing safe or isn't it. The province wants to inject you, the feds don't recommend it

You see how this is an issue ?

The interesting part is if AZ was the only vaccination available, there would likely be no recommendation against under 55 use. It has been deemed a viable vacinne by HC, we just have others that are also viable so we can pick and choose who gets which. NACI made a recommendation that balanced risk, availability and leaned towards giving more time to evaluate new information on AZ. People can sue if they want, I'm not convinced there's a winning case here given those who receive AZ are supposed to be advised of the risk, and to monitor for the symptoms of blood clots. People can make informed decisions, if we were hidding information then that's another situation altogether, but it seems pretty transparent ATM.

 

[JD1]

There were reports on Friday that NACI is close to changing their guidance on AZ. Wouldn’t surprise me if they don’t announce a change in the next day or two,

And that's likely to be a game changer

 

[Nac Mac Feegle]

I'd say even if the NACI changes their stand, the ambulance chasers will still make a run for any liability claims based on the initial NACI recommendations. I mean, we're talking about the used car salesmen level of litigation here.

 

[Sensmileletsgo]

Imagine being a doctors helping people fight for their lives in the ICU that wouldn’t be there if they took the AZ vaccine, yet people won’t take it because of the slightest risk of a blood clot.

 

[DJB]

As a paramedic if I was told that I was going to get the AZ I would have gladly accepted that. My sister is an ER physician and she feels the same way.

 

[Here I Pageau Again]

As a paramedic if I was told that I was going to get the AZ I would have gladly accepted that. My sister is an ER physician and she feels the same way.

I would have as well.

Right now any of these vaccines (even one dose) prevents severe disease. I would take whatever I could get the fastest.

Preventing spread is obviously the end goal but we need to decrease hospitalizations and any of these vaccines will do that.

 

[Beech]

this is all SHIT....

AstraZenica is ~ $3-$4 a shot (US)
Moderna, Pfizer and J&J are $25-37, $20-22 and $10-$11

NO f'ng wonder they are pushing one.

JEEZ..

 

[Beech]

 

[YouGotAStuGoing]

this is all SHIT....

AstraZenica is ~ $3-$4 a shot (US)
Moderna, Pfizer and J&J are $25-37, $20-22 and $10-$11

NO f'ng wonder they are pushing one.

JEEZ..

If this had any impact at all on the vaccine's effectiveness I'm sure we'd know plenty more about it. But since it's said to be as effective as the other major vaccines, I'd say it's a good thing that the government is trying to find reasonable savings amid all this.

 

[maclean]

The virus is far more dangerous for older populations, so vaccinate them first. Yes the media is saying the virus is hitting younger people harder which is true, but it is still far more dangerous for a 50 year old then a 30 year old.

OK, but there are many factors at play here. Retired people for example do not have to go to work and are much more able to isolate themselves. Stemming spread across society benefits everyone, including the most vulnerable

 

[Micklebot]

If this had any impact at all on the vaccine's effectiveness I'm sure we'd know plenty more about it. But since it's said to be as effective as the other major vaccines, I'd say it's a good thing that the government is trying to find reasonable savings amid all this.

The savings potential of using all AZ over all moderna to vacinate all Canadians is probably around 2 billion, not that we would ever do all of one or another. I think those savings would probably be exceeded by the savings of getting to heard immunity as quickly as possible though...

 

[Masked]

this is all SHIT....

AstraZenica is ~ $3-$4 a shot (US)
Moderna, Pfizer and J&J are $25-37, $20-22 and $10-$11

NO f'ng wonder they are pushing one.

JEEZ..

Is that the cost of producing the vaccine or the cost of dosing someone with it i.e. storage costs included?

 

[Senscore]

Is that the cost of producing the vaccine or the cost of dosing someone with it i.e. storage costs included?

AZ doesn't require a freezer, so that may have something to do with it.