dredeye
BJ Elitist/Hipster
- Mar 3, 2008
- 27,392
- 3,047
Value of: Erik Karlsson at the draft
- Thread starter ThePlanet
- Start date
McVespa99
Registered User
- May 13, 2007
- 6,047
- 2,790
Karlsson had a fantastic season. But with that contract I still pretty much see him as a cap dump
McVespa99
Registered User
- May 13, 2007
- 6,047
- 2,790
Be realistic. Not many teams could take that contract. Out of the teeams that could, how many would be interested in Karlsson? Of those teams how many would EK waive to go to. The list seems like it would be very very very small
Mr Positive
Cap Crunch Incoming
- Nov 20, 2013
- 37,534
- 18,472
I'm guessing that there will be huge interest
part of that is that this year's free agent crop isn't that great at D. There will be a lot of disappointed teams who want to make waves next season
Karlsson is a huge move that would be hard to do, but that's an instant way to win the offseason.
He has a full NTC so that makes it limiting. It depends on how much he wants to leave to go for a cup somewhere. Maybe he only wants to go to a contender.
part of that is that this year's free agent crop isn't that great at D. There will be a lot of disappointed teams who want to make waves next season
Karlsson is a huge move that would be hard to do, but that's an instant way to win the offseason.
He has a full NTC so that makes it limiting. It depends on how much he wants to leave to go for a cup somewhere. Maybe he only wants to go to a contender.
Gecklund
Registered User
I don’t think my ask is unrealistic at all. If we don’t get it we will just keep him.
You can see him however you want. The actual informed people are him as much more considering he’s the best defenseman in the league.
I can and will watch him finish his career putting up 100 points a season while your team perpetually chokes in the first round.
dredeye
BJ Elitist/Hipster
- Mar 3, 2008
- 27,392
- 3,047
I’m a bruins fan but ok. Enjoy not watching your team in the playoffs for the next 5 plus years
ok, enjoy watching your team choke against f***ing Florida of all teams. How embarrassing.
If I’m San Jose, I retain half. I know that sucks but it will dramatically increase his value and their window won’t be open yet by the time he’s done.
You're talking to the guy who in all seriousness thought the Sharks would be as good or better than the 80s Oilers after the Karlsson trade. Don't bother.
norrisnick
The best...
- Apr 14, 2005
- 30,634
- 15,816
Hard sell to the owner. I get he's spending that money anyway, but spending $20M+ to have a guy play for someone else is a pretty tough pill to swallow.
Yes, for sure but they have one of the worst prospect pools in the NHL and a 100 point Dman to move. They oughta maximize what they can get out of their pieces and admit trying to extend their window was a failure.
Teams like San Jose, Philly and Vancouver will have to rebuild the hard way, like it or not.
Gecklund
Registered User
Unless someone is giving us their next 20 firsts then no reason.
They don’t have one of the worst prospect pools. That’s just wrong.
Patty Ice
Registered User
Just lazy, tired talking point from 5 years ago. Most people don't care to update themselves. I'm sure the Sharks have an aging core as well.
Gecklund
Registered User
I get that they are missing some of the real top end talent but they were ranked 14 or something like that by The Athletic and that was before Thrun, Shakir, and Ohtotiuk came in. It’s just astounding how outdated that take is at this point.
Eklund, Bordeleau, Bystedt, Gushchin, Robins are all forwards who realistically have shown NHL potential. That’s not including guys like Lund, Coe, Ozzy, Cardwell, Young who have shown flashes or the older guys like Peterson, Kaut, Zetterlund, Chmelevski.
Shakir, Thrun, Havelid, Laroque on D not including Fisher, Furlong who have shown flashes and the older guys like Ferraro, Cicek, Kniazev, Ohtokiuk.
Makaniemi, Gaudreau, Mann, Chrona, Beaupit in goal.
Like I get it none of these names really jump off the page apart from Eklund and Shakir to a more casual fan but lots of these guys have shown some solid potential. You’d think by sheer numbers they’ll luck into one or two more impact NHLers.
Czechboy
Češi do toho!
- Apr 15, 2018
- 26,377
- 23,700
I think some Shark's fans will be very disapointed in the return he eventually gets. Not because he sucks but becuase he's older with a very high salary and a NMC. Shark's don't have as much leverage as some think. So yes, he's a 100 point Dman about to win the Norris but I doubt the return will be what Sharks fans want.
Look at the Burns trade, would the Sharks make that same trade for EK?
They shouldn’t. Burns got traded with a hefty discount to make it work. They need EK to return assets and should retain only if it gets them more assets.
Quid Pro Clowe
Registered User
So they should just take shit value because they’re a bad team right now? That line of thinking is asinine.
Lol. You see guys with nmc’s get dealt for proper deals all the time. Gm’s in this league are friends and peers and know they’ll likely make moves with one another in the future, they don’t have this message board mentality when it comes to making deals.
Gecklund
Registered User
Then they keep him. I think that’s the big thing that other fans aren’t getting. Everyone is claiming “oh he can’t repeat” blah blah blah. Great well with him playing out of his mind we were awful. We will be worse next year without Timo and with the likely EK regression. The retention spot is more valuable than a subpar EK return and I don’t think teams can really fit him without the retention. Sharks would have ONE retention spot through 24-25 left if they traded and retained on EK. Being sellers, that will really affect trade values. Barabanov 50% retained could return a 2nd and 4th. Sturm something similar. Labanc probably actually has value at 50% retained. Lorentz could return something good (ish). Sharks could also pick up some extra picks with those spots like MIN did.
They also don’t have the amount of cap space that people think they do so retaining let’s say 3M for a subpar return just furthers that. Sharks aren’t forced to move him
It’s an Erik Karlsson thread. You already know it contains the following bullet points:
-FOURTH FORWARD
-WORST CONTRACT IN THE LEAGUE
-NEGATIVE VALUE AT 99% RETAINED
-BUT PLUS MINUS
-HE SUCKS, BUT HES ONLY GOOD ON BAD TEAMS, BUT HE STILL ALWAYS SUCKS
-BACK IN MY DAY, DEFENSEMAN USED TO BLUDGEON PEOPLE WITH THEIR STICKS AND NEVER DARE TO GO PAST CENTER ICE
Czechboy
Češi do toho!
- Apr 15, 2018
- 26,377
- 23,700
I'm not claiming he can't repeat. I'm claiming no contending team has cap space for him. I'm claiming he won't waive that NMC to go to Arizona (or whoever else has 11 million in capspace). I'm claiming he's getting older.
My premise is based on Cap Space and that NMC.
Best comparable I can think of is Kane... he made it clear he'd only go to NYR... they got a below average return. The Rangers had all the leverage.
I see it like this in likeliness:
1. he stays in SJ
2. he leaves for a shitty return
.
.
.
.
.
.
3. He gets a Kings Ransom and speed up the SJ rebuild!
Gecklund
Registered User
The part saying he won’t repeat wasn’t necessarily directed at you more shouting into the void that is HF.
I think you are really overestimating the effect of the NTC. Sharks won’t even approach players to waive their NTC until they have a deal worked out. They did it with Burns, they told Timo he couldn’t talk to people about contracts until the deal was worked out. I’m not saying he will get the return that he deserves given that he is coming off the best season by a D man in over 30 years but I do think if the returns are only shitty and subpar, sharks will just say no thank you and keep him.
Their CEO (or whatever his title is, guy who is in charge of ticket sales basically) said that he’s already worried about next season’s season tickets. Now imagine how much worse that would be if we said “yep we traded our best player by far for absolutely nothing oh and by the way we are also paying him more money than you make in 5 years to not play for us.” Ive worked in sales and marketing for a bit but man that would be impossible to sell.
They already have buy in from the top to ride out the contract if need be so sharks just won’t take some shitty return. Karlsson can say well I’m not playing for you then I’m unhappy and f***ing fantastic. Then we can terminate his contract with no cap against!
The trick to ticket sales and trying to rebuild is having young dynamic players leading the way.
Your team might suck, but a lot of fans don't mind shelling out cash to watch young players they are excited about develop.
Now if you suck and you are icing a bunch of aging 4th line plugs, then yeah, you have a real problem.
Hopefully the Sharks get a really good piece in this draft and then even if you can't move EK this offseason, they may be able to in 2024 and there will be some great prospects making their debut to bring the fans in.
