Traded Erik Brännström - D - Part III

[Adele Dazeem]

Not going to be able to boost his value by sitting on the bench.

He's not going to be playing above Chabot, Sanderson or Holden, and now after the Hamonic acquisition the right-side is full too.

Should be dealt for a comparably-valued young forward struggling to make it. Someone like Frost, Kostin, etc....

No it's not. First, let's assume Sanderson is a no-questions asked stud.

Chabot-Zub
Sanderson-Hamonic
Brannstrom-Holden

MDZ/Zaitsev <--- one of them shoot out of a cannon and start assimilating JBD/Thompson whichever is ready.

PP1- Stutzle-Norris-Tkachuk-Batherson-Brannstrom

PP2- Joseph-Pinto-C.Brown-White-Chabot/Sanderson

 

[The Devilish Buffoon]

He's 22! Nothing else you say will take that away. It's also not like he's been pure shit. He's the 3rd/4th best D we have currently (not knowing how Sanderson will play once he laces them up). Oh, and he's only going to get better.

You know who has a value close to zero?! MDZ, Zaitsev.

Even a guy like Hamonic was valued in at a 4th round pick; and you expect us to believe Branny has no value.

That BS article Mendes published is exactly that, BS. We have no clue which scouts/execs were surveyed. They could easily have been shoe shiners.

Sample size is small on Hamonic so I won't include him, but even so there is no way in hell Brannstrom has been our 3rd best DMan this year.

Also, there's no way in hell Mendes fabricated sources. Maybe those scouts/execs aren't representative, but their opinions carry more weight than anyone's on here (regarding his value).

No it's not. First, let's assume Sanderson is a no-questions asked stud.

Chabot-Zub
Sanderson-Hamonic
Brannstrom-Holden

MDZ/Zaitsev <--- one of them shoot out of a cannon and start assimilating JBD/Thompson whichever is ready.

PP1- Stutzle-Norris-Tkachuk-Batherson-Brannstrom

PP2- Joseph-Pinto-C.Brown-White-Chabot/Sanderson

I was pretty gungho on Brannstrom getting PP1 opportunities but how can you watch him this year and think he should be playing PP ahead of Chabot? There's a very good chance he doesn't play PP ahead of Sanderson, let alone Chabot, and there's a very good chance that one of Zaitsev or Del Zotto play ahead of him. Whether you would play him or not or where you would play him isn't relevant... acting as though he is a sure thing to play over both of Zaitsev and Del Zotto (or one of them + Holden) is just wishful thinking on your part.

I don't dislike Brannstrom, I think he can be a very useful player, but it's clear to me that he hasn't grabbed a permanent position on this team.

 

[Adele Dazeem]

Sample size is small on Hamonic so I won't include him, but even so there is no way in hell Brannstrom has been our 3rd best DMan this year.

Also, there's no way in hell Mendes fabricated sources. Maybe those scouts/execs aren't representative, but their opinions carry more weight than anyone's on here (regarding his value).

I was pretty gungho on Brannstrom getting PP1 opportunities but how can you watch him this year and think he should be playing PP ahead of Chabot? There's a very good chance he doesn't play PP ahead of Sanderson, let alone Chabot, and there's a very good chance that one of Zaitsev or Del Zotto play ahead of him. Whether you would play him or not or where you would play him isn't relevant... acting as though he is a sure thing to play over both of Zaitsev and Del Zotto (or one of them + Holden) is just wishful thinking on your part.

I don't dislike Brannstrom, I think he can be a very useful player, but it's clear to me that he hasn't grabbed a permanent position on this team.

Umm, because the PP has had better number sans Chabot? I'm not going to say Brannstrom is the sole reason for that, or that Chabot was the reason the PP wasn't clicking. But if it ain't broke don't fix it...

Also not saying Mendes fabricated anything. A few scouts/execs from teams which have dozens of scouts (all with differing opinions) is nothing to go by when saying what the definitive value of a player is.

In any case, the point remains you always try to sell an asset at it's highest price. If you think that a 22-yr old puckmoving D-man has stalled in development and will only tank in value. I don't know what to tell you other than you won't be anywhere near my finances.

 

[Hale The Villain]

No it's not. First, let's assume Sanderson is a no-questions asked stud.

Chabot-Zub
Sanderson-Hamonic
Brannstrom-Holden

MDZ/Zaitsev <--- one of them shoot out of a cannon and start assimilating JBD/Thompson whichever is ready.

PP1- Stutzle-Norris-Tkachuk-Batherson-Brannstrom

PP2- Joseph-Pinto-C.Brown-White-Chabot/Sanderson

Unless DJ gets ****canned, Zaitsev is in the lineup every night.

Holden isn't getting shifted to his off-side to fit Brannstrom in.

He'll almost certainly be a healthy scratch unless injuries occur.

 

[Adele Dazeem]

Unless DJ gets ****canned, Zaitsev is in the lineup every night.

Holden isn't getting shifted to his off-side to fit Brannstrom in.

He'll almost certainly be a healthy scratch unless injuries occur.

Oh, Zaitsev will be in the lineup every night for the 22-23 seasons? You don't say. We should start the 2023 tank thread in that case.

Also, just switch Holden-Brannstrom (problem solved).

 

[Cosmix]

He never had a problem with his shot before...he seems tentative and it must be by design our D absolutely never shoot the puck on the PP.

Several chances to do so tonight, especially on the 5-3 but it just keeps get passed back and forth until Norris takes a 1 timer.

The PP was and is too predictable, trying to set up Norris for a slapshot. Stutzle adds movement to the PP which is good White should not be on it. Tkachuk is great along the boards and in front of the net. Batherson belongs there too. Chabot finishes it.

 

[The Devilish Buffoon]

Umm, because the PP has had better number sans Chabot? I'm not going to say Brannstrom is the sole reason for that, or that Chabot was the reason the PP wasn't clicking. But if it ain't broke don't fix it...

Also not saying Mendes fabricated anything. A few scouts/execs from teams which have dozens of scouts (all with differing opinions) is nothing to go by when saying what the definitive value of a player is.

In any case, the point remains you always try to sell an asset at it's highest price. If you think that a 22-yr old puckmoving D-man has stalled in development and will only tank in value. I don't know what to tell you other than you won't be anywhere near my finances.

Seems like you just ignored the point of my post and grossly oversimplified things so we can just talk later about some other topic.

That said, I'd take a look at David Rundblad, Nolan Patrick, Cody Glass, Nail Yakupov, Olli Juolevi, Alex Nylander, Tyson Jost, Logan Brown, Dennis Cholowski, Egor Korshkov, Zach Senyshyn, Travis Dermott, and about a thousand other prospects who epitomize the phrase, "know when to hold em, know when to fold em".

 

[aragorn]

When we look at next yr's defence barring injuries of course, there are five guys who I see as regulars although three of them will also be UFAs. Chabot & Sanderson are givens, Zub, Holden & Hamonic will all be UFAs & should all be regulars. Zub is the obvious choice to re-sign but I could also see them re-sign at least one more.

I am starting to prefer Hamonic over Holden if it comes down to those two. MDZ will also be a UFA next season, but what happens to him this summer & whether he returns or not is up in the air. IMO MDZ is a better defencemen right now than Brannstrom & should also be ahead of him in the lineup. That's six defencemen with Brannstrom & Thomson potentially fighting it out for the 7th D or 6th spot if they move one of the UFA defencemen & then there is Zaitsev. IMO Chabot, Sanderson, Zub & Hamonic are the four best D they have right now, then MDZ, Holden, Zaitsev, Brannstrom & Thomson. Not ideal yet, but much better than it was to start the yr & then there is JBD, Thomson & Kleven coming.

Chabot - Zub
Sanderson - Hamonic
MDZ - Holden/Zaitsev

 

[Hale The Villain]

Oh, Zaitsev will be in the lineup every night for the 22-23 seasons? You don't say. We should start the 2023 tank thread in that case.

Also, just switch Holden-Brannstrom (problem solved).

If DJ Smith is the head coach still Zaitsev will absolutely be in the lineup.

DJ has also made it abundantly clear that he doesn't like Brannstrom at LD, even if Brannstrom prefers it.

 

[Adele Dazeem]

Seems like you just ignored the point of my post and grossly oversimplified things so we can just talk later about some other topic.

That said, I'd take a look at David Rundblad, Nolan Patrick, Cody Glass, Nail Yakupov, Olli Juolevi, Alex Nylander, Tyson Jost, Logan Brown, Dennis Cholowski, Egor Korshkov, Zach Senyshyn, Travis Dermott, and about a thousand other prospects who epitomize the phrase, "know when to hold em, know when to fold em".

Because I don't want to get into a redundant argument.
I can just as easily point you over to look at this weird list of players let go off too early (off the top of my head)- Forsberg, Marchment, Chara, Middleton, Neely, Duclair, Dionne, Connor Brown....
Plenty of players let go from their team ended up being decent NHLers to HHOFers

 

[aragorn]

The PP was and is too predictable, trying to set up Norris for a slapshot. Stutzle adds movement to the PP which is good White should not be on it. Tkachuk is great along the boards and in front of the net. Batherson belongs there too. Chabot finishes it.

The PP was predictable because three of their best players who play on the PP were out with injury/illness. When they are all healthy the PP was pretty lethal & they have 5 options on it where each guy can score in a multitude of ways. Pinto, Joseph, C. Brown, Sanderson & Formenton should make for an interesting second PP unit.

Batherson - probably their best playmaker
Norris - probably their best sniper & shooter
Tkachuk - owns the front of the net & along the boards
Stutzle - perimeter player who can spread out the defence & make room for plays
Chabot - owns the blue line & gets the puck on net with regularity

C. Brown - probably their second best playmaker
Pinto - also has a lethal shot from the circle
Formenton - will need to get stronger & heavier to be more of a force inside
Joseph - his speed should help open things up on the PP
Sanderson - hopefully he can watch Chabot & be as effective on the PP

 

[The Devilish Buffoon]

Because I don't want to get into a redundant argument.
I can just as easily point you over to look at this weird list of players let go off too early (off the top of my head)- Forsberg, Marchment, Chara, Middleton, Neely, Duclair, Dionne, Connor Brown....
Plenty of players let go from their team ended up being decent NHLers to HHOFers

Lol... my "redundant argument" is that we should consider trading him if he isn't going to be in our top 6? A redundant argument would be "who cares what the coach thinks, he's wrong! In fact, we shouldn't even entertain the possibility that he might do something other what I think is best!!". Hey, you might be right that Brannstrom should be in the lineup every night no matter what.... but it doesn't make it relevant to any real-world discussion.

You're the one who said "If you think that a 22-yr old puckmoving D-man has stalled in development and will only tank in value. I don't know what to tell you". Yes, there are obviously guys given up on too early. I never denied that. Your comment implied that its impossible to move on from a player too late, which is obviously wrong, as I pointed out by naming 10+ guys drafted in the top 40 between 2015-2017 who were traded for way less than their value a year or two earlier.

 

[aragorn]

If DJ Smith is the head coach still Zaitsev will absolutely be in the lineup.

DJ has also made it abundantly clear that he doesn't like Brannstrom at LD, even if Brannstrom prefers it.

I think you mean RD, he is playing LD now replacing Chabot in the lineup.

 

[Adele Dazeem]

Lol... my "redundant argument" is that we should consider trading him if he isn't going to be in our top 6? A redundant argument would be "who cares what the coach thinks, he's wrong! In fact, we shouldn't even entertain the possibility that he might do something other what I think is best!!". Hey, you might be right that Brannstrom should be in the lineup every night no matter what.... but it doesn't make it relevant to any real-world discussion.

You're the one who said "If you think that a 22-yr old puckmoving D-man has stalled in development and will only tank in value. I don't know what to tell you". The fact that there are guys who were given up on too early doesn't change the fact that the argument "he's just 22, he couldn't possibly lose value" is really obviously a bad one, as I pointed out by naming 10+ guys drafted in the top 40 between 2015-2017 who were traded for way less than their value a year or two earlier.

Yes, it's redundant. Brannstrom (as early as last game) had the most TOI out of any other skater. I highly doubt there's no room for him, even when Chabot comes back. The notion that DJ "hates" him is also overplayed, as can be seen by the above statement.

 

[Adele Dazeem]

Look, if we end up drafting Nemec; I wouldn't have any qualms about moving Brannstrom (in a package for a top-6 upgrade).

 

[The Devilish Buffoon]

Yes, it's redundant. Brannstrom (as early as last game) had the most TOI out of any other skater. I highly doubt there's no room for him, even when Chabot comes back. The notion that DJ "hates" him is also overplayed, as can be seen by the above statement.

The only argument I made is that I don't think Brannstrom is guaranteed to play every night. If you think otherwise, well, that's your prerogative. But lets not pretend like a lot of the minutes Brannstrom plays, and the ones he thrives in the most, will go to two guys who are currently injured.

If you think two of Holden, Zaitsev and MDZ sit every night, well... lets just say I wouldn't have you managing my portfolio . Anyways, agree to disagree. I don't hate Brannstrom, don't think DJ hates him, but would be very open to moving Brannstrom in the right deal. That's all.

 

[aragorn]

Yes, it's redundant. Brannstrom (as early as last game) had the most TOI out of any other skater. I highly doubt there's no room for him, even when Chabot comes back. The notion that DJ "hates" him is also overplayed, as can be seen by the above statement.

Who do you think he is ahead or behind Brannstrom when everyone is healthy? I have him behind Chabot, Sanderson, Zub, Hamonic, Holden & MDZ & DJ has him behind Zaitsev when the team is fully healthy.

They will have three UFAs going into next season on defence Holden, Hamonic & MDZ so one might get moved before the season starts or they buy out Zaitsev which I doubt, to make room.

I just don't see where he plays & ahead of who unless there are injuries to start next season? Given how many defencemen they went through this yr there will be a need to be at least 8 D in D, but how many they carry in Ottawa is likely 7. Brannstrom could also play in Belleville again next season too & be an injury callup.

 

[BankStreetParade]

Lol... my "redundant argument" is that we should consider trading him if he isn't going to be in our top 6? A redundant argument would be "who cares what the coach thinks, he's wrong! In fact, we shouldn't even entertain the possibility that he might do something other what I think is best!!". Hey, you might be right that Brannstrom should be in the lineup every night no matter what.... but it doesn't make it relevant to any real-world discussion.

You're the one who said "If you think that a 22-yr old puckmoving D-man has stalled in development and will only tank in value. I don't know what to tell you". Yes, there are obviously guys given up on too early. I never denied that. Your comment implied that its impossible to move on from a player too late, which is obviously wrong, as I pointed out by naming 10+ guys drafted in the top 40 between 2015-2017 who were traded for way less than their value a year or two earlier.

This team's worst habit for the last 15 years has been holding on to prospects they've spent money and time developing until they were worth nothing. Every time a player struggled the popular refrain was "they're still young, they'll turn it around" until the player was neither young nor worth anything as an asset. I'd gladly sell Brannstrom this offseason to a GM who thinks he's the smartest guy in the room for pretty much anything. I'm not endorsing giving him away for the sake of it, so I'm hoping they can make a good deal but it's pretty clear his runway is ending here and they're grounding this plane before it even lifts off.

 

[RAFI BOMB]

Just not good enough. his handling of the 5 on 3, not able to get it in the wheelhouse for Norris was especially frustrating.

They should actually take him off the first power play unit. He hasn't done a good job quarterbacking it and other d men like Zub should get a look there instead.

With regards to his passes to Norris on the power play it is actually very common that he struggles to make these passes. Brannstrom rarely sends him the puck exactly where he wants it. Norris is constantly forced to adjust and sends the puck back to Brannstrom multiple times before he gets it where he wants it. Sometimes Norris scores after these exchanges which results in Brannstrom getting an assist and his advocates arguing that it is evidence that Brannstrom is doing a good job. What those advocates overlook is the multiple poor passes before a good one. Our powerplay would actually be more dangerous if this issue was resolved as it results in a lot of wasted time.

 

[RAFI BOMB]

He wont get into this lineup next year if everyone is healthy. If you think his value is low now, wait until then. Del Zotto is a much better player at this point. Chabot and Sanderson will play ahead of him.

Then towards the end of next season Kleven will be turning pro and depending on how his season goes he could be walking right into an NHL role. He is going to be the primary guy for the 3rd pairing let d spot so it is really a question of how long he needs to take it.

Brannstrom really hasn't done anything to suggest he has a spot locked down and with the d prospects in the system and ones we could draft he will be faced with a lot of competition for those final d spots over the next few years.

 

[aragorn]

Then towards the end of next season Kleven will be turning pro and depending on how his season goes he could be walking right into an NHL role. He is going to be the primary guy for the 3rd pairing let d spot so it is really a question of how long he needs to take it.

Brannstrom really hasn't done anything to suggest he has a spot locked down and with the d prospects in the system and ones we could draft he will be faced with a lot of competition for those final d spots over the next few years.

And that's when I expect that they move on from Holden when Kleven arrives. Holden has another yr on his contract & I imagine that if they are not in a playoff race next yr that they will try & move him at the deadline.

 

[JD1]

The PP was predictable because three of their best players who play on the PP were out with injury/illness. When they are all healthy the PP was pretty lethal & they have 5 options on it where each guy can score in a multitude of ways. Pinto, Joseph, C. Brown, Sanderson & Formenton should make for an interesting second PP unit.

Batherson - probably their best playmaker
Norris - probably their best sniper & shooter
Tkachuk - owns the front of the net & along the boards
Stutzle - perimeter player who can spread out the defence & make room for plays
Chabot - owns the blue line & gets the puck on net with regularity

C. Brown - probably their second best playmaker
Pinto - also has a lethal shot from the circle
Formenton - will need to get stronger & heavier to be more of a force inside
Joseph - his speed should help open things up on the PP
Sanderson - hopefully he can watch Chabot & be as effective on the PP

So about our White discussion and that 2nd PP you listed

We had Batherson and Norris out. Who played pp1? White. And he looked good

Pp2 has been ineffective all year. White is a guy that can play on an NHL PP. I don't find that Brown can. He has a motor and a great work ethic but 5 on 4, where it is about controlling puck movement rather than grinding below the goal line, he's part of the PP 2 problem. Then you've got Formenton. Is he the shooter? No. He was really bad at that while Norris was out. Board guy? Net presence? Half wall playmaker on the nonshooting side of the umbrella? Does his elite speed matter on the PP? No. No. No. And no. Joseph yes. Pinto we'll see. Might end up with two D on that Pp2.

I agree the PP looked pretty stationary without Batherson and Stutzle to love the puck around

 

[Ouroboros]

Probably all Josh Brown's fault.

 

[Senator Stanley]

Probably all Josh Brown's fault.

Shell shock.

 

[Adele Dazeem]

Probably all Josh Brown's fault.

Lmao, are you really using a clip of a bobbled puck to pin the blame on Brannstrom?

What a joke. Look, he's most likely going to be traded this offseason - just like you want.
I just hope (and think) he'll make a lot of people on these boards eat crow.