Blue Jays Discussion: End of the Hand

[phillipmike]

Jays need to do everything in their power to retain Cimber, Richards, Ray, Matz and Semien. Keep the band together and do nothing else. Keep your own and there is no need to look outside of what you have right now.

You ask why? Bullpen will be perfectly fine with a healthy Pearson, Merrywether and Stripling in there along with what they already have in Romano, Mayza, Borucki and others.

This team needs to be kept as is. No additions needed. Its a championship team if kept together.

Richards and Cimber have control beyond this year so we dont need to "retain" as they arent free agents. I dont mind Matz but it has to be around 1 year at $8M like Ray's deal and i doubt he takes it.

Ray
Berrios
Ryu
Manoah
Pearson/Stripling/Hatch

This should be a good enough rotation. Maybe grab another reclamation projection for Walker, preferably someone with control.

 

[zeke]

Double posting because the format of my replies looks too funky sharing space with the video:



He was nominated for a Golden Glove...

And he did play 3B. He was just as awful at 3rd for the same reasons he was awful up the middle: whenever he needs to mix in fancy footwork to make accurate throws, he sucks. But when he has the option to plant his foot, he throws very accurately. I've always thought he'd be better in left, and so far it has been his best position by far. He's inconsistent at times out there,but he more than makes up for it with his amazing throws.



Let's not trade a left handed power bat who fills in perfectly as a utility infielder on the eve of electronic strikes zone.



Espinal seems to be maintaining 300 and he's a good fielder. That's more than good enough to be an every day shortstop in this league. Don't let the Jays' current embarrassment of offensive riches fool you. It's not normal to have this many offensive juggernauts on one team, and it's certainly not normal to be able to afford all of them. Starting next season, you're going to start seeing the boys get 10 million raises. You will need a less expensive player like Espinal around to play a solid position on the cheap. You can't have all stars at every position.

No gurriel didn't play 3B. He played SS and 2B and early didn't have the hands to be a middle infielder.

But 3B? Nowhere near the demands of a middle infielder....and he's for plenty of arm.

 

[theaub]

Espinal is good enough to be a starting SS at most major league teams which is why he'll ask for a trade if the Jays make him the utility infielder. The only way they keep him is if he starts at SS and they spend the money at 3B. This is perfectly reasonable because you need to save money somewhere. Besides, prove Espinal will NEVER hit for power. Power usually comes later. I don't see any reason why he can't hit 15 or so.

Biggio is not going to net a good 3B. All teams will be asking for Kirk, no doubt. Maybe Smith. And you guys are giving up on Biggio way too quickly. He was injured and had his sophomore slump. If he fails again next year, then we can give up on him. And, again, imagine what electronic strike zones will do for him. SO MANY of his strikeouts have been on bad calls.

Espinal is 27 next opening day and has 279 MLB PA's with a 96 wRC+ (and even this year its 103). The 103 would put him tied for 18th amongst SS with 200+ PA this year. If he wants to demand a trade off of that all the power to him, but let's not make him out as some absolute world beater here considering he's basically putting up second half Ryan Goins 2015 numbers. He's a second division starter at most right now.

While I didn't say anywhere that Espinal will never hit for power, his ISO's in AA or above are .109, .104, .115, .067 and .088. He hasn't shown anything to this point to indicate that he will develop 15 HR power, and once again he is 27 on opening day next year.

I agree that Biggio alone will not net a good third baseman, but I am sure other MLB teams (and the Jays) are also cognizant of his elite plate discipline and what that could mean going forward.

 

[Puckstuff]

What I find interesting with Ray, Matz, Stripling is they were all buy low candidates in the national league. I don't have any data on this but I hypothesize players switching leagues tend to favour pitchers more then hitters. Would be interesting if they look for another buy-low in the Matz/Ray mold as the #5 next year to keep Stripling/Pearson/Hatch as the depth. It's crazy that all 3 of them have been this succsessful.

 

[Kurtz]

Semien isn't coming back...unless Rogers has no problem rolling out a $180 million budget.

And I don't know how a guy who can hit 20 isn't a power bat. He can play most infield positions. He doesn't have to play them well. He just has to be good enough to inject as a left handed bat. He's much better in that role as a backup. You guys need to stop expecting all star quality performances from every position ESPECIALLY from the back up players.

Biggio is not a utility infielder and he's not a power bat. He's a 2b/corner outfielder.

Biggio's career slugging is .406. This season, that would rank him 15th amongst 2b, 22nd amongst RF and 13th amongst LF.

He has average power for his position(s), and I'm fine with him as our new 2B if Semien leaves, but he's neither a utility infielder nor a power bat.

 

[Kurtz]

Jays need to do everything in their power to retain Cimber, Richards, Ray, Matz and Semien. Keep the band together and do nothing else. Keep your own and there is no need to look outside of what you have right now.

You ask why? Bullpen will be perfectly fine with a healthy Pearson, Merrywether and Stripling in there along with what they already have in Romano, Mayza, Borucki and others.

This team needs to be kept as is. No additions needed. Its a championship team if kept together.

If we retain Ray, Matz is surely a goner. He's earned himself a nice 2/20 type contract, and we don't need to pay that to our 5th guy, especially given that we have Stripling, Hatch and Pearson battling for that spot next year.

 

[Puckstuff]

No gurriel didn't play 3B. He played SS and 2B and early didn't have the hands to be a middle infielder.

But 3B? Nowhere near the demands of a middle infielder....and he's for plenty of arm.

In theory Gurriel Jr. at 3B could make sense... He has the strong arm and lateral quickness. It would be an interesting experiment.

 

[as Pure as Evil]

• mlb.com just updated the site and its just a mess

 

[Discoverer]

Spring training, dude.

Gurriel has never played an inning at 3B in a Spring Training game.

 

[trellaine201]

Bringing Springer back sooo soon. He’s been awful the last 15 games!

 

[metafour]

No gurriel didn't play 3B. He played SS and 2B and early didn't have the hands to be a middle infielder.

But 3B? Nowhere near the demands of a middle infielder....and he's for plenty of arm.

Third base requires immense focus to play. The ball is hit harder at the 3B than it is at the SS or 2B.

Would you categorize Lourdes Gurriel as a player who displays "good focus"?

I would argue that he is among the biggest airheads in the league. I can't imagine how you envision a guy who can barely play LF to succeed at 3B. He has zero defensive awareness or instinct whatsoever.

 

[phillipmike]

Third base requires immense focus to play. The ball is hit harder at the 3B than it is at the SS or 2B.

Would you categorize Lourdes Gurriel as a player who displays "good focus"?

I would argue that he is among the biggest airheads in the league. I can't imagine how you envision a guy who can barely play LF to succeed at 3B. He has zero defensive awareness or instinct whatsoever.

I ageee. Next year we should be in year 2 of hopefully a 5-7 year window and legit contenders. We can experiment with pitchers but we can’t be experimenting with key defensive positions anymore especially considering we haven’t had a good and healthy 3B since 2018.

Get a real 3B like Ramirez, Chapman it let Groshans play if he is ready.

It’s too bad the FO and JD finished on bad terms. The Twins were looking to move money, I’m wondering if they would be interested in Grichuk and say Smith for Donaldson. Solves our Grichuk and 3B problem for 2 years until Groshans is ready.

 

[Muston Atthews]

Looks like he’s out

 

[TheMadHatTrick]

Additions are definitely needed. The bullpen is still shaky and they need another infielder.

We're not getting him but Seager would be a perfect fit. Gives us the elite lefty bat our lineup sorely lacks and he'd be elite defensively at 3B. Alternative option is trading for Jose Ramirez who has two years of control left after this season.

 

[Cloned]

We're not getting him but Seager would be a perfect fit. Gives us the elite lefty bat our lineup sorely lacks and he'd be elite defensively at 3B. Alternative option is trading for Jose Ramirez who has two years of control left after this season.

I feel like Ramirez is on the verge of a decline. Dunno why, just a gut feeling.

 

[Muston Atthews]

Dammit

 

[Muston Atthews]

Berrios hasn’t been great but he’s been pretty effective

 

[aight]

AL Wildcard Standings:

Boston +1
New York
Toronto -0.5

Correct?

 

[dredeye]

Does Pearson just need a full year at AAA?

 

[phillipmike]

Sounds like Stripling is pitching Friday vs Baltimore and Wagner says Hatch is getting the call to start one of the games on Saturday (doubleheader).

 

[phillipmike]

 

[LeafChief]

What an unbelievable week. They CANNOT take their foot off of the gas against Baltimore.

 

[Puckstuff]

And Canada men's soccer win and get into a top 3 spot in world cup qualifying standings! Great week, lol.

 

[AcerComputer]

What an unbelievable week. They CANNOT take their foot off of the gas against Baltimore.

we somehow find a way to lose games against them. Need a sweep again, because the Rays series could be bad for us.

 

[zeke]

I'm not sure there's a cooler more encouraging image for me than in the late inning of a playoffs race, in Yankee stadium, with the base loaded in a one run game.....seeing 22yr old Vladdy holding court in the dug out entertaining vets berrios Soria and teosacar with some great tale like nothing more important is going on.

Just awesome.

And then vladdy follows it up with a game sealing homer the next ups.