Value of: Elias Lindholm and Noah Hanifin at the draft

[treple13]

Just curious, why is Hanifin the guy you would choose to move, as opposed to others?

For me I'd trade Hanafin IF Kylington was definitely back. The reason for me is he's the least essential of our top 4 guys and still probably has strong value. I'm a bit worried he's going to end up overpaid as well

 

[Figgy44]

Just curious, why is Hanifin the guy you would choose to move, as opposed to others?

He's not bad. Just that with the excess LD we have it's a position of strength and he has high value. So, he's the best piece to move and get a good piece back without creating a new problem on the roster.

 

[Double Dion]

For Elias Lindholm

Newhook, 23,25 first and more if required.

I'd do it. It would force us to finally rebuild.

 

[Double Dion]

I'd trade Tanev in the summer instead of Hanifin. Mainly because I trust Hanifin will be healthy at the TDL and don't trust Tanev will be. Hanifin takes a lot of crap but he eats a lot of minutes effectively. He's very good 5 on 5 and a pretty solid PKer too. He's also still 25. We've already gotten the best out of Tanev.

 

[DaveG]

I think we know the answer is Dougie Hamilton, Micheal Ferland, and Adam Fox.


but no seriously though, Carolina should be all over trying to bring Lindholm back in. First round pick and Honka or Suzuki maybe?

 

[Ledge And Dairy]

I think we know the answer is Dougie Hamilton, Micheal Ferland, and Adam Fox.


but no seriously though, Carolina should be all over trying to bring Lindholm back in. First round pick and Honka or Suzuki maybe?

Would you trade Aho for that package? Same term remaining, similar caliber player. Only difference is cap hit and 2.5 years age wise

 

[Double Dion]

I think we know the answer is Dougie Hamilton, Micheal Ferland, and Adam Fox.


but no seriously though, Carolina should be all over trying to bring Lindholm back in. First round pick and Honka or Suzuki maybe?

Look at the offer from the Avs poster. You're offering half of what he did.

 

[Some Other Flame]

Just curious, why is Hanifin the guy you would choose to move, as opposed to others?

Well, the ideal candidates in Markstrom or Coleman will be too difficult to move given their contracts and MNC/NTC's. The others like Backlund, Lindholm, Dube, and Kylington, are either more valuable or will be cheaper to re-sign with still plenty of room for growth. Tanev is older and could fall off a cliff at any time but when he's going, he's a cornerstone of the defense. Zadorov is cheaper and brings much needed physicality. Andersson is untouchable.

So then there's Hanifin, a 26 year old top pairing defenseman making 4.95M for another season. I think his trade value might end up outweighing his on ice contributions, at least in light of what his next contract will be, i.e. 7M+. And whatever they get for him in return, whether it's futures or a competitive piece, the Flames can still ice a defense of

Weegar-Andersson
Kylington-Tanev
Zadorov-XXX

which should be good enough. Assuming of course that Kylington comes back next season

 

[Double Dion]

Well, the ideal candidates in Markstrom or Coleman will be too difficult to move given their contracts and MNC/NTC's. The others like Backlund, Lindholm, Dube, and Kylington, are either more valuable or will be cheaper to re-sign with still plenty of room for growth. Tanev is older and could fall off a cliff at any time but when he's going, he's a cornerstone of the defense. Zadorov is cheaper and brings much needed physicality. Andersson is untouchable.

So then there's Hanifin, a 26 year old top pairing defenseman making 4.95M for another season. I think his trade value might end up outweighing his on ice contributions, at least in light of what his next contract will be, i.e. 7M+. And whatever they get for him in return, whether it's futures or a competitive piece, the Flames can still ice a defense of

Weegar-Andersson
Kylington-Tanev
Zadorov-XXX

which should be good enough. Assuming of course that Kylington comes back next season

Pretty sound logic, but I'd be moving Tanev in the off-season. Return might be close to the same as Hanifin and I trust that Noah will be healthy for a decision at the TDL.

 

[Ledge And Dairy]

Pretty sound logic, but I'd be moving Tanev in the off-season. Return might be close to the same as Hanifin and I trust that Noah will be healthy for a decision at the TDL.

Shouldn't move either until we can sign someone to an extension. We have 4 defensemen on expiring contracts the following summer. If Hanifin gets traded and he was the only one willing to sign an extension the Flames are screwed on defense. Poirier is the only guy really standing out in the minors and he's still got a lot of developing to do. Tanev may retire after this contract too.

 

[Double Dion]

Shouldn't move either until we can sign someone to an extension. We have 4 defensemen on expiring contracts the following summer. If Hanifin gets traded and he was the only one willing to sign an extension the Flames are screwed on defense. Poirier is the only guy really standing out in the minors and he's still got a lot of developing to do. Tanev may retire after this contract too.

I agree on not moving on from Hanifin barring a rebuild. I just really want a rebuild. Tanev I would be fine moving. I don't want to re-sign him.

 

[Drake1588]

If it's not clear, OP, players a year from UFA have a lot less value to teams shitty enough to finish bottom five than you think they do.

It really doesn't matter if they're good or very good or declining. One year of service saps value when they can bolt from a bad team in another year.

They have value to good teams at the next deadline, teams that A) are going for it and already looking to deal futures, and B) are good enough to entice said players to maybe stay. The picks they can offer, though, are nowhere near top five... and they won't carry them for a full year. They'd want them in Feb/March 2024, and would only bite after the Flames pay them most of the season. That's part of the attraction.

 

[I Hate Blake Coleman]

A contender with space should absolutely try for Lindholm. Affordable but due for a raise. Perfect for a team looking to add a versatile forward who has shown he can play C.

 

[McJedi]

Would be curious what the Flames could get for this package at the draft. Lots of teams would be inquiring as both are on low cap hits. Maybe trade up for a top 5 overall?

Would be curious what the Flames could get for this package at the draft. Lots of teams would be inquiring as both are on low cap hits. Maybe trade up for a top 5 overall?

Would be curious what the Flames could get for this package at the draft. Lots of teams would be inquiring as both are on low cap hits. Maybe trade up for a top 5 overall?

Are you honestly suggesting a team like Philly or San Jose should trade a top 5 pick for two rentals?

 

[Scintillating10]

Doubt Flames can re-sign Lindholm, after Huberdeau and Weagar contracts kick in.

 

[Ledge And Dairy]

Doubt Flames can re-sign Lindholm, after Huberdeau and Weagar contracts kick in.

Lol what? They can easily afford him. The cap is expected to be going up by roughly 4M that summer. That alone should pay his raise. On top of that; Tanev, Kylington, Hanifin, Backlund, and Zadorov are all UFA's. That's 25.3M coming off the books not including Lindholm's 4.85M. Calgary could literally pay him the absolute max cap hit % a player could get (20% of the cap or 17.5M) and still have ~13M cap space to fill out their roster.

 

[Scintillating10]

Lol what? They can easily afford him. The cap is expected to be going up by roughly 4M that summer. That alone should pay his raise. On top of that; Tanev, Kylington, Hanifin, Backlund, and Zadorov are all UFA's. That's 25.3M coming off the books not including Lindholm's 4.85M. Calgary could literally pay him the absolute max cap hit % a player could get (20% of the cap or 17.5M) and still have ~13M cap space to fill out their roster.

They will retain most of them. Or acquire similar players.

 

[Ledge And Dairy]

They will retain most of them. Or acquire similar players.

They absolutely won't choose to keep any of them over Lindholm lol.

 

[Double Dion]

Probably depends on cap hit. As an example I prefer Backlund on a 3 year 4M contract to Lindholm at 8X9.5

 

[Some Other Flame]

Pretty sound logic, but I'd be moving Tanev in the off-season. Return might be close to the same as Hanifin and I trust that Noah will be healthy for a decision at the TDL.

Can't see them moving Tanev anything short of a full rebuild and in that case, they'd move Backlund and whole bunch of other players too.

Theoretically, given the ownership mandate to to be forever mediocre, they could trade Tanev for assets, then sign someone like Soucy in free agency to fill that hole, but it wouldn't alleviate the cap issues. Nor are the Flames that competent with asset management that they'd even think of something like that anyway.

If the cap only increases by 1M next year, which according to Bettman is likely, the Flames will have around 1.3M in space to fill 4 or 5 roster spots. So at least one sizable contract will have to be straight up dumped just to fill out the team. Dunno if some are still in denial about this but at least one of Hanifin, Backlund, Mangiapane, Markstrom, or Coleman will need to go. The latter two will be too hard to move, Backlund is too good and too important, and they'd be selling low on Mangiapane (and if anything they need more snipers). It's gotta be Hanifin.

 

[Haatley]

I'd consider Hanafin for something around the Rangers 1st IF Kylington is returning

It would require much more than just a late first.

This thread is ridiculous. A top line 2 way centre and a #2-3 defenceman - both in their primes. They are severely undervalued here.

 

[Tkachuk Norris]

Just curious, why is Hanifin the guy you would choose to move, as opposed to others?

Because our fanbase is clearly delusional. He's been one of the top defencemen in the league for 3 years by virtually every measure. Yet apparently top pair 25 year old defencemen grow on trees and our fanbase is ready to trade him for peanuts.

He hasn't had a very good season yet is still a plus player on a team that doesn't score, or get saves, while playing the other teams top players night in and out.

We did the same thing to Brodie, Hamilton, and Bouwmeester. People want him to be a #1 and just can't be satisfied he's a number 2. ultimate case of the grass is greener on the other side. In reality the grass is dry, crusty and brown with holes from gophers.

 

[treple13]

Because our fanbase is clearly delusional. He's been one of the top defencemen in the league for 3 years by virtually every measure. Yet apparently top pair 25 year old defencemen grow on trees and our fanbase is ready to trade him for peanuts.

He hasn't had a very good season yet is still a plus player on a team that doesn't score, or get saves, while playing the other teams top players night in and out.

We did the same thing to Brodie, Hamilton, and Bouwmeester. People want him to be a #1 and just can't be satisfied he's a number 2. ultimate case of the grass is greener on the other side. In reality the grass is dry, crusty and brown with holes from gophers.

Eh, I don't think suggesting him as a piece that might make sense to move is crazy. The things you said are reasons we might move him. He IS a good D. However he's a good D one year from UFA. If he came with a reasonable extension then we can keep him. I do think we should be looking to recoup some assets though at a position we might afford to lose someone at.

I don't think it's a reasonable thing to have all of Weegar, Andersson, Hanafin, Tanev, Zadorov and Kylington.

See what Hanafin wants. If he's open to an Andersson type deal I'd bend over backwards to keep him. If he wants a Weegar deal, no thank you

 

[Ledge And Dairy]

Eh, I don't think suggesting him as a piece that might make sense to move is crazy. The things you said are reasons we might move him. He IS a good D. However he's a good D one year from UFA. If he came with a reasonable extension then we can keep him. I do think we should be looking to recoup some assets though at a position we might afford to lose someone at.

I don't think it's a reasonable thing to have all of Weegar, Andersson, Hanafin, Tanev, Zadorov and Kylington.

See what Hanafin wants. If he's open to an Andersson type deal I'd bend over backwards to keep him. If he wants a Weegar deal, no thank you

If he wants 6M on a long term deal we should absolutely extend him. If you think he's taking less than 5M you are out to lunch. The cap is going to leap quite a bit in the next couple years and a 6M top pair defensman is going to start looking like 4.5M does now

 

[Double Dion]

Because our fanbase is clearly delusional. He's been one of the top defencemen in the league for 3 years by virtually every measure. Yet apparently top pair 25 year old defencemen grow on trees and our fanbase is ready to trade him for peanuts.



He hasn't had a very good season yet is still a plus player on a team that doesn't score, or get saves, while playing the other teams top players night in and out.



We did the same thing to Brodie, Hamilton, and Bouwmeester. People want him to be a #1 and just can't be satisfied he's a number 2. ultimate case of the grass is greener on the other side. In reality the grass is dry, crusty and brown with holes from gophers.

This is so correct. If we need to lose a top 4 D it should be Tanev. I get that he's good, but he's 34 and has had significant injuries. His shoulders are so bad every beer leaguer in the city shoots it harder than him.