Recalled/Assigned: Edvinsson, Berggren & others sent to GR

[lhsgolf19]

Easy fix to that, is to you know... give them ice time. Berggren kind of makes sense since we have a million middle six forwards. But any defensive shift that isn't occupied by Seider and Chiarot can very easily be given to Edvinsson + whoever without looking any worse than whatever other combination we'd throw out there anyway.

Even if it's just 3rd pairing minutes, that ice time at NHL pace is more value to his growth and development than double that at AHL pace. Edvinsson doesn't need a bunch of minutes playing slow hockey. That's not even mentioning the off-ice learning being on an NHL bench and in an NHL lockerroom and taking part in NHL practices. Who is he going to look to and learn from in the AHL? Lashoff? Kampfer?

Playing time is a bullshit reason to justify protecting Oesterle or Hagg from waivers. I'm sick of coach speak. Lalonde started out so good in the offseason and training camp saying all the right things, but push comes to shove it's cliches and 5-10 year vets that aren't better than kids getting the nod.

So tell me this... would you rather lose more if that means the young guys play (who might not be ready yet)? I'm not... It's time to win.

 

[sepster]

that sounds like Soderblom, for now, has taken Zadina's spot.
.

 

[norrisnick]

So tell me this... would you rather lose more if that means the young guys play (who might not be ready yet)? I'm not... It's time to win.

I'd rather lose with Edvinsson and Berggren playing than lose anyway with Oesterle/Hagg/Erne/Sundqvist playing.

That group of players will not be tipping the scales for this (or any) team.

Though Edvinsson (more likely) and Berggren (less likely) may eventually play themselves into a position where they are impacting games on a night to night basis.

 

[NickH8]

Veleno I can see not quite making the starting lineup, but what has Erne done better than Zadina? He hits, sure but Zadina has had a good preseason and is better at everything else.

 

[MabusIncarnate]

Yeah i'm definitely not in favor of Erne over Zadina if that's the case.

 

[sepster]

Veleno I can see not quite making the starting lineup, but what has Erne done better than Zadina? He hits, sure but Zadina has had a good preseason and is better at everything else.

Zadina might look better, but it doesn't result in any production or puck possession.

Zadina, as other have stated, is not in the same conversation as Erne, Sundqvist, Smith, Rasmussen, or Veleno. Those guys are players that can fill a 4th line role. Zadina does not beong on the 4th line because he doesn't do anything a 4th line player needs to do (be physical/irritating, get defensive stops), he's useless there. He either needs to beat out someone in the Top 9 or be gone.

Berggren is in the same situation as Zadina and is why he is starting the year in GR,

Either of them being "better" than Erne or Smith means nothing if they're not good enough to take a spot in the Top 9.

 

[Inspiration]

If you put Erne's and Zadina's results from the past couple years next to each other and hid their names, you would have a difficult time telling which one is which. Erne isn't good, but he has more even-strength points than Zadina in each of the past two seasons. He just hasn't been gifted consistent powerplay time the way Zadina has (nor should he be). I don't mind that Lalonde isn't going to gift players ice time based on their draft position.

 

[golffuul]

So for those who typically follow these sorts of details more than I do. When are we roughly expecting to see the final roster?

5pm EST

 

[jkutswings]

I plan to freak out at 5:01PM.

Because any roster moves made today are locked in for the season, and likely will make or break both the results this year and the careers of the affected players.

C'mon, panic with me!

/sarcasm

 

[norrisnick]

I thought every game mattered and we couldn't afford to give any away? I thought this was the backbone for not trusting kids with ice time before they've completed the AHL Finishing School curriculum? This would include opening night, no?

 

[kliq]

Derek Lalonde: Let's all calm down about who made, didn't make, Detroit Red Wings' roster

Detroit Red Wings coach Derek Lalonde, Oct. 10, 2022.

www.freep.com

 

[raymond23]

Easy fix to that, is to you know... give them ice time. Berggren kind of makes sense since we have a million middle six forwards. But any defensive shift that isn't occupied by Seider and Chiarot can very easily be given to Edvinsson + whoever without looking any worse than whatever other combination we'd throw out there anyway.

Even if it's just 3rd pairing minutes, that ice time at NHL pace is more value to his growth and development than double that at AHL pace. Edvinsson doesn't need a bunch of minutes playing slow hockey. That's not even mentioning the off-ice learning being on an NHL bench and in an NHL lockerroom and taking part in NHL practices. Who is he going to look to and learn from in the AHL? Lashoff? Kampfer?

Playing time is a bullshit reason to justify protecting Oesterle or Hagg from waivers. I'm sick of coach speak. Lalonde started out so good in the offseason and training camp saying all the right things, but push comes to shove it's cliches and 5-10 year vets that aren't better than kids getting the nod.

Imo you are really misguided about the pace of play in the AHL. It’s not slow at all. I think you could argue it’s faster than the NHL because of how it’s so disjointed compared to NHL systems. It’s a fantastic place for a defenseman to develop his skills against heavy pressure on small ice.

 

[norrisnick]

Imo you are really misguided about the pace of play in the AHL. It’s not slow at all. I think you could argue it’s faster than the NHL because of how it’s so disjointed compared to NHL systems. It’s a fantastic place for a defenseman to develop his skills against heavy pressure on small ice.

It's slow because the ability to string passes together is garbage. Sub-NHL PPs are painfully slow because all the passes are so deliberate otherwise they aren't handled properly. It's a lot of dump in, chase, board play, or an individual rush. Learning how to chip the puck up and out because the forwards can't receive a breakout pass is pointless. That's not want you want Edvinsson to do in the NHL.

 

[SoupGuru]

It's amazing how quick people get locked into a prospect. THIS IS AN OUTAGE! IF PLAYER X ISN'T GETTING PLAYING TIME I'LL BECOME A COYOTES FAN INSTEAD!

Classic "grass is greener" stuff. The upcoming prospects are always better than the scrubs that played last year. Always.

 

[archimet]

Best for what exactly? Learn how to defend in the AHL? That's like learning how to bat in triple-A. Fat lot of good that does you against MLB pitching.

Just curious, have you personally every played in the AHL or NHL? Or for that matter in Triple-A or MLB?

 

[Pavels Dog]

Classic "grass is greener" stuff. The upcoming prospects are always better than the scrubs that played last year. Always.

I mean, we haven't been a good NHL team for years so it doesn't seem farfetched that prospects could actually improve the team.

 

[NickH8]

Just curious, have you personally every played in the AHL or NHL? Or for that matter in Triple-A or MLB?

I disagree with the guy but that's not really an argument. You can form opinions on leagues from watching.

 

[Barry Amsterdam]

Just curious, have you personally every played in the AHL or NHL? Or for that matter in Triple-A or MLB?

all 4 actually

 

[JohanFranzenstein]

Edvinsson needs seasoning. From the games I saw this preseason at least. Looks too jumpy sometimes, maybe it was nerves or whatever but I would love for him to get top 4 minutes in a NA pro league before throwing him to the wolves, or worse, bottom pairing in Detroit.

 

[Gniwder]

I disagree with the guy but that's not really an argument. You can form opinions on leagues from watching.

Yeah, but athletes have a better perspective, I'm thinking less than half the people here have played any sort of competitive sports. (I'm being generous and including beer league, not just varsity/college sports)

There is always something you can work on even against lower competition, the moment you quit trying to improve is when you've peaked out.

 

[ricky0034]

Illitch should stop cheaping out and bring in this guy if the prospects need seasoning so damn bad

would save a lot of time compared to all that AHL stuff

 

[norrisnick]

It's amazing how quick people get locked into a prospect. THIS IS AN OUTAGE! IF PLAYER X ISN'T GETTING PLAYING TIME I'LL BECOME A COYOTES FAN INSTEAD!

Classic "grass is greener" stuff. The upcoming prospects are always better than the scrubs that played last year. Always.

I think the bigger issue is that there's this misplaced trust in a warm body that has been in the NHL before vs a younger kid that hasn't.

Why is hanging on to a player that we know to be mediocre better than playing a guy that might actually be decent or might also be mediocre?

 

[gritdash60]

Veleno I can see not quite making the starting lineup, but what has Erne done better than Zadina? He hits, sure but Zadina has had a good preseason and is better at everything else.

If i remember the PK stats @Henkka posted earlier on the roster thread, i think Erne had quite good PK stats, maybe they are looking for him to get a spot on PK. Zadina won't be playing any PK i think thats quite easy to predict.

I think it's a great thing that we have real competition on the roster spots, but i hope they don't put too much emphasis on the pre-season, iirc Coyotes didn't lose a single pre-season game couple years ago and that didn't really translate to the actual season.

Since they had enough hope on Zadina to give him a 3 year contract, i think they should now try to build his confidence and give him a spot on the roster to start the season. I don't understand why the contract, albeit cheap was given if you are just going to bury him in to the minors.

Edit: unless the low caphit contract was just to see if he turns up on pre-season and if not trying to get a pick by trading him to someone who want's a reclamation project, eitherway if Wings are looking to compete for a playoff spot i think without Zadina bouncing back and scoring some its a stretch. Well might even be with him scoring.

 

[Gniwder]

I think the bigger issue is that there's this misplaced trust in a warm body that has been in the NHL before vs a younger kid that hasn't.

Why is hanging on to a player that we know to be mediocre better than playing a guy that might actually be decent or might also be mediocre?

It's only an issue in your mind. NHL GMs are not in a rush to throw 19 YO prospects into the league.

Quit throwing a hissy fit, lol. Rebuild is a long process. It's not even close to being done yet.

 

[K1900L]

Exactly what I expected some weeks ago, the probability that Edvinsson starts in the AHL bigger than him being in the top 4.
So I am not as confused as some people. He will be a top 3 defender within ~2 years, I'm for sure.
I'm actually more irritated about Berggren to be honest.