Series Talk: ECQ: Boston Bruins (2-0) Toronto Maple Leafs. Well. We can Win at Home. We Have to.

[crump]

TSN panel has Boston winning series by votes 3–1 . At least Andie P picked the Leafs.

 

[CantLoseWithMatthews]

Let me get something straight...

Holding an opinion that a grinder, someone who kills penalties, agitates, plays on the walls, and forechecks; an opinion held by nearly, if not all coaches in the modern game, makes someone a "fan boy"?

First of all, unless you're actually 12, stop using vernacular like you are. It's an awful look, and immediately discredits what you say by making you look like a fool. Adults calling other adults "fan boy" makes my insides cringe.

Second, I didn't say it was wise to match Komarov up with Marchand as a standard. Nice reach to attempt to get a leg up. What you quoted was simply stating that there is so much more to the game than scoring production, and the fact that the leading hockey minds in the game go out of their way to aquire players that bring those other traits isn't a blight on my opinion, it's a blight on your's. Clearly, you have your idea of how things should be, and that's your right, but it doesn't match up with how Coaches and GM's are doing business.

what does this mean? You just listed a bunch of buzz words and didn't end up making a point

yes there is more than production to hockey, but Komarov isn't good in other areas either. The reason GMs bring in players like Komarov is because they're a cheap place holder. That's it. If you have a better young player on an ELC, it makes sense to use them

 

[ErnieLeafs]

i love you in a totally platonic way, Ernie.
(honestly, when i hear fan boy, i want to dig someone's eyes out with a teaspoon).

The love is reciprocated

 

[CanadasTeam]

Jake the Troll gonna make the Bruins pay

 

[ErnieLeafs]

TSN panel has Boston winning series by votes 3–1 . At least Andie P picked the Leafs.

Let them all sleep on this team. I hope everyone picks Boston.

 

[Daisy Jane]

TSN panel has Boston winning series by votes 3–1 . At least Andie P picked the Leafs.

of course she did, she's a unabashed leafs fan.
everyone else is being all "neutral".

 

[Daisy Jane]

Let them all sleep on this team. I hope everyone picks Boston.

from everything i've seen only Shannon picked the Leafs in six (citing the speed, and the way the Bruins has played down the stretch, plus re-inserting walking wounded). (and now Andi).

everyone thinks that the physicality of the Bruins will rub the Leafs out.

 

[eddieO]

Let me get something straight...

Holding an opinion that a grinder, someone who kills penalties, agitates, plays on the walls, and forechecks; an opinion held by nearly, if not all coaches in the modern game, makes someone a "fan boy"?

First of all, unless you're actually 12, stop using vernacular like you are. It's an awful look, and immediately discredits what you say by making you look like a fool. Adults calling other adults "fan boy" makes my insides cringe.

Second, I didn't say it was wise to match Komarov up with Marchand as a standard. Nice reach to attempt to get a leg up. What you quoted was simply stating that there is so much more to the game than scoring production, and the fact that the leading hockey minds in the game go out of their way to aquire players that bring those other traits isn't a blight on my opinion, it's a blight on your's. Clearly, you have your idea of how things should be, and that's your right, but it doesn't match up with how Coaches and GM's are doing business.

Excellent post.

And to the highlighted part, there's some circles online who believe they're smarter than Babcock. It goes beyond just criticizing him, it's a real belief that because they've accumulated stats, podcast thoughts and blog opinions, they are smarter than one of the most successful coaches in the game.

It's a look that won't age well. Additionally, the "fan boy" slur is a favorite among this group.

 

[ottomaddox]

Leafs in 6 fof me.

Why? Because I am a huge fan.

Also: speed, excellent play at home, goaltending, coaching, 3 lines that can score, healthy, and well rested.

 

[ACC1224]

Excellent post.

And to the highlighted part, there's some circles online who believe they're smarter than Babcock. It goes beyond just criticizing him, it's a real belief that because they've accumulated stats, podcast thoughts and blog opinions, they are smarter than one of the most successful coaches in the game.

It's a look that won't age well. Additionally, the "fan boy" slur is a favorite among this group.

That's only because they aren't sheep who drink kool-aid.

 

[leaffaninvancouver]

That's only because they aren't sheep who drink kool-aid.

Babcock has his flaws but some people go off the deep end about him. He’s clearly an asset to the team.

 

[Caroline Says ll]

Let me get something straight...

Holding an opinion that a grinder, someone who kills penalties, agitates, plays on the walls, and forechecks; an opinion held by nearly, if not all coaches in the modern game, makes someone a "fan boy"?

The problem with what you wrote there is that Komorov this season has done none of those well.

While he has killed penalties, his clears, takeways, and board battles won are far less than the other main Leaf forward on the penalty kill.

His zone exits and entries into the offensive zone are bottom of the league. This is troubling for a deemed defensive player, and not something you want in a 4th liner.

He has not agitated all year. Prior years yes, he often took face washes, got other players infuriated, but this season find me a single moment of that. He does not play on the walls anymore, and no longer wins board battles as seemingly showed in how much time he spends on the defensive zone no matter what line he plays on.

You suggesting he has forecheked this year is the worst part. Forecheck would imply the he spends time in the other teams offensive zone. Forechecking is something you can see Brown and Hyman doing, all Komorov this season has done is retain no form of possession in the offensive zone.

The Komorov you described was one of previous years, this season that has all been non-existent.

 

[ACC1224]

Babcock has his flaws but some people go off the deep end about him. He’s clearly an asset to the team.

Of course he has flaws, everyone does.

 

[Nithoniniel]

Holding an opinion that a grinder, someone who kills penalties, agitates, plays on the walls, and forechecks

No offense, but I don't understand the point you are making here. Komarov haven't really been much of an agitator the last 1½ years, and the last two points is something everybody does. If he was terrific enough at them, it would lead to results. There isn't much in that way to support Leo. He looks like a good PK option, an average puck retriever, and a frequent hitter.

I traced the discussion back a bit to a point in support of Leo that was about appreciating more than just one thing about a player. The thing is, you have three things compared to a laundry list of things he does not do well at the NHL level anymore. He's become a bit of a role player, someone who you disregard the overall game for because you want specific qualities. And that's fine. I hope he does well. But painting those that would rather not see him in the lineups as just staring at points is a gross misrepresentation.

 

[Kiwi]

Excellent post.

And to the highlighted part, there's some circles online who believe they're smarter than Babcock. It goes beyond just criticizing him, it's a real belief that because they've accumulated stats, podcast thoughts and blog opinions, they are smarter than one of the most successful coaches in the game.

It's a look that won't age well. Additionally, the "fan boy" slur is a favorite among this group.

Hold up, i think Babcock is a fine coach but there's a fairly large sub-set of fans on here who agreed with everything he does, no matter what that is

Babcock is human, he does good and bad and he should be critiqued or praised accordingly

If you agree with Babcock I'm fine with it but I'd like to see some evidentiary support to show why Babcock is right in your opinion not just "because Babcock says so"

 

[Clark4Ever]

Let them all sleep on this team. I hope everyone picks Boston.

Yup. I prefer the underdog role.

 

[DopeyFish]

All i know is komarov has like the worst CF% on the team, and Johnsson has one of the best. Johnsson-Plek-Kap was always pushing the play into the other teams zone. When Komarov came back, the play started to be tilted back towards ours.

Puck retrieval, breakout, skating, tenaciousness is all important traits that Komarov no longer has. He just kind of floats around and it sucks.

Johnsson, even though smaller, is a puck hound. Komarov is reacting more than being proactive. You need to be proactive to be helpful.

 

[Fenway]

 

[Liminality]

I think the Leafs want the underdog role, I want them to underestimate us.

 

[CantLoseWithMatthews]

All i know is komarov has like the worst CF% on the team, and Johnsson has one of the best. Johnsson-Plek-Kap was always pushing the play into the other teams zone. When Komarov came back, the play started to be tilted back towards ours.

Puck retrieval, breakout, skating, tenaciousness is all important traits that Komarov no longer has. He just kind of floats around and it sucks.

Johnsson, even though smaller, is a puck hound. Komarov is reacting more than being proactive. You need to be proactive to be helpful.

another thing is that speed and skill cause more problem for Boston than whatever Komarov does out there. Hopefully Babcock makes changes in a timely fashion

 

[Morgs]

another thing is that speed and skill cause more problem for Boston than whatever Komarov does out there. Hopefully Babcock makes changes in a timely fashion

The guy still plays on the Kadri line at times. Babs needs some veteran presence to replace Nylander when he's not being gud enough.

 

[Machinehead]

Yo I totally forgot Dominic Moore is on the team

 

[MR4]

I was fine with him being used in a shutdown role earlier in the year, and am comfortable enough with him in his current 4th-line position. Intangibles that can't be quantified are still important to some coaches (such as Babcock) and I've been glad that our rebuild has been managed through the perspective of developing quality people and players, which starts with things like responsibility and work ethic.

It's important to remember where we are in the rebuild when ****ting on guys like Hyman, Leo, Polak and Brown. I wouldn't say I'm a "Komarov Fanboy", but I certainly see the value at this point in time in the Leafs icing veterans who have been around the block a few times, even if they're not necessarily the most skilled options available.

If things play out as dark as people here seem to be expecting, though, then I do certainly hope we'll see a shake-up, with Johnsson's youth being inserted back into the lineup.

Although I disagree that there's value in playing vets because they're vets over kids that have demonstrated they're more skilled (See Kappy being a gamechanger last year after 8 NHL games), I can definitely respect your opinion on it as you're willing to accept a shake-up if it plays out how others see it, and honestly if Komarov does have a good game 1 where we see last year's Komarov vs this years, then I'll too support him staying in

Let me get something straight...

Holding an opinion that a grinder, someone who kills penalties, agitates, plays on the walls, and forechecks; an opinion held by nearly, if not all coaches in the modern game, makes someone a "fan boy"?

First of all, unless you're actually 12, stop using vernacular like you are. It's an awful look, and immediately discredits what you say by making you look like a fool. Adults calling other adults "fan boy" makes my insides cringe.

Second, I didn't say it was wise to match Komarov up with Marchand as a standard. Nice reach to attempt to get a leg up. What you quoted was simply stating that there is so much more to the game than scoring production, and the fact that the leading hockey minds in the game go out of their way to aquire players that bring those other traits isn't a blight on my opinion, it's a blight on your's. Clearly, you have your idea of how things should be, and that's your right, but it doesn't match up with how Coaches and GM's are doing business.

Let me get something straight, you just described Hyman, Komarov hasn't fit this description all year, which is why I called you a fanboy as if you can't see it I expect their to be past love for Komarov clouding your judgement. But to talk about how you're cringing about being called a fanboy is f***ing hilarious considering your first reply to me consisted of accusing me of living in an ignorant bubble and there being no hope for me. (And now in this post, essentially calling me 12)

And jfc can you stop appealing to authority and actually make an argument on evidence provided by yourself? I'm sure with how much you defer to Babcock on this then you must've supported Martin staying in the lineup over Kapanen, Dermott not playing etc etc? Even though as time past Babcock realized it was a mistake to not have those kids in as they help us more to win. Hell, considering we're talking about Komarov, just look at how much the team improved once he realized his mistake of keeping Komarov on the 2nd line for half the season.

And I have literally no idea why you're saying "well I didn't say Komarov should defend Marchand" as I said nothing of the sort, and just seems like an wild exaggeration to bring down an argument you don't agree with.

Excellent post.

And to the highlighted part, there's some circles online who believe they're smarter than Babcock. It goes beyond just criticizing him, it's a real belief that because they've accumulated stats, podcast thoughts and blog opinions, they are smarter than one of the most successful coaches in the game.

It's a look that won't age well. Additionally, the "fan boy" slur is a favorite among this group.

Again, did you support Martin staying in over Kapanen & Leivo for most of the season? Did you support Dermott being left in the AHL for most of the season? Since I didn't, as I could make my own opinion instead of reflecting it to "Babs knows better", and Babs eventually found out he had the wrong opinion on those 2 points in the first place. All evidence from this season shows Johnsson gives us more of a chance to win than Komarov, so I'm easily willing to keep my opinion on it over deferring to Babs knows better, especially when one of Babs biggest faults in the eyes of Wings fans was his overdependence on real gud pro grinders.

No offense, but I don't understand the point you are making here. Komarov haven't really been much of an agitator the last 1½ years, and the last two points is something everybody does. If he was terrific enough at them, it would lead to results. There isn't much in that way to support Leo. He looks like a good PK option, an average puck retriever, and a frequent hitter.

I traced the discussion back a bit to a point in support of Leo that was about appreciating more than just one thing about a player. The thing is, you have three things compared to a laundry list of things he does not do well at the NHL level anymore. He's become a bit of a role player, someone who you disregard the overall game for because you want specific qualities. And that's fine. I hope he does well. But painting those that would rather not see him in the lineups as just staring at points is a gross misrepresentation.

Very good post (as always Nith ), and even on the "frequent hitter" part we haven't seen 1 momentum changing hit while the Leafs stats counter is known for being too lenient on giving a tick for a hit when other arenas wouldn't which inflates his totals even more, so I even have to disagree on the extent his hitting is benefitting us.

If he brings back the Zach Hyman style game then we'll enjoy it, but we haven't seen the Hyman version of Komarov in a long time.

 

[Morgs]

Yo I totally forgot Dominic Moore is on the team

So did we

 

[Machinehead]

So did we

Yeah, he's definitely not what he used to be, but shit, I remember watching that old buzzard play when he was 23 years old. Gonna be nice.