Dreger: Duchene Mega-thread: Habs, NSH inquired about Duchene. Asking price is ridiculous.

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Brock Radunske

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Aug 8, 2012
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It's clear to those who have no idea what is going on in Colorado. Duchene, Landeskog, Nate, Rantanen, Zadorov and Barrie are the only ones who are doing something on the ice and contributing to the team. The supporting cast is the rotten part of the team, supposed veteran leaders are the problem on the team, not the core that is actually showing up and playing decent hockey every given night despite the fact that 80% of the roster does everything in their power to lose games.

They need to get rid of bums like Iginla, Soderberg, Beauchemin, Colbourne, Comeau, Mitchell, Bourque, Martinsen, Grigorenko and Gelinas, not Matt Duchene.

They have 28 points so far and they're not even tanking on purpose.
The supporting cast isn't to blame. The bolded players are talented and numerous enough to make a difference if they were willing or able.
 
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Benstheman

Registered User
Nov 20, 2014
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Would rather have Landeskog over Duchene if Galchenyuk comes back healthy.

I'd offer:

To Colorado: 2017 1st rounder, Mikhail Sergachev, David Desharnais (for cap reasons)

To Montreal: Gabriel Landeskog

Habs lineup for the playoffs:

Pacioretty - Galchenyuk - Radulov
Landeskog - Danault - Gallagher
Lehkonen - Plekanec - Shaw
Byron - Mitchell - _____

Emelin - Weber
Markov - Petry
Beaulieu - Pateryn
Nesterov

Price
Montoya

That's about as deep of a lineup as you can get - great mix of size, speed, talent and toughness with great leadership.

Not giving up Sergachev for Landeskog though.
 

Ivan13

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You 28 points so far and you're not even tanking on purpose.
The supporting cast isn't to blame. The bolded players are talented and numerous enough to make a difference if they were willing or able.

Watch the damn games. Jerome Iginla was -5 in 8 mins of ice time a handful of games ago and a chunk of that TOI was at PP as well. The depth forwards with their apathy and a woefully untalented D behind Barrie and Z are killing the team, not Matt Duchene.

FTR

Duchene is on pace for 56 points, playing on a team that is on pace to score 164 goals, and that's including a ''hot'' start to the season. Which means he in on pace to contribute on 34% of his team's goals.
 
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Habs Halifax

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Jul 11, 2016
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Stop That.

Duchene is 3 years younger, is way better than Gomez, who, at that time, was considering like one of the worst contracts in the league. And most of all, Habs were far far far away from being 1 piece away of being contender.

Go look at Gomez's #'s prior to being traded to the Habs and compare that to Duchene's numbers today. Your talking about hindsight after he was traded and how much he declined.
 
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luckofirish8

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Jan 18, 2012
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It's a consideration. Right now, if Poile were to protect all four top-4 defensemen and the top three forwards (Neal, Forsberg and Johansen), he would then have to decide between Smith, Wilson and Jarnkrok and likely lose one of the other two. Wilson probably won't be protected or selected (paid too much for too little production), so it comes down to Smith, the 20-goal scorer whose $4.25M cap hit is a little rich, and Jarnkrok, the 15-goal scorer with a mere $1.9M cap hit. I think that Poile would protect Jarnkrok. The question, then, is whether Poile would be OK losing Smith. In some ways, getting that $4.25M cap hit off the books would do him a favor. On the other hand, his 20 goals are valuable to a Preds team in need of scorers.

If Poile were to trade Ekholm or Ellis, then he could suddenly protect 7 forwards, instead of 4. That would allow protecting all three of Smith, Wilson and Jarnkrok and the forward that he gets in trade for Ekholm/Ellis. That could be tempting for Poile. At that point, all that he would have to worry about is losing a 4th-line plugger like Cody McLeod or Colton Sissons or defenseman Matt Irwin, all players that are easily replaceable in free agency.

Smith, Wilson and Jarnkrok will likely be left unprotected as of now and two of the three probably period. The Top 4 D, the three you mentioned and Arvy will be protected now IMO.
 

Habs Halifax

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Zadorov was traded at 21? He didn't have top pairing potential when he was traded? He wasn't drafted high in a deep draft?

If Habs want Duchene, Sergachyov will be going the other way.

Your referring to when Zadorov being traded for ROR right? Well it's not the same situation as Buffalo negotiated a behind a scenes sign and trade deal with ROR prior to making the trade. We already had this debate you fail to acknowledge that Buffalo was allowed to talk to ROR and ensure they had him long term.

Compare that to Duchene? Well you can't because Duchene is not allowed to negotiate a new contract till he has one year left on his current deal, like ROR had when he was traded. I will say yes to a Sergachev package deal for Duchene only if the other team can do a similar deal like ROR (sign and trade) and ensure they have Duchene beyond 2019. What does that mean? Well Duchene stays a Aves till after next year!
 

Ivan13

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Go look at Gomez's #'s prior to being traded to the Habs. Your talking about hindsight after he was traded and how much he declined.

Now go look at the league scoring averages that year, Rangers scoring numbers from that year, Avs scoring numbers from this year, the fact that he didn't score 20 goals more than once in his career and that was in a year when PPs were handed out like candy and the league was way more scoring-friendly than today, and then get back to us. But I guess using context isn't all that important when you have an agenda to misrepresent data.
 

WesMcCauley

Registered User
Apr 24, 2015
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Your referring to when Zadorov being traded for ROR right? Well it's not the same situation as Buffalo negotiated a behind a scenes sign and trade deal with ROR prior to making the trade. We already had this debate you fail to acknowledge that Buffalo was allowed to talk to ROR and ensure they had him long term.

Compare that to Duchene? Well you can't because Duchene is not allowed to negotiate a new contract till he has one year left on his current deal, like ROR had when he was traded. I will say yes to a Sergachev package deal for Duchene only if the other team can do a similar deal like ROR (sign and trade) and ensure they have Duchene beyond 2019. What does that mean? Well Duchene stays a Aves till after next year!

One thing you Are missing is that the main reason for ROR not having a very high value when he was traded is because not many teams was Willing to give up assets for him and sign him to that high of a cap hit that he was asking for. ROR's value was low and it was a weird trade valuewise because of his demands on his new contract.
 

Habs Halifax

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Watch the damn games. Jerome Iginla was -5 in 8 mins of ice time a handful of games ago and a chunk of that TOI was at PP as well. The depth forwards with their apathy and a woefully untalented D behind Barrie and Z are killing the team, not Matt Duchene.

FTR

Duchene is on pace for 56 points, playing on a team that is on pace to score 164 goals, and that's including a ''hot'' start to the season. Which means he in on pace to contribute on 34% of his team's goals
.

Some can argue that Duchene should have higher #'s than 56 pts with all the talent up front in the top 6. The biggest reason why the Ave's stink is defense and goal tending. They can't get out of their own end most of the time which is affecting the ability to score goals.

Duchene should have better Power Play #'s though IMO.
 

Ivan13

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Your referring to when Zadorov being traded for ROR right? Well it's not the same situation as Buffalo negotiated a behind a scenes sign and trade deal with ROR prior to making the trade. We already had this debate you fail to acknowledge that Buffalo was allowed to talk to ROR and ensure they had him long term.

Compare that to Duchene? Well you can't because Duchene is not allowed to negotiate a new contract till he has one year left on his current deal, like ROR had when he was traded. I will say yes to a Sergachev package deal for Duchene only if the other team can do a similar deal like ROR (sign and trade) and ensure they have Duchene beyond 2019. What does that mean? Well Duchene stays a Aves till after next year!

That's why it took a week for him to sign? That's why it wasn't reported anywhere that they agreed to an extension beforehand? And no, we didn't have this debate. We had a debate about how to count up to 2.5.

And who are the Aves?
 

DudeWhereIsMakar

Bergevin sent me an offer sheet
Apr 25, 2014
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It would basically look like this

Montreal: Matt Duchene

Colorado: Noah Juulsen, David Desharnais, Zach Fucale and 1st 2017
 

WesMcCauley

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Apr 24, 2015
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Some can argue that Duchene should have higher #'s than 56 pts with all the talent up front in the top 6. The biggest reason why the Ave's stink is defense and goal tending. They can't get out of their own end most of the time which is affecting the ability to score goals.

Duchene should have better Power Play #'s though IMO.

Lol AVS top 6 is not very good
 

Habs Halifax

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One thing you Are missing is that the main reason for ROR not having a very high value when he was traded is because not many teams was Willing to give up assets for him and sign him to that high of a cap hit that he was asking for. ROR's value was low and it was a weird trade valuewise because of his demands on his new contract.

Yes and the Sabres were desperate enough to do the sign and trade deal because they wanted a center badly. I totally agree $7.5M AAV for ROR is more than it should be but lets not get side tracked because the fact remains that the Sabres had the option of the sign and trade to ensure ROR stayed with them long term. That allowed them to trade Zadorov. This has been my case all along with how the Habs and any other team can't give the "Sergachev" type in a package deal because there is a 50/50 chance Duchene walks and has a bidding war for his services beyond 2019.
 

Ivan13

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Some can argue that Duchene should have higher #'s than 56 pts with all the talent up front in the top 6. The biggest reason why the Ave's stink is defense and goal tending. They can't get out of their own end most of the time which is affecting the ability to score goals.

Duchene should have better Power Play #'s though IMO.

What talent? He and three other players? One of which is a rookie, and the other is having a down year? His right wing was claimed off waiver this year for God's sake.

You are posting more and more stuff that is so far from reality that this is reaching comical proportions. He is involved in 30% of all the goals his team has scored and that's with missing 5 games. If that's not very good/impressive I don't know what is. Radulov who is doing amazing has been involved in 25% of Habs goals thus far.
 

Leon Lucius Black

Registered User
Nov 5, 2007
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To the Habs:

Duchene

To the Avs:

Sergachev
1st round pick
2nd round pick (Habs have two this year and three next year, whichever the Avs want)
Desharnais (cap dump)
De la Rose, Hudon, Andrighetto or Carr

I love Sergachev, but getting a guy like Duchene and being able to run Chucky/Duchene down the middle for the future would be huge.
 

Habs Halifax

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Lol AVS top 6 is not very good

MacKinnon, Duchene, Landeskog, Rantanen, Grigorenko, Nieto is not a bad top 6 IMO. Who you trying to fool? They are a young group but have a difficult time scoring due to being in their own end. Like I said, the Aves stink because the defense and goal tending is terriable.
 

Ivan13

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MacKinnon, Duchene, Landeskog, Rantanen, Grigorenko, Nieto is not a bad top 6 IMO. Who you trying to fool? They are a young group but have a difficult time scoring due to being in their own end. Like I said, the Aves stink because the defense and goal tending is terriable.

Lists 6 guys, one is a rookie, one is beyond terrible, one is having a down year offensively and the 4th one was claimed off waivers a month ago. Congrats you really proved him wrong :laugh:
 

Habs Halifax

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What talent? He and three other players? One of which is a rookie, and the other is having a down year? His right wing was claimed off waiver this year for God's sake.

You are posting more and more stuff that is so far from reality that this is reaching comical proportions. He is involved in 30% of all the goals his team has scored and that's with missing 5 games. If that's not very good/impressive I don't know what is. Radulov who is doing amazing has been involved in 25% of Habs goals thus far.

How do you explain 8pts in 42 games on the PP when the #1 unit is Duchene, MacKinnon, Landeskog, Rantanen, & Barrie. Seems like a lot of talent to me right there? Like I said... The Aves are just not a complete team. They do have some really good pieces to build from. It's the overall depth is what the problem is.

Notice how I don't attack you like you attack me? Just state you case man and be respectful. Grow up and learn how to debate like a grown up
 

Habs Halifax

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Lists 6 guys, one is a rookie, one is beyond terrible, one is having a down year offensively and the 4th one was claimed off waivers a month ago. Congrats you really proved him wrong :laugh:

What are we debating other than just arguing with each other about everything? I'm not saying Duchene sucks. Relax. You make it sound like I said the Ave's top 6 was the best in the NHL. It's not terrible... Id say it's the strongest part of their team though. The bottom 6, defense, and goal tending is why they are last place.
 

Ivan13

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How do you explain 8pts in 42 games on the PP when the #1 unit is Duchene, MacKinnon, Landeskog, Rantanen, & Barrie. Seems like a lot of talent to me right there? Like I said... The Aves are just not a complete team. They do have some really good pieces to build from. It's the overall depth is what the problem is.

Notice how I don't attack you like you attack me? Just state you case man and be respectful. Grow up and learn how to debate like a grown up

Pointing out the inane things in one's post isn't attacking. Duchene and the Avs aren't good on the PP because of the scheme there, and their PP coach who needed to be fired years ago. They also have no PPQB on the roster to speak off.
 

Syckle78

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Nov 5, 2011
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If it happens will be something like...

TO MTL: Duchene + "something"

TO COL: Plekanec, Beaulieu, (one of) Juulsen/McCarron/Scherbak, 1st

Sergachev is a deal-breaker and will not being going to Colorado.

A top line center is not getting traded for that junk package. Not a single enticing piece there. If that's the trade sakic should be fired on the spot.
 

BLNY

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Aug 3, 2004
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How do you explain 8pts in 42 games on the PP when the #1 unit is Duchene, MacKinnon, Landeskog, Rantanen, & Barrie. Seems like a lot of talent to me right there? Like I said... The Aves are just not a complete team. They do have some really good pieces to build from. It's the overall depth is what the problem is.

Notice how I don't attack you like you attack me? Just state you case man and be respectful. Grow up and learn how to debate like a grown up

PP success doesn't have a lot to do with talent. Habs fans should know that. Confidence is the most important thing. Second is coaching. Give that group Muller, and their PP improves.
 
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