FrozenKing18
Where is my super suit?
From what I read, he had issues adjusting due to the COVID protocols, which is valid. What is the excuse for this season? I get maybe its a new system, but its not even that, its the lack of hustle out there.
Dubois
- Thread starter Schmooley
- Start date
“New system” doesn’t excuse all the coasting and lack of engagement. He’s not confused when he’s doing fly-by poke checks and acting like he’s allergic to going into the corners. Blake gave him 68 f***ing sheets and he barely looks interested. I don’t buy the adjustment bullshit at all.
johnjm22
Pseudo Intellectual
- Aug 2, 2005
- 20,896
- 17,715
He needs a year to adjust to a new system before he can put in effort on a puck battle.
DoktorJeep
Fair winds and following seas Nikolai.
If I objectively look at PLD and ignore the money, I think he’s part of any potential solution. Short term, the simplest approach seems to be #2C. It seems a better slotting for the current roster construction over 3C. Danault as an elite third line center makes sense.
The question is wingers. He obviously needs a guy with a motor like Byfield. Putting Fiala there and having it pay off is ideal. The biggest risk of failure would be goaltending at that point.
So, I’m curious to see what the lineup is and if Dubois steps up or even further down.
The question is wingers. He obviously needs a guy with a motor like Byfield. Putting Fiala there and having it pay off is ideal. The biggest risk of failure would be goaltending at that point.
So, I’m curious to see what the lineup is and if Dubois steps up or even further down.
johnjm22
Pseudo Intellectual
- Aug 2, 2005
- 20,896
- 17,715
I don't understand this line of thinking.
If you're looking at him objectively, ignoring salary, he should be on the bench. He's arguably been the worst player on the team.
Part of the reason for bringing him in, was so you don't have a typical 1st/2nd/3rd line structure, but instead have 3 scoring lines you can roll with even ES TOI.
kilowatt
the vibes are not immaculate
- Jan 1, 2009
- 18,667
- 21,722
Put Dubois and Fiala with Lizotte and have the highest-paid fourth line in the league. When Arvidsson gets back, we can roll four lines and line up like this:
Grundstrom - Kopitar - Kempe
Turcotte - Byfield - Kaliyev
Moore - Danault - Laferriere
Dubois - Lizotte - Fiala
Grundstrom - Kopitar - Kempe
Turcotte - Byfield - Kaliyev
Moore - Danault - Laferriere
Dubois - Lizotte - Fiala
bmr
Registered User
- Jan 23, 2013
- 1,883
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Rick Knickleback
Registered User
I keep going back to this thread in the hopes of some morsel of good news, but it’s just a s*** sandwich all the way down.
Agreed, if he was just some no name free agent journeyman or veteran they signed on a 1 year 1M dollar contract he'd be in and out of the lineup, or in Ontario.
Raccoon Jesus
We were right there
Sorry guys i've been playing the first half of the season in a chastity belt and with two broken legs and a traumatic brain injury but the firing of coach McKoala and the reattachment of my dick has me feeling 100%
DoktorJeep
Fair winds and following seas Nikolai.
I don’t see the case for him being the worst player on the team. More like middle of the pack and a bit unlucky, both at 5v5. Which is most of his usage, afaik.
I do agree about the reasoning for the move. I just think that is evidence that management isn’t on the same page as far as team identity.
Blake seems to want a team that plays a defensive system. But they sign one dimensional players to big money deals. When those players provide less than full value, they are blamed for not playing the system.
This approach of trying to be great at defense and ok at offense doesn’t work if you’re trying to contend. I don’t think it’s a 3-2 league anymore. And it’s too hard to play mistake free hockey over the course of a season plus playoffs.
So you have to look at your assets and liabilities. The playoffs are still a strong possibility. But you have no cap flexibility to improve the roster with only a couple of weeks till the trade deadline. The only things to be done that have any chance of making a positive impact are player deployment and, to a lesser degree, systems.
For systems, any changes should be tweaks that target team wide issues. Offense is the clear problem because it’s both the forwards and defensemen who aren’t scoring like expected. And if you do that, then the player deployment needs to align with the changes.
So the only thing that makes sense to me, if you want to turn things around, is play your best players together and for the most minutes. If they fail to play the defensive system that the guys lower in the lineup are playing, while also losing, then you can actually hold them accountable.
I think we’ve seen enough of this schizophrenic strategy of pounding round pegs into square holes season after season.
when arvidson gets back we will go on a tear.
the kings are lacking aging, injured and small non physical wingers. and next year maybe we can get to watch a line with lizotte centering arvidson and a kings draft choice of a small r handed semi scoring non physical defenseman. we can mix pierre in if we need a mike richards type for a game or two. otherwize pierre must be slotted higher in the lineup based on his physicality and scoring abilities and history.
pierre is our very own french bulldog and history shows his love and obsession with the game of hockey.
the kings are lacking aging, injured and small non physical wingers. and next year maybe we can get to watch a line with lizotte centering arvidson and a kings draft choice of a small r handed semi scoring non physical defenseman. we can mix pierre in if we need a mike richards type for a game or two. otherwize pierre must be slotted higher in the lineup based on his physicality and scoring abilities and history.
pierre is our very own french bulldog and history shows his love and obsession with the game of hockey.
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Ziggy Stardust
Master Debater
To solve this problem, we just need Dubois to fall into a bottomless pit, like Ozzie Smith did on The Simpsons.
johnjm22
Pseudo Intellectual
- Aug 2, 2005
- 20,896
- 17,715
| Player | GP | +/- |
| Quinton Byfield | 46 | 14 |
| Anze Kopitar | 48 | 12 |
| Mikey Anderson | 48 | 12 |
| Adrian Kempe | 48 | 11 |
| Drew Doughty | 48 | 9 |
| Matt Roy | 47 | 7 |
| Jordan Spence | 42 | 6 |
| Trevor Moore | 48 | 5 |
| Blake Lizotte | 34 | 4 |
| Trevor Lewis | 48 | 3 |
| Phillip Danault | 48 | 3 |
| Alex Turcotte | 2 | 3 |
| Vladislav Gavrikov | 43 | 2 |
| Arthur Kaliyev | 38 | 1 |
| Tobias Bjornfot | 1 | 0 |
| Jacob Moverare | 5 | -1 |
| Samuel Fagemo | 4 | -1 |
| Carl Grundstrom | 48 | -2 |
| Jaret Anderson-Dolan | 20 | -2 |
| Andreas Englund | 48 | -5 |
| Brandt Clarke | 6 | -5 |
| Kevin Fiala | 48 | -6 |
| Alex Laferriere | 47 | -6 |
| Pierre-Luc Dubois | 48 | -16 |
| Player | GP | SAT% |
| Alex Turcotte | 2 | 62.5 |
| Samuel Fagemo | 4 | 59.6 |
| Brandt Clarke | 6 | 58.9 |
| Jordan Spence | 42 | 58.5 |
| Trevor Moore | 48 | 58.3 |
| Phillip Danault | 48 | 58.3 |
| Arthur Kaliyev | 38 | 58.2 |
| Jacob Moverare | 5 | 58 |
| Kevin Fiala | 48 | 57.9 |
| Quinton Byfield | 46 | 56.1 |
| Matt Roy | 47 | 55.8 |
| Carl Grundstrom | 48 | 55.4 |
| Blake Lizotte | 34 | 55.3 |
| Vladislav Gavrikov | 43 | 55.3 |
| Anze Kopitar | 48 | 55 |
| Andreas Englund | 48 | 54.5 |
| Drew Doughty | 48 | 54.3 |
| Adrian Kempe | 48 | 54 |
| Trevor Lewis | 48 | 53.9 |
| Mikey Anderson | 48 | 53.4 |
| Pierre-Luc Dubois | 48 | 52.7 |
| Alex Laferriere | 47 | 52.2 |
| Jaret Anderson-Dolan | 20 | 47 |
| Tobias Bjornfot | 1 | 35.2 |
| Player | GP | On-Ice GF % |
| Alex Turcotte | 2 | 100 |
| Quinton Byfield | 46 | 62.7 |
| Anze Kopitar | 48 | 60 |
| Adrian Kempe | 48 | 59.6 |
| Jordan Spence | 42 | 55.3 |
| Drew Doughty | 48 | 55 |
| Trevor Moore | 48 | 54.5 |
| Phillip Danault | 48 | 53.9 |
| Mikey Anderson | 48 | 53.2 |
| Arthur Kaliyev | 38 | 52.7 |
| Blake Lizotte | 34 | 52.3 |
| Vladislav Gavrikov | 43 | 52.2 |
| Matt Roy | 47 | 51.5 |
| Trevor Lewis | 48 | 50 |
| Kevin Fiala | 48 | 49.2 |
| Alex Laferriere | 47 | 43.4 |
| Andreas Englund | 48 | 43.3 |
| Carl Grundstrom | 48 | 43.2 |
| Jaret Anderson-Dolan | 20 | 42.1 |
| Pierre-Luc Dubois | 48 | 39.2 |
| Jacob Moverare | 5 | 25 |
| Brandt Clarke | 6 | 16.6 |
| Samuel Fagemo | 4 | 0 |
Middle of the pack?
Who's been worse than Dubois? Rookies/Tweeners/Part-Timers don't count.
DoktorJeep
Fair winds and following seas Nikolai.
lumbergh
It was an idea. I didn't say it was a good idea.
johnjm22
Pseudo Intellectual
- Aug 2, 2005
- 20,896
- 17,715
The eyeball test and actual (not expected) results tell me he's been probably the worst regular forward on the team.
When he gets some speed in the neutral zone he can carry the puck into the opponent's territory pretty well. He'll float some "high danger" passes that have the potential to result in a scoring chance, but too often they get intercepted.
I don't have much else good to say about his game. He's been a net negative for sure.
From the coach's perspective, I'm not sure what you do with him. You want to get him going which means putting him in a scoring role, but at the same time he doesn't deserve it.
Just his presence is probably bad for team morale.
DoktorJeep
Fair winds and following seas Nikolai.
I can’t argue with your eyeball test. But the numbers I cited mainly seem to suggest that 5v5, his minutes are down and his wingers are not finishing. Which also matches what I’m seeing.
As far as deserving more minutes and better wingers, I think it’s fair to question him and equally question whether he’s best used as a third line center.
At the least he should be optimized over Danault at 5v5 and on the PP. To not do it is at cross purposes with the cost of the acquisition. Where things break down is trying to get the most out of PLD (and other one way guys) doesn’t work with all the other regulars.
You can’t have a schizophrenic team that is half defensive and half offensive. The bet that you can get one way players to buy into a defensive mentality has proven to fail the majority of the time. It makes more sense with this roster and league to get the 200 foot guys to sacrifice defense for offense while playing less minutes.
The defense first guys are a bunch of sunk costs who have performed to a low ceiling consistently. With managements jobs on the line, they’d be stupid not to do anything to elevate the talent they have spent dearly for.
johnjm22
Pseudo Intellectual
- Aug 2, 2005
- 20,896
- 17,715
Herby
Thank You, Team 144
Out of the two big trades, this one is still not even close to being as bad as the other one.
Nobody has really mentioned what's going on in Winnipeg, but it's not exactly been all roses. I think some here got a bit ahead of themselves with unsustainable production very early in the year (especially since the same thing happened here)
Since the Christmas break
Vilardi -
17 Games
4 Goals
1 Assist
5 Points
Iafallo
19 Games
2 Goals
1 Assist
3 Points
Kupari
7 Games
0 Goals
0 Assists
0 Points
The worst part about this trade is the contract extension and cap hit that came with it, way more so than what the Kings gave up in assets.
Nobody has really mentioned what's going on in Winnipeg, but it's not exactly been all roses. I think some here got a bit ahead of themselves with unsustainable production very early in the year (especially since the same thing happened here)
Since the Christmas break
Vilardi -
17 Games
4 Goals
1 Assist
5 Points
Iafallo
19 Games
2 Goals
1 Assist
3 Points
Kupari
7 Games
0 Goals
0 Assists
0 Points
The worst part about this trade is the contract extension and cap hit that came with it, way more so than what the Kings gave up in assets.
bmr
Registered User
- Jan 23, 2013
- 1,883
- 1,710
Maybe this simplifies things for PLD. If he can keep doing this, i'm not even that concerned with him showing up on the scoresheet every night. It's what we need - period.
Live in the Now
Registered User
Yeah I think honestly speaking that he's been pretty good. Made some great passes that should have been turned into goals. I know they have him on a 'good boy' system and that he hasn't earned this right but frankly if you put him out there with better players (which they have) you'll get better results (which they have). Playing him with Laf and JAD was ridiculous.
Buddy The Elf
Kings!
Yeah, but wasn't the trade contingent upon him signing that contract? That said, in a vacuum Fiala is far more productive and also didn't take away a spot in the line up for what was supposed to be the successor to Kopitar. You can make the argument that the Kings gave up more in either trade but in terms of what the Kings got back in either trade isn't really up for debate at this point. What sucks is if Byfield would've had performed the way he is this season during the last, that trade probably wouldn't have happened.
Herby
Thank You, Team 144
Yes it was, and that is certainly part of the trade, my whole point was the assets we gave up are not even close to what Faber and a 1st are. Iafallo at this point is JAG with a bloated contract. Vilardi is what he is, he's a winger who's going to play 60 games a year and put up about 40 points in a wildly inconsistent manner, 12 points in his 5 game hot streak where everyone was posting about him non-stop, and 8 points in the other 26. Kupari is the Finnish Nick Shore.
As for the QB part, yes, his development was delayed a year because of the stupid decision to have him in Ontario. It's exactly why teams put elite 18 year olds in the NHL even if they aren't ready to be good players (Hughes, Barkov, Joe Thornton etc). There are things that young players are going to have to overcome, that can only be overcome with NHL games, whether they are 18 or 20 it doesn't matter. But that's just another example of the Kings doing things wildly different than most other teams.
Winnipeg fan here. Even though he took some games off, he was overall a stud on the Jets during his tenure there. I can't believe he has magically become so terrible. Is it really just that he finally got what he wanted (destination, and his bag), and now just doesn't care and refuses to be engaged? I'm sure maybe that some of it, but there has to be more to it. At minimum he should be your 2nd line C, and front of net on PP1. What's with the weird usage? I get its sorta catch 22 of him not earning his minutes, but 3rd line C with plugs? Why give up all those assets and pay him so much for that?
I bet you anything, he will turn it around, and be dominant next year. Just you wait and see!
I bet you anything, he will turn it around, and be dominant next year. Just you wait and see!
I can confirm Kupari is nothing burger, he's now our 14th F (press box), and Iafallo on our 4th line (very meh), and Vilardi is exactly what you said. very streaky, currently stinkin up the joint.
