LeBrun: Dubois wants out of Winnipeg, will not sign a contract for next season

[Heldig]

Why is the Horvat trade not a good comparable? Are you really going to die on a hill thinking it's not and Dubois returns much more?

Name us a past trade where you can justify your higher value? A trade where it was a player with one RFA year left.

The 31st pick is not the same as the 17th pick.

Raty, rated as the 35th best prospect, is not the same guy that is rated 5th or 6th or later on a team's own list.

Camp dump is cap dump.

And Dubois IMO is better than Horvat.

 

[Adam da bomb]

It really couldn’t matter less if you see it or not.

No, but this is a discussion board based on opinion and I’m just stating mine.

 

[Habs Halifax]

I just don’t see Dach being just as good. He could be, and Perfetti could be a generational player, but, I just don’t see it.

You didn't watch Dach play last season then. Just admit it. His puck protection and ability to carry the puck with contact is actually better than Suzuki. Dach improved by a wide margin as the season went along.

It's possible Dach might not be as good as Dubois but based on his progress last season under MSL, he has shown his 3rd OA potential and he's still young and improving.

Dach needs to be omitted in the Dubois trade talk. Go try to ask for a quality like Dach from another team and see how far that gets you.

 

[Frank Drebin]

horvat had 20 games left of control, pld will be getting traded with an 8 year contract

By that logic, Horvat was traded with a 7 year contract

 

[Daximus]

Where did that last point come from? Also jets fans seem pretty convinced they don’t need D

We need RHD we dont need middling LHD.

By that logic, Horvat was traded with a 7 year contract

Horvat was unable to negotiate and extension legally at the time of the trade. At least with the team trading for him.

 

[gojetsgo]

By that logic, Horvat was traded with a 7 year contract

how did you come to that logic? they traded for him with out a guaranteed extension... they were just able to get one done...

 

[Frank Drebin]

Horvat was unable to negotiate and extension legally at the time of the trade. At least with the team trading for him.

What a risk by the Islanders to trade for him then. /s

 

[Adam da bomb]

You didn't watch Dach play last season then. Just admit it. His puck protection and ability to carry the puck with contact is actually better than Suzuki. Dach improved by a wide margin as the season went along.

It's possible Dach might not be as good as Dubois but based on his progress last season under MSL, he has shown his 3rd OA potential and he's still young and improving.

Dach needs to be omitted in the Dubois trade talk. Go try to ask for a quality like Dach from another team and see how far that gets you.

A) I didn’t say jets needed to get Dach. B) How closely does anyone who is a fan of another team watch someone closely. Based on their career projectory it seems unlikely that Dach will be as good.

 

[Frank Drebin]

how did you come to that logic? they traded for him with out a guaranteed extension... they were just able to get one done...

I guess Lamiorello just got lucky....he had no idea what kind of contract Horvat was looking for or if he would even be happy staying with the Islanders....risky move.

Because its not legal to discuss contracts until after the trade is completed.

 

[SCP Guy]

I very much doubt any team offers a young Dach type. We have to remember that Dubois's value is one RFA year and his trade value is not that much different than the Horvat trade.

Maybe it's more realistic to consider that the NHL piece is someone like Beauvillier, A close to NHL ready prospect (Raty), and a mid to late 1st.

I think Jets fans will be very disappointed if they think they are getting a Dach quality from anybody trying to trade for Dubois.

I agree the Habs can't and should not trade Dach for PLD.... Another team in a win now or win soon mode may be willing to trade that type of player.... The Habs are not a good trading partner at their very early stages of a rebuild... Jets fans are very happy with the development that PLDs camp has not taken a Montreal is the only place he will extend route. I can't see him ending up a Hab and that will be okay for all teams involved no one will die.

 

[Habs Halifax]

The 31st pick is not the same as the 17th pick.

Raty, rated as the 35th best prospect, is not the same guy that is rated 5th or 6th or later on a team's own list.

Camp dump is cap dump.

And Dubois IMO is better than Horvat.

It's a comparable and not all compatibles are exactly the same.

Dubois is not better than Horvat. All of Hintz, Larkin, Horvat, Dubois are close in center value. Some better at some things than others but overall, they are close. And I'm pretty sure Dubois's next 8 year deal will be close to the other 3.

31 or 32 is not the same as 17th but your forgetting that when the trade happened, you didn't know if was the 17th pick. Could have been 20th.

Raty is not better than Beck. Raty was just an older prospect. Beck is heading into his age 19 season and I don't care about your 5th or 6th rated narrative. Beck is a B+ type trending very very well and he has very good skating/size for a guy his age.

I don't see the NHL contract derailing things too much. As long as the Habs don't try to offload Gallagher for example.

The other angle to this is cap space and who is in the 5 or 6 team list of teams. Circumstance matters.

 

[MardyBum]

I guess Lamiorello just got lucky....he had no idea what kind of contract Horvat was looking for or if he would even be happy staying with the Islanders....risky move.

Because its not legal to discuss contracts until after the trade is completed.

"One of the first questions Horvat was asked when we spoke with him on the night of the trade, Jan. 30, was if he had talked with Islanders general manager Lou Lamoriello regarding a contract extension."

“Nothing has been discussed yet. It all kind of all happened so fast. So yeah, no talk on it yet,” Horvat said. “Obviously, we’ll see if we can get something done, but I’ll leave that to Pat (Morris, his agent) and everybody to handle that.”

Now we're into conspiracy theories!

 

[nhlfan9191]

horvat had 20 games left of control, pld will be getting traded with an 8 year contract

What difference does it make? Both teams were dealing with expiring contracts. How many games are left on the expiring contract doesn’t make all that much difference.

 

[General Fanager]

My max offer knowing what I know today...

* Beck. Habs hate to trade him but our center depth after trading him in the Dubois package is Suzuki, Dubois, Dach, and possibly W Smith if we draft him.

* Panthers 1st. Previoulsy this was off the table if Beck was included but it's now a late 1st so things have change.

* Dvorak (NHL contract and center depth the Jets can use). Especially if they trade both Dubois and Scheifele.

Other possible NHL contracts from the Habs are:
* Allen
* Armia
* Hoffman
* Eddy

Does anybody see a team trading for Dubois not sending a NHL contract back? I don't.

Yes so...not trading Beck.

 

[gojetsgo]

It's a comparable and not all compatibles are exactly the same.

Dubois is not better than Horvat. All of Hintz, Larkin, Horvat, Dubois are close in center value. Some better at some things than others but overall, they are close. And I'm pretty sure Dubois's next 8 year deal will be close to the other 3.

31 or 32 is not the same as 17th but your forgetting that when the trade happened, you didn't know if was the 17th pick. Could have been 20th.

Raty is not better than Beck. Raty was just an older prospect. Beck is heading into his age 19 season and I don't care about your 5th or 6th rated narrative. Beck is a B+ type trending very very well and he has very good skating/size for a guy his age.

I don't see the NHL contract derailing things too much. As long as the Habs don't try to offload Gallagher for example.

The other angle to this is cap space and who is in the 5 or 6 team list of teams. Circumstance matters.

it's not comparable if pld comes with an 8 year contract

What difference does it make? Both teams were dealing with expiring contracts. How many games are left on the expiring contract doesn’t make all that much difference.

if you can't see the difference between 20 games and an 8 year contract then idk what to tell you...

 

[Mersss]

I agree the Habs can't and should not trade Dach for PLD.... Another team in a win now or win soon mode may be willing to trade that type of player.... The Habs are not a good trading partner at their very early stages of a rebuild... Jets fans are very happy with the development that PLDs camp has not taken a Montreal is the only place he will extend route.

Give me one team who
1- Has the cap space to sign Dubois
2- Has a piece as good as Dach (please don't say Newhook lol) and is willing to lose on a good value contract for a slight upgrade

Answer is none. Avs can't afford Dubois unless Landeskog calls it qui, and even then they need to sign Toews and Byram to substantial raises. Most contenders can't afford Dubois due to cap space and would rather keep their yount cost controlled player than trade for an 8M$ forward

If Dubois list is something like
Habs
Avs
Tampa
Florida
NYR

Jets are screwed as the 4 other trams can't afford him

 

[Habs Halifax]

A) I didn’t say jets needed to get Dach. B) How closely does anyone who is a fan of another team watch someone closely. Based on their career projectory it seems unlikely that Dach will be as good.

Bet you I watched Perfetti play Jets games more than you have watched Dach play Habs games.

It really doesn't matter how low or high you are with Dach. He's not on the table. And thinking that another team is going to trade a Dach quality who is cost controlled, improving, and NHL proven is wishful thinking. If it's possible, good, trade him to that team. Habs are interested by not desperate.

The Dubois trade will be close to the Horvat trade. Book it

it's not comparable if pld comes with an 8 year contract


if you can't see the difference between 20 games and an 8 year contract then idk what to tell you...

It is comparable because Lou knew of his chances at extending Horvat before he made the trade. If you think otherwise, you don't know Lou that well.

Give me one team who
1- Has the cap space to sign Dubois
2- Has a piece as good as Dach (please don't say Newhook lol) and is willing to lose on a good value contract for a slight upgrade

Answer is none. Avs can't afford Dubois unless Landeskog calls it qui, and even then they need to sign Toews and Byram to substantial raises. Most contenders can't afford Dubois due to cap space and would rather keep their yount cost controlled player than trade for an 8M$ forward

If Dubois list is something like
Habs
Avs
Tampa
Florida
NYR

Jets are screwed as the 4 other trams can't afford him

Yup, Circumstance is a huge factor in this.

 

[gojetsgo]

It is comparable because Lou knew of his chances at extending Horvat before he made the trade. If you think otherwise, you don't know Lou that well.

rofl...

 

[Habs Halifax]

Yes so...not trading Beck.

Dvorak, Beck, and Panthers pick is my max point and I personally would consider it. I'm just as high on Beck as you and other Habs fans are but you seen the center depth we would have if we include Beck.

Including Beck in the Dubois trade is very similar to using Romanov+ to get Dach. It's trading from a position of strength in the pool like it was trading A LD in Romanov.

rofl...

Don't bother replying if that is your reply. Causes post wars on stupid stuff.

What difference does it make? Both teams were dealing with expiring contracts. How many games are left on the expiring contract doesn’t make all that much difference.

Apparently, Lou made the trade blind with no information on his chances at extending Horvat but Dubois with a 8 year extension increases his value 10X. That's the narrative you will get back.

Also, The 5 or 6 teams on Dubois list all have cap space and proven young players like Dach they are willing to trade.

 

[Daximus]

What a risk by the Islanders to trade for him then. /s

They didn't give up much.

Dvorak, Beck, and Panthers pick is my max point and I personally would consider it. I'm just as high on Beck as you and other Habs fans are but you seen the center depth we would have if we include Beck.

Including Beck in the Dubois trade is very similar to using Romanov+ to get Dach. It's trading from a position of strength in the pool like it was trading A LD in Romanov.



Don't bother replying if that is your reply. Causes post wars on stupid stuff.



Apparently, Lou made the trade blind with no information on his chances at extending Horvat but Dubois with a 8 year extension increases his value 10X. That's the narrative you will get back.

Also, The 5 or 6 teams on Dubois list all have cap space and proven young players like Dach they are willing to trade.

I like how time and again people doubt Chevy in situations like this and time and again he proves them wrong.

 

[waitin425]

Dach is on the verge of becoming a PLD type player. Every single Habs fan knows this. Anyone suggesting the Habs give up a younger version of PLD for current PLD simply don't know Dach. Absolute non-starter for reasons covered copious amounts in this thread.

Winnipeg is not in a power position here. They are set up to get fleeced.

The Habs offer of Dvorak, Harris/Beck and Florida 1st is about spot on to what I expect.

 

[Hunter368]

Maybe something like Dvorak, Farrell, Mailloux, 1st FLA

Habs have some decent (meaning solid but not sure can't miss types) albeit not great futures/prospects. If the Jets want futures as a big part of the return I think the Habs can put together a solid offer with a heavy leaning on futures. But the problem is the Jets have stated they want win now pieces and the Habs don't have any win now pieces that really hold any significant value aka Dvorak or Anderson. So that means Habs offers have to be heavy on futures and sounds like the Jets don't want that.

 

[nhlfan9191]

it's not comparable if pld comes with an 8 year contract


if you can't see the difference between 20 games and an 8 year contract then idk what to tell you...

The Islanders would’ve done due diligence on what they were actually getting with Horvat. That extension didn’t just appear out of thin air. And I said it in an earlier post to another guy. You’re trying to make the narrative you’re deserving of the value of Dubois signed to 8 years. That’s not what’s happening here. Anyone inquiring about him is looking to pay the price for his final year and the right to talk to him. That does not mean you’re entitled to the value of whatever you would get if you had him controlled for 8 years.

 

[General Fanager]

Dvorak, Beck, and Panthers pick is my max point and I personally would consider it. I'm just as high on Beck as you and other Habs fans are but you seen the center depth we would have if we include Beck.

Including Beck in the Dubois trade is very similar to using Romanov+ to get Dach. It's trading from a position of strength in the pool like it was trading A LD in Romanov.



Don't bother replying if that is your reply. Causes post wars on stupid stuff.



Apparently, Lou made the trade blind with no information on his chances at extending Horvat but Dubois with a 8 year extension increases his value 10X. That's the narrative you will get back.

Also, The 5 or 6 teams on Dubois list all have cap space and proven young players like Dach they are willing to trade.

I get your point but I still wouldn't deal Beck. Fla 1st and Harris is my max, maybe add a b level prospect too but that's about it....

 

[Frank Drebin]

it's not comparable if pld comes with an 8 year contract


if you can't see the difference between 20 games and an 8 year contract then idk what to tell you...

What are the terms of this 8 year deal?