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Draft and UDFA Thread: Part IV

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ZuccsFluffierFluffer said:
Well not to the point where its Taylor-Tyler, but McKenzie has alluded to there being some competition for that top slot.

"that doesn’t mean there hasn’t been some closing of what started this season as a considerable gap between Hughes and the rest of the 2019 draft class.
We still have Hughes at No. 1,” one NHL scout said, “but he’s No. 1 within a group of five or six. At the start of the season, Hughes was in a group by himself. He has company now.”

Many of the scouts surveyed said the strong play of Finnish forward Kaapo Kakko, who scored the gold-medal winning goal at the WJC, and Russian forward Vasili Podkolzin, who played a prominent role in Russia’s bronze-medal performance at the WJC, represent a challenge of sorts to Hughes."

https://www.tsn.ca/it-s-still-the-jack-hughes-draft-1.1246625
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Kakko has established himself as a franchise prospect, there’s no getting around that. But notice that while the article talks about shrinking a conseirdable gap, it never says that there is an absence of a gap.

You’re still looking a scenario where 10 out of 10 still takes Hughes. That doesn’t really lend itself to there being much debate.

From that same article:

But not one of those scouts was prepared to put Hughes anywhere other than No. 1. And some of them said that while the strong play of Kakko and Podkolzin, who are Nos. 2 and 3 respectively on TSN’s mid-season list, has tightened the race somewhat, there’s no need to overthink things.

“Hughes was the clear No. 1 to start the season, he is, for me, the clear No. 1 right now and I strongly suspect he’ll be the clear No. 1 at the draft,” another scout added. “There have been times this season where [Hughes] hasn’t been as productive or dominant as we expected, but he’s still playing at a really high level and putting up points. He’s a special player. So have Kakko and Podkolzin closed the gap? Yes, they have. But does a gap still exist? I would say yes.”

So basically, everything I just said. And I have to tell you, I’m hearing this from multiple angles. The biggest Hughes-Kakko debate is on HF Boards.

I love Kakko. I wouldn’t take him ahead of Hughes. But he’s an amazing player who would instantly become the best Rangers prospect and arguably has the potential to be the best Rangers forward in franchise history.

I feel like I should mention that because it sounds like I don’t like him when I’m debating how he compares to Hughes.
 
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Also interesting to hear that Podkolzin in that article, because he’s certainly not the “it” prospect around here.

I will say it’s interesting that we have Hughes and Kakko closer than most, while Podkolzin is almost nowhere to be found.

Forget the Hughes-Kakko debate, I think the reaction to the Rangers taking Podkolzin would be the most passionate.
 
Huge loss for the Rangers lottery chances tonight. I had them getting at least one point but thought they would get two.

If you look at the schedule ahead 9 games remaining and the next 3 against top 10 teams... could be a big time tank streak to end the year

This is the year to bottom out. Hopefully get to 5 and things work out with the lottery sequence
 
I’m with @Edge, it’s Hughes, then a gap, then Kakko, then another gap, then the rest, similar to Dahlin, Svechnikov and the rest last year. It feels like Hughes was so far ahead at the beginning of the season people think his progression this season is less impressive than others because they’ve taken relatively bigger steps.

I will say I think Kakko might be more ready to make a bigger impact in the NHL next season, but I think Hughes will be the better player long-term
 
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I don’t like that Hughes isn’t scoring any goals. That concerns me. Shoots like his brother. Which is on par with Julie Chu basically. I think Kakko is going to be an absolute beast
 
Gardner McKay said:
If we win the lottery (1st overall) and Gordie goes up there and announces Kakko, does anyone care?
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I'd be happy with that but I've been a Kakko over Hughes fan for over a year now.

Thinking about it, it would be better for this fanbase to win the 2nd overall pick instead of the 1st. That way the fans will not have a meltdown because we will just pick who is still there out of the two
 
Amazing Kreiderman said:
I'd be happy with that but I've been a Kakko over Hughes fan for over a year now.

Thinking about it, it would be better for this fanbase to win the 2nd overall pick instead of the 1st. That way the fans will not have a meltdown because we will just pick who is still there out of the two
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Oh don't worry in that scenario if Hughes is better we will still have a meltdown over how we never get the #1 pick and things never go our way
 
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Amazing Kreiderman said:
I'd be happy with that but I've been a Kakko over Hughes fan for over a year now.

Thinking about it, it would be better for this fanbase to win the 2nd overall pick instead of the 1st. That way the fans will not have a meltdown because we will just pick who is still there out of the two
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They’ll have a meltdown regardless when Kakko or Hughes isn’t getting first line minutes immediately
 
I honestly think Dach and Cozens are the most overrated top-10 players in a long time. I would take Krebs/Byram/Boldy/Turcotte/Zegras/Podkolzin over them
 
Definitely winning the 2nd pick in the lottery would probably be the best thing for the team. Less pressure with the pick and no matter what you are getting a potential superstar in either Hughes or Kakko.
 
The take that getting the 2nd pick would be better for us makes absolutely zero sense to me. It’s basically saying you’d be ok with not having a chance to draft the best playmaker the USNTDP has ever developed who has an absolutely dynamic package of speed, skill, and IQ. I’m not sure if it’s a lack of exposure to seeing these guys play, and I’ll admit I’m biased since I predominantly watch the USHL and WHL, but Hughes just completely changes the course of a game because of how much better he is than his competition. It’s rare to find someone that can read a game that well and process it at such a high pace, and we’d be fools to pass someone like that up. He’s already had games against college kids this year where he’s just dominated them because they can’t touch him.

I’m not saying it to knock on Kakko, but there’s a pretty clear delineation there when it comes to the two.
 
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TheKingsCourt said:
I honestly think Dach and Cozens are the most overrated top-10 players in a long time. I would take Krebs/Byram/Boldy/Turcotte/Zegras/Podkolzin over them
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Byram, definitely. Podkolzin, possibly. Turcotte and Zegras have closed the gap, but not nearly enough, IMO. And, at least to me, Krebs is not in the conversation.
 
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Mac n Gs said:
The take that getting the 2nd pick would be better for us makes absolutely zero sense to me. It’s basically saying you’d be ok with not having a chance to draft the best playmaker the USNTDP has ever developed who has an absolutely dynamic package of speed, skill, and IQ. I’m not sure if it’s a lack of exposure to seeing these guys play, and I’ll admit I’m biased since I predominantly watch the USHL and WHL, but Hughes just completely changes the course of a game because of how much better he is than his competition. It’s rare to find someone that can read a game that well and process it at such a high pace, and we’d be fools to pass someone like that up. He’s already had games against college kids this year where he’s just dominated them because they can’t touch him.

I’m not saying it to knock on Kakko, but there’s a pretty clear delineation there when it comes to the two.
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I do wonder sometimes if there is a certain appeal to alternatives when it comes to sports.

Often times there’s that temptation to hype the possibility of more. “You like this guy? We’ll wait until you see his brother” or “So and so is a great talent, but THIS guy is the real talent that people are overlooking.”

The first I can really recall it was in 1998. The world of following prospects was smaller then, and Red Line report was one of the first outside organizations to capitalize on an emerging niche. Long story short, they ranked Legwand ahead of Lecavalier and it felt like it was a bit of a stretch at the time.

But I think the appeal of making it seem closer isn’t all that different than election polling. It’s exciting, and entertaining, but it’s often not that close when you get right down to it.
 
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Edge said:
I do wonder sometimes if there is a certain appeal to alternatives when it comes to sports.

Often times there’s that temptation to hype the possibility of more. “You like this guy? We’ll wait until you see his brother” or “So and so is a great talent, but THIS guy is the real talent that people are overlooking.”

The first I can really recall it was in 1998. The world of following prospects was smaller then, and Red Line report was one of the first outside organizations to capitalize on an emerging niche. Long story short, they ranked Legwand ahead of Lecavalier and it felt like it was a bit of a stretch at the time.

But I think the appeal of making it seem closer isn’t all that different than election polling. It’s exciting, and entertaining, but it’s often not that close when you get right down to it.
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I think there’s also a bit of “this guy has been the #1 guy of the draft for so long” that makes people eventually get to the thought of “but what if he isn’t the best?”
 
GeorgeKaplan said:
I think there’s also a bit of “this guy has been the #1 guy of the draft for so long” that makes people eventually get to the thought of “but what if he isn’t the best?”
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Yeah, and that happens to a lot of the top prospects as well. You start to see pushback on guys who have been in the spotlight longer and a desire to find the hidden gems.
 
Leetch3 said:
who does he have at 65?
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The next Russian he’s going to Stalk around the world.

Mac n Gs said:
The take that getting the 2nd pick would be better for us makes absolutely zero sense to me. It’s basically saying you’d be ok with not having a chance to draft the best playmaker the USNTDP has ever developed who has an absolutely dynamic package of speed, skill, and IQ. I’m not sure if it’s a lack of exposure to seeing these guys play, and I’ll admit I’m biased since I predominantly watch the USHL and WHL, but Hughes just completely changes the course of a game because of how much better he is than his competition. It’s rare to find someone that can read a game that well and process it at such a high pace, and we’d be fools to pass someone like that up. He’s already had games against college kids this year where he’s just dominated them because they can’t touch him.

I’m not saying it to knock on Kakko, but there’s a pretty clear delineation there when it comes to the two.
Click to expand...

I think that it’s because we actually have a shot at getting him.
 
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Do we think Hughes jumps right into the NHL? I have heard he may join a Men's League (Swiss) post-Draft to spend next year.

Hey, win the lotto this year; have Hughes develop in another men's league while we tank (again, but much worse) next year; get another lotto pick. Then in 2020-21 the next regime takes over...
 
ZuccsFluffierFluffer said:
The next Russian he’s going to Stalk around the world.



I think that it’s because we actually have a shot at getting him.
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Right, but there really is no pressure when it comes to 1 or 2. You either get Hughes at 1 or Kakko at 2, and you immediately have a franchise prospect that will get people to pay to watch. The problem is 3 where you have to choose between a potential franchise d or a prospect with a potential, but not concrete, 1C ceiling
 
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