Does dubas remain GM if the leafs get bounced by Florida?

[Menzinger]

He is showing emotions, all GMs and Presidents do that. I don’t see anything wrong with that.

Agreed. Dubas' has opened himself up to a lot of criticism, but I find this one to be a bit odd.

Imo it's human to get excited when reacting to things like a playoff game not sit unnaturally still like a robot (something that's purely performative when guys do it anyways).

 

[Gabriel426]

Agreed. Dubas' has opened himself up to a lot of criticism, but I find this one to be a bit odd.

Imo it's human to get excited when reacting to things like a playoff game not sit unnaturally still like a robot (something that's purely performative when guys do it anyways).

Exactly. I have been talking with a few here about private owner Vs Corp, agree that having a private owner might be better bc they take losing more personally which is a good thing. Don’t understand why having a emotional invested GM is not a good thing.

 

[thewave]

Exactly. I have been talking with a few here about private owner Vs Corp, agree that having a private owner might be better bc they take losing more personally which is a good thing. Don’t understand why having a emotional invested GM is not a good thing.

Private owner with the caveat that they must love Hockey and know the sport. Stavro and Ilitch come to mind. When they didn't like the direction they made the moves needed quickly. These guys as with the TPP hum and haw.

 

[SImpelton]

It took a goalie with a 0.875 save percentage for the Leafs to finally get through to the 2nd round, only for them to get trounced in the 2nd round. They are far from contending for the Cup. The $11 million dollar club was a total joke against Florida. What once was a fast skill team is now a really slow team. The defense is really bad, you basically have 1 solid pairing and the rest is crap. I was starting to believe a little in Liljegren, but he was horrendous all playoffs long.

Well now let's be a little fair, this Panthers team is clearly better than people thought it was. Remember, they did beat the best team in the NHL (at least on paper) before they met the Leafs. Before being too hard on Dubas and team leadership at least pause to consider that the Panthers might just be really freaking good this year.

 

[ACC1224]

Exactly. I have been talking with a few here about private owner Vs Corp, agree that having a private owner might be better bc they take losing more personally which is a good thing. Don’t understand why having a emotional invested GM is not a good thing.

Why would ownership take losing personally a good thing?
No owners are happy when the team loses.

All you want from an owner is to give the team every opportunity to be successful after that it’s up to management. MLSE has done that, they may spend more money than any team in the league to try and be successful.

I recall Stavros cutting costs because his grocery stores were hurting

 

[Gabriel426]

Why would ownership take losing personally a good thing?
No owners are happy when the team loses.

All you want from an owner is to give the team every opportunity to be successful after that it’s up to management. MLSE has done that, they may spend more money than any team in the league to try and be successful.

I recall Stavros cutting costs because his grocery stores were hurting

What I am trying to say is that when it is a Corp, they might be less emotionally involve as a private owner like Cuban. Mainly bc private owner acts more as the face of the Team more than the Corp.

Not saying which one is better bc it all depends on the person in charge.

Also, if the Corp is losing money, doubt they will spend much on their Sports Franchise like Stavros.

 

[Dragao6]

I don’t necessarily care if dubas stays or goes but keefe still having a job is really concerning because I won’t take another year

 

[Gabriel426]

I don’t necessarily care if dubas stays or goes but keefe still having a job is really concerning because I won’t take another year

What’s the point of firing him when his contract is about to expire. Also it’s only been ONE day

 

[thewave]

What’s the point of firing him when his contract is about to expire. Also it’s only been ONE day

They don't need to fire but he would need to publicly step down from the position to make way for the new GM.

 

[ACC1224]

What’s the point of firing him when his contract is about to expire. Also it’s only been ONE day

Keefe has another year

 

[Gabriel426]

They don't need to fire but he would need to publicly step down from the position to make way for the new GM.

Maybe they will do that at end of season presser

 

[Gabriel426]

Keefe has another year

That’s new info, I need time to process it. I need to be Transprocess now, lol.

 

[myleafs]

I don't mean to bring up Lou...but when he let Robin Lehner go after that one good season on the Island...everyone thought he was crazy for going with Varlamov instead....goalies are not totally Voodoo if you know what you're doing.

Thats lou's superpower...has an eye for goalies

 

[rocketman588]

Here is more from James Mirtle of The Athletic:

Is there even time to clean house at the very top, with only six weeks until the draft and free agency period begins?

If not, if you’re going with Shanahan into the next phase of major decisions, then the question becomes: Do you commit to Dubas on a new long-term deal, given there are potentially other organizations interested and driving up the price?

And, even if you do want to commit, does Dubas still want to stay?

It’s not exactly the league’s best-kept secret that Shanahan and Dubas have been somewhat at odds this season, something evident in the fact they haven’t watched many games together, a change from years past.

Is that schism deep enough to mean a GM change is coming for certain? I don’t believe so, no. This isn’t going to be about personality conflicts. But it’s also clear that keeping this front office together will be far more complicated than simply coming up with a modest extension offer for the incumbent.

Dubas, those close to him say, will want to be paid handsomely, especially if there are other offers from the likes of Pittsburgh, Calgary or even division rival Ottawa. And he will want greater job security and autonomy within whatever structure Maple Leaf Sports & Entertainment settles on.

Getting the GM situation set quickly will be step one for the franchise. And it’s a huge one because all the other pieces are going to be connected to it.

Ottawa doesn't even have a GM opening.

Gotta love that his expectations are to "get paid handsomely" and have more job security and power despite having the autonomy to do whatever the f*** he's wanted for 5 years with 0 success to show for it.

Dude has some absolute slappy's in the media riding for him.

Who does he think is negotiating his contract? Himself?

He shouldn't be rewarded with an extension for signing the two dumbest contracts in the nhl and giving trade protections while doing it

 

[png57]

Not all of his moves were perfect (honestly when do you ever see a GM who is?). I liked most of his moves during his tenure and if he doesn't come back I have a feeling his successor will be some old-school middle-aged GM who pulls the trigger on trading Nylander for some so-called gritty defensemen who is above average at best. (imo Willy is the one in the core 4 who least deserves to be traded).

 

[justashadowof]

Dubas wasnt acting like someone who was gonna be fired. He was acting like someone who is passionate about the Leafs. Showed more passion than half the roster.

I suppose you could characterize aping out throwing things like a spoiled 6 year old as passion.

 

[Malachi Crunch]

Dubas is too immature for me to back him. He has an issue with male authority. He couldn't work with Babcock or Hunter, did the exact opposite of everything Lou taught him, and is now having issues with Shanahan. He also aligns himself with young players or males he has authority over (e.g. Keefe). His virtue signalling also has a rebellious streak to it. I want someone serious about hockey in charge and not constantly trying to make a point. My guess is his insistence on players not responding to physical punishment is also part of his rebellion against his perception of traditional masculinity. I'd rather have someone more emotionally mature in charge who has worked through his own biases.

 

[TonsofPuppies]

Oh, please let it be true.

 

[ToneDog]

Oh, please let it be true.

It's Howard Berger so probably click bait.

 

[ShaneFalco]

Oh, please let it be true.

A corpse told him

 

[Ianturnedbull]

Maple Leafs Fans May Finally Get Kyle Dubas' Head on a Platter - The Hockey Writers Latest News, Analysis & More

The Toronto Maple Leafs fans have wanted Kyle Dubas fired for a long time. If that happens, where might he go? Would that be positive?

thehockeywriters.com

Here is a top 10 list of criticisms that I’ve heard Dubas face:

1. Dubas has focused too much on analytics and not enough on traditional scouting methods.

2. Dubas has signed players to questionable contracts. Specifically, he’s signed stars to expensive contracts and let go of other valuable players. The result is that the roster is too top-heavy. He overpaid star players Auston Matthews, Mitch Marner, and John Tavares, which has limited the team’s ability to build a deep roster.

3. Despite changes to the team each offseason, the Maple Leafs have failed to win in the playoffs. That has led to disappointment for fans. Specifically, their defense is weak and Dubas has not done enough to address this issue.

4. The Maple Leafs’ lack of success in the playoffs is a reflection of Dubas’ inability to build a team that can win in the postseason. Specifically, his teams have failed to win a single playoff series, despite having talented players.

5. Dubas has not done enough to address the team’s lack of toughness and physicality. He avoids signing physical players, resulting in a team that is weak and soft in the playoffs.

6. The team’s salary cap situation is a mess. That’s due to Dubas’ bad decisions.

7. Dubas has not done enough to address the team’s goaltending issues. Signing Matt Murray and Ilya Samsonov was a huge mistake.

8. Dubas has made a series of bad trades. He’s brought in underperforming players and has let good ones walk for nothing.

9. Dubas hasn’t helped the organization improve its minor league system. He doesn’t show enough patience in developing young players; and, he’s traded away too many prospects and draft picks.

10. The Maple Leafs’ lack of success in recent years is a reflection of a deeper organizational issue; however, because Dubas is the general manager, it’s his fault. He has done a poor job and hasn’t taken enough accountability for his team’s failures.

With a little editing you could have widdled this list down to 3 criticisms.

Why do some things get bolded and others not?

 

[Dragao6]

Bettman should be fired also
Losing fans quick

 

[rumman]

In my opinion, here is the problem with Kyle Dubas:

1. he is too attached to players that he either personally signed or traded for

2. he doesn't seem to admit or correct his past mistakes quickly enough or in a cost-efficient manner

3. he sometimes makes the same mistakes all over again

4. he only recently decided to stray away from his own preferred team building strategy which is solely based upon speed, skill, and hockey analytics

5. for some unknown reason, he extremely loyal to former hockey players with whom he has worked with in the past as a former certified NHLPA player agent and/or former GM of the OHL’s Sault Ste. Marie Greyhounds

In my opinion, the Toronto Maple Leafs really need a new GM right now who is not bias and is willing to do whatever it takes to progress the hockey club forward in a new and much more successful direction.

Dubas’ theory that paying half your cap to 4 players leaves nothing left to improve team in other positions. This theory hasn’t worked, won’t work, and will never work, the sooner ownership jettisons Shanahan and Dubas the better Imo……..

Dubas was too late changing direction. His first 3-4 years he was stubborn the last 2 he’s woken up but it’s too late now…. Trust me he and Keefe are toast. Dubas not having a contract when the draft is less than 2 months away speaks volumes.

Never underestimate the stupidity of MLSE ownership is all I have to say about that……….

 

[hockeywiz542]

@Ianturnedbull Thanks for the advice.

I will incorporate what you said by shortening my posts in the future.

The bolded parts are the criticisms that I personally feel are the most valid and pertinent regarding Kyle Dubas.

 

[Niagara Bill]

Does any of this really matter. You could gave Scotty B in his prime and would it matter.
Hear me out.
We just watched a goal that was in be disallowed, from hockey central, manned by Americans.
We have all watched various American cities win Stanley Cups, places that don't know what a togue is.
The NHL is about $$$, and American $$$ in particular with our 75 cent dollar especially.
1993 , 2 things happened, a Canadian team won Lord Stanley's mug, Gary Bettman became president of the NHL.
Gambling has taken over. Las Vegas has a team. Carolina, Florida, Vegas, Seattle can have better teams and cities like Montreal and Toronto, hockey's ex royalty cannot get a sniff at a cup.
Canada no longer can win a cup.
LA needed help, and Gretz ends up there, with crooks running the team. Rangers are needed for tv ratings and Messier and Gretz end up there.
Chicago, a disgusting team, wins a lottery for the best player.
Would AM win a cup in a US city. Would Gudas be allowed to play like he does if he is in Montreal. Could Vancouver not allow certain people from buying tickets?
The NHL has been fixed for 30 years.

Dubas is as good a GM as anyone in hockey,
It is fruitless to make changes.