Does dubas remain GM if the leafs get bounced by Florida?

[myleafs]

The good thing about Dubas is if he figures out a guy is not part of the solution, he gets rid of him. Most GMs double down on their mistakes.

Martin, Marleau, Zaitsev, Ritchie, Mrazek.

Walking away from Campbell, Andersen, Bozak, JVR, Gardiner at the correct times.

If hes not interested in changing the core 4, ok maybe time for a change, but history suggests he's not afraid to do it.

Maybe with bit players but he has been pretty steadfast in his support for the top guys. Im not convinced he could make the hard decisions with those guys.

 

[Trapper]

You can say we are not renewing him or you can fire him so he can start looking for a new job. I pity the Pens if they fall for this snake oil salesman.

Good luck Pens, we’ve seen that movie.
I’d be interested in someone from the Canes organization as GM. Like their build.

 

[Metroid]

Marner's nmc is in 6 weeks as well.

Kyle Dubas is the worst thing to happen to Toronto in the entire history of the city.

In the world of sports , maybe, whatever if you wanna think that ... But to actually think Dubas is the worst thing to happen to the city of Toronto in general, with all the shit that's happening, dude, you have some issues you need to fix and I hope you get help.

 

[JKG33]

I hated the Mrazek signing and Murray trade the second they happened and was very vocal about it on here and with my buddies. Both played out exactly the way you would expect them to if you had any knowledge of the players. Why is that so easy for a someone who works his day job in asset management, has no professional hockey experience and is just an avid fan of the Leafs who also watches a decent amount of other NHL games. I sure as hell don't think I am some hockey "genius" but I have been right more often than Dubas over the past 5 years........and No, I not using the advantage of hindsight to base my player evaluations.

Exact same situation here. The Leafs were my childhood team, but I watch far more hockey than just them. It's been painfully obvious for those without blue and white goggles that this setup ain't it. I was one of the first in on the Matthews and Marner would rather hangout with Bieber than play hockey in May bit. I called Dubas a fraud from day 1. Yet I was ridiculed and called not a real fan because I didn't worship at the altar.

Quite possibly the funniest one for me though is Luke Schenn. I said he'd be a top 4 if not top pairing d man on this team. Yet the clowns insisted liabilities like Holl and Giordano were better, because Schenn got traded away from here 10 years ago or something. L O f***ing L

 

[myleafs]

I think he's too loyal and has more or less said he'd stake his career on them
The presser will be telling I think

According to Keefe the leafs are a team that should win the cup......weird to say shit like that after getting bounced the way they did.

 

[keonsbitterness]

Marner's nmc is in 6 weeks as well.

Kyle Dubas is the worst thing to happen to Toronto in the entire history of the city.

Entire history of the city? I can think of many far worse.

 

[Cleetus]

According to Keefe the leafs are a team that should win the cup......weird to say shit like that after getting bounced the way they did.

they were not even close lol, like how do you even come out and say that! its disturbing cant wait till the house is cleaned and we move on from this

 

[myleafs]

For 2m Holl is fine. Either Keefe felt he had no other options or overplayed him.

Out of Kapanen, Johnston, Kerfoot, Kerfoot was the only one who looks like a positive. Again, was it lack of options, or was Keefe over playing.

It all comes back to Keefe.

2021, 2022, 2023. Two years is too short. It's been 3 years, Keefe hasn't gotten us over the hump. The time to move on from Keefe is now, was premature last year imo.


It's been 5 years now so yeah. I like that he doubled down on the core. Most winning teams do that after years of failure. The time for change is now. If Dubas is not up for that, then yes we may need a new GM.


It's been 5 years now so yeah. I like that he doubled down on the core. Most winning teams do that after years of failure. The time for change is now. If Dubas is not up for that, then yes we may need a new GM.

While not a huge Keefe fan he didnt make Marner dingle dangle and cough up the puck over and over or make Matthews not score while showing the minimal amount of giving a shit or make Tavares the slowest guy on the ice...etc

 

[JKG33]

Marner's nmc is in 6 weeks as well.

Kyle Dubas is the worst thing to happen to Toronto in the entire history of the city.

While people are right to point out he's probably not the worst thing to happen to the city of Toronto, I like the cut of your jib. Keep fighting the good fight

 

[Stephen]

According to Keefe the leafs are a team that should win the cup......weird to say shit like that after getting bounced the way they did.

Looking at all the wreckage of the Shanaplan, one of the things the Leafs have done really poorly as a management team during this era is managing fan expectations. You can have a Stanley Cup goal and build a skill team that outpaces everyone else, but you don't have to talk like a front running, inevitable cup winner and beat the drum about how you'll outskill everyone.

All that dummy talk just put a target on their back and created unnecessary talking points when they could have gone about their business seriously on the ice and quietly off of it.

 

[Stephen]

While not a huge Keefe fan he didnt make Marner dingle dangle and cough up the puck over and over or make Matthews not score while showing the minimal amount of giving a shit or make Tavares the slowest guy on the ice...etc

Keefe isn't a great tactician but you're right that the failure was on the ice by his players in the big moment. Where Keefe fails is his unnecessary tinkering. Like creative solutions for problems that don't exist, while he can't fix basic problems in a targeted way.

We also have to question what kind of motivational guy he is because this team has been so anxious for years.

 

[JKG33]

Looking at all the wreckage of the Shanaplan, one of the things the Leafs have done really poorly as a management team during this era is managing fan expectations. You can have a Stanley Cup goal and build a skill team that outpaces everyone else, but you don't have to talk like a front running, inevitable cup winner and beat the drum about how you'll outskill everyone.

All that dummy talk just put a target on their back and created unnecessary talking points when they could have gone about their business seriously on the ice and quietly off of it.

That's another great point. Kyle Dubas has shown with comments like "we can and we will" and his temper tantrum in Tampa, that he loves the media spot light. He's been unprofessional since day 1, and has made if super easy for the Leafs to be the butt of jokes from 31 other fanbases.

 

[myleafs]

Yes. You'd need a crystal ball to know this collection of players wouldn't work together when drafted and signed . He's not responsible for their in-ability to deliver in big moments. You didn't see people call this out against Washington or Boston the first time etc

He's more than made up for that in his quality in drafting and roster acquisition [Bunting for free, Samsonov for free, Gio on 900k deal, McCabe for 2M in cap for the next two years etc.

Ok Dubas's grandma

 

[JKG33]

Keefe isn't a great tactician but you're right that the failure was on the ice by his players in the big moment. Where Keefe fails is his unnecessary tinkering. Like creative solutions for problems that don't exist, while he can't fix basic problems in a targeted way.

We also have to question what kind of motivational guy he is because this team has been so anxious for years.

Does Keefe really seem like a leader of men? Look at some of the great coaches thatve seen success. Brind'amour, Cooper, Gallant, Johnston, Berube, Sutter. Players should be ready to run through a wall for their coach, and also be somewhat scared shitless of him. Keefe brings neither to the table

 

[myleafs]

This is the most successful Leafs team in the last twenty years. He can take some criticism for sure, but there's a reason that he would be in another GM job within weeks in the NHL. He's a great asset to have managing this team.

A couple things...success during regular season..yes...playoffs...meh. Also it was a successful regular season team when he took over. Its not like he took over a bottom feeder.

 

[Larcos_Unal]

Oh god I can't wait until the post-season press conference, this will be prime time entertainment

 

[myleafs]

I think the whole organization reeks of "Niceness"....they want to win with mostly skill and added grit in the bottom 6...the problem is at the top of the lineup when they get bullied around and Management is so proud that we don't retaliate in scrums. It was obvious that FLA and TB knew that they could intimidate them with rough play and they did.

I am not saying fighting should be at the top of the list...but having some real pricks out there that are able to have mean streaks is extremely important. It just looks like they don't care because they are not able to play the style that needs to be played. The only 2 guys that were not afraid were Mo and Willy...

It was pretty clear early on with Dubas that his teams were not going to stick up for each other or partake in the extra stuff. Foligno being told by keefe not to engage when he wanted to stick up for a teammate said everything I needed to see.

 

[Stephen]

That's another great point. Kyle Dubas has shown with comments like "we can and we will" and his temper tantrum in Tampa, that he loves the media spot light. He's been unprofessional since day 1, and has made if super easy for the Leafs to be the butt of jokes from 31 other fanbases.

The GM and core players all share that young guy entitlement where they think their own greatness is inevitable and they're so impatient to have it like it's a coronation. When things go wrong they have no answer and it creates a negative spiral. Other players and teams love to play the spoiler and stick it to these guys.

 

[sunstersun]

Is it really worth having a debate about a GM's job when this franchise has won 1 series in 7 years?

In any other profession/team, this wouldn't be a debate.

 

[Lemontree]

Exact same situation here. The Leafs were my childhood team, but I watch far more hockey than just them. It's been painfully obvious for those without blue and white goggles that this setup ain't it. I was one of the first in on the Matthews and Marner would rather hangout with Bieber than play hockey in May bit. I called Dubas a fraud from day 1. Yet I was ridiculed and called not a real fan because I didn't worship at the altar.

Quite possibly the funniest one for me though is Luke Schenn. I said he'd be a top 4 if not top pairing d man on this team. Yet the clowns insisted liabilities like Holl and Giordano were better, because Schenn got traded away from here 10 years ago or something. L O f***ing L

Its very frustrating. Fully agree on Luke Schenn, I have always liked Schenn once you get past where he was drafted. Did he turn into what you would hope a 5th overall pick would be? No but he has had a very good career and is a very useful Dman.

Full disclosure, I never dreamed Schenn would have fit and played as well as he did with Reilly these playoffs when I have been wanting Schenn back for a few years, I was just viewing him as an excellent 3rd pairing option who hits like a truck and makes people pay the price to hang around the front of his net.

Its the Luke Schenn and Zach Bogosion of the NHL world that makes me hate everything about Justin Holl as a player. Those guys are what 3rd pairing Dman are if you are trying to win, if you are a Dman that doesn't create offense or transport the puck out of your zone, those are the "other" Dman I want on my team. I have 2 types of Dman that I would look for, transition the puck and help generate offense or be a nasty SOB to play against. Continue to draft and try to develop the rare unicorns that do both of these.

 

[GoLeafsGo96]

Dubas will get an offer to come back, and he'll turn it down and go take the keys to the castle somewhere else for a bigger contract and autonomy.

MLSE will offer him 2-3 years, Pittsburgh/other will offer 5+. MLSE played with fire not extending him earlier and is about to get burned IMO.

Just pray it doesn't cost the team AM34 in the process given how tight they are.

 

[disgruntleddave]

I think dubas is a good gm with one huge flaw. Loyalty. Loyalty to his guys. Keefe, his big name players.

Lose the Loyalty. Grow some cojones. If he's on board to fire keefe and trade big names in a retool, do it. If not, buh bye and let's tear it all down and rebuild. Except we don't have our 1st picks, so might as well retool.

 

[JKG33]

The GM and core players all share that young guy entitlement where they think their own greatness is inevitable and they're so impatient to have it like it's a coronation. When things go wrong they have no answer and it creates a negative spiral. Other players and teams love to play the spoiler and stick it to these guys.

Exactly. That entitlement, from Dubas to Keefe to the players is why this team is so embarrassing to be a fan of. Even in the Burke era I could wear a Leafs jersey with pride knowing they worked hard even if they sucked. But now? This group is pathetic. All that talent wasted

 

[Stephen]

Does Keefe really seem like a leader of men? Look at some of the great coaches thatve seen success. Brind'amour, Cooper, Gallant, Johnston, Berube, Sutter. Players should be ready to run through a wall for their coach, and also be somewhat scared shitless of him. Keefe brings neither to the table

Nope, he's kind of a goober.

Its very frustrating. Fully agree on Luke Schenn, I have always liked Schenn once you get past where he was drafted. Did he turn into what you would hope a 5th overall pick would be? No but he has had a very good career and is a very useful Dman.

Full disclosure, I never dreamed Schenn would have fit and played as well as he did with Reilly these playoffs when I have been wanting Schenn back for a few years, I was just viewing him as an excellent 3rd pairing option who hits like a truck and makes people pay the price to hang around the front of his net.

Its the Luke Schenn and Zach Bogosion of the NHL world that makes me hate everything about Justin Holl as a player. Those guys are what 3rd pairing Dman are if you are trying to win, if you are a Dman that doesn't create offense or transport the puck out of your zone, those are the "other" Dman I want on my team. I have 2 types of Dman that I would look for, transition the puck and help generate offense or be a nasty SOB to play against. Continue to draft and try to develop the rare unicorns that do both of these.

Such a paradox. They rely on Justin Holl so much solely because of his body type. But they don't value that body type very much when drafting defensemen.

 

[myleafs]

Oh god I can't wait until the post-season press conference, this will be prime time entertainment

Im prepared to be disappointed and disgusted