Does dubas remain GM if the leafs get bounced by Florida?

[rocketman588]

He wasted 5 years with an elite core. He did not bet on duds. If that is enough to satisfy you, God bless.

JT has been a pretty big dud to be fair

 

[ToneDog]

JT has been a pretty big dud to be fair

To be fair, pretty much everybody knew he would tail off nearing the end of the contract. The thinking was they would have won a cup or two before he fell off the cliff.

 

[capfit9]

There seems to be a lot of rumblings slowly trickling out that there is some back stabbing among management group. Heard/inferred it from a couple of media members/outlets. Anybody have any insight as to what it is and who is involved other than Dubas.

 

[keonsbitterness]

For Dubas, it almost feels like the goal was to win with this core, rather than win period.

In his defense, it would have been hard for any GM not bet on all that physical talent maturing into a Cup-winner or at the very least some deep playoff runs.

 

[JKG33]

My guess is the conflict started like this:

Shanahan: Build a winner
Dubas: My spreadsheet says I already did

And then Shanahan started forcing his hand during deadline week with the ROR, Schenn, McCabe trades. Dubas got upset and that's where the Pittsburgh smoke is coming from

 

[BallardEra]

There seems to be a lot of rumblings slowly trickling out that there is some back stabbing among management group. Heard/inferred it from a couple of media members/outlets. Anybody have any insight as to what it is and who is involved other than Dubas.

Funny. I am not one to talk but what I've heard from an agent is that Shanahan and Dubas have been telling Keefe who to play. As in they are influencing who should be playing and telling Keefe to do so.

Just saying what I've heard. This does not mean it is true. There are agendas out there so don't burn me at the stake.

That's what I've heard.

 

[LeafSteel]

So to sum up:

- Owners who are competitors everywhere else in their business dealings and hold MLSE as part of their portfolio.
- a minority owner in Tannenbaum, who, well, you know….
- a President, a GM, and a coach with no experience going into their current roles.
- a core of gifted players who have gotten paid top dollar while delivering nothing, while seeing (soon to be) 2 coaches out the door, while escaping any accountability for their play.

Where this potential for disharmony would come from is utterly madness and unlikely.

We have all the makings of a highly efficient and cohesive unit, from the top down as our operating model so this must all be a bunch of pish-posh…..

 

[LeafSteel]

My guess is the conflict started like this:

Shanahan: Build a winner
Dubas: My spreadsheet says I already did

And then Shanahan started forcing his hand during deadline week with the ROR, Schenn, McCabe trades. Dubas got upset and that's where the Pittsburgh smoke is coming from

If Dubas didn’t know to make those trades himself based on all our failures under his leadership, then he needs to move on as he clearly hasn’t learned what a winning team in the NHL looks like.

I gave him full marks on his TDL additions, and the belief he was evolving and growing. If Shanahan had to coerce Dubas to make them, and Dubas is all butt hurt about it, then Dubas clearly needs to move on.

Having said that, unless proven otherwise, I will operate on the premise that Dubas made those trades himself, and had input from Spezza and Shanahan, like all other organizations operate….

 

[Amadeus]

Honestly, I wasn't very sold on the Lafferty and McCabe one. Just didn't think McCabe should have been a guy we target considering his lack of PO experience. He's also over eager in pinching always which you cant do in the playoffs.

Could we see the Hunters come back and take over?

Mark as GM, Dale as HC?

 

[PromisedLand]

There seems to be a lot of rumblings slowly trickling out that there is some back stabbing among management group. Heard/inferred it from a couple of media members/outlets. Anybody have any insight as to what it is and who is involved other than Dubas.

Tasty!

Would be interested to know if true.

I have absolutely zero doubt in my mind that Dubas sabotaged babcock on purpose and ruined at least a couple years where we could have had some decent success. I don't care what anyone says I fully believe this. People can call me crazy or tinfoil hat guy or whatever. dubas' actions and the character assassination of babcock after he was let go was enough to convince me that dubas did all of it on purpose.

Funny. I am not one to talk but what I've heard from an agent is that Shanahan and Dubas have been telling Keefe who to play. As in they are influencing who should be playing and telling Keefe to do so.

Just saying what I've heard. This does not mean it is true. There are agendas out there so don't burn me at the stake.

That's what I've heard.

WOW you know what I wouldn't be surprised if true. Half the shit Keefe does doesn't make sense anyway... so no wonder dubas is behind it

 

[Menzinger]

I would be very surprised if Dubas is not back. There just isn’t enough time for what is coming.
It’s May now, on July 1st Matthews/Marner will join JT with a NMC. Nylander has a limited NTC kicking in.
There just isn’t enough time for someone new to come in, evaluate, decide on the core, go to the draft, etc etc

They wouldn't have made the type of moves at the TDL (ie trading 1sts and Sandin) that they did if Dubas almost certainly wasn't coming back.

We've seen real lame duck GM's in the past have their moves essentially neutered completely by ownership or team presidents when it was clear they weren't coming back (ie remember Nonis wasn't allowed to staple two pieces of paper together without Shanny's approval back in 2014). This wasn't the case with Dubas.

Few folks around here are just going to have to brace themselves for the inevitability

 

[On-the-Fly]

There seems to be a lot of rumblings slowly trickling out that there is some back stabbing among management group. Heard/inferred it from a couple of media members/outlets. Anybody have any insight as to what it is and who is involved other than Dubas.

Seravelli was talking about this a couple weeks ago. Apparently on daily faceoff. I heard a radio hit. He mentioned differing opinions on direction between Dubas and Shanny, and that Dubas doesn't have full autonomy. Not much in the way of details unfortunately. Interesting nonetheless.

 

[Bluebear]

Tasty!

Would be interested to know if true.

I have absolutely zero doubt in my mind that Dubas sabotaged babcock on purpose and ruined at least a couple years where we could have had some decent success. I don't care what anyone says I fully believe this. People can call me crazy or tinfoil hat guy or whatever. dubas' actions and the character assassination of babcock after he was let go was enough to convince me that dubas did all of it on purpose.

I wouldn't be surprised if you're right. For all the hate Babcock took at the time, looking back you can see that while he was here the team had a ton of players come up from minors or established guys like Kadri, that had a lot of success. Since Keefe most of the new ads have been players established elsewhere. Could just be the guys he had available to work with but, I think Babcock deserves more credit than he got at time of departure.

 

[Trapper]

They wouldn't have made the type of moves at the TDL (ie trading 1sts and Sandin) that they did if Dubas almost certainly wasn't coming back.

We've seen real lame duck GM's in the past have their moves essentially neutered completely by ownership or team presidents when it was clear they weren't coming back (ie remember Nonis wasn't allowed to staple two pieces of paper together without Shanny's approval back in 2014). This wasn't the case with Dubas.

Few folks around here are just going to have to brace themselves for the inevitability

Dubas will probably return, Keefe might be replaced.
As for doing this all over again, sorry everyone but this core is probably here for 2 more tries at least.
Until everyone is UFA (either re-signed or walk) and JT no longer makes 11 million.
It’s either a good 2 years with success or it could be the point of no return. We could be starting all over again in some ways.

 

[therealkoho]

There seems to be a lot of rumblings slowly trickling out that there is some back stabbing among management group. Heard/inferred it from a couple of media members/outlets. Anybody have any insight as to what it is and who is involved other than Dubas.

I wouldn't doubt that it's more happening in the dressing room than in the exec offices, don't know no inside info, just what I see going on on the bench.

 

[Buds17]

They wouldn't have made the type of moves at the TDL (ie trading 1sts and Sandin) that they did if Dubas almost certainly wasn't coming back.

We've seen real lame duck GM's in the past have their moves essentially neutered completely by ownership or team presidents when it was clear they weren't coming back (ie remember Nonis wasn't allowed to staple two pieces of paper together without Shanny's approval back in 2014). This wasn't the case with Dubas.

Few folks around here are just going to have to brace themselves for the inevitability

I hope the trade deadline activity wasn't absolute proof of Dubas returning since any GM should have (reasonable) authority to do as he wishes while in that position of power. Beyond that, and barring him asking for the moon and stars in contract negotiations, I can envision the first round win as being enough to seal his return as GM.

 

[therealkoho]

As far as Dubas goes, even if the Bud's do that thing where they get the boat away from the rocks and back into deep water and win 4 straight, Kyle's tenure is over.

In fact I'd go as far to say that the new GM has already met the board along with his coach.

 

[1specter]

Honestly, I wasn't very sold on the Lafferty and McCabe one. Just didn't think McCabe should have been a guy we target considering his lack of PO experience. He's also over eager in pinching always which you cant do in the playoffs.

Could we see the Hunters come back and take over?

Mark as GM, Dale as HC?

Please no. Mark is the reason we have no good prospects and players from 2015-2017. 27 draft picks in those 3 years, and all we have are Matthews, Marner, Liljegren who were drafted 1st, 4th and 17th (Hard to give much credit for those), and Joe Woll. Everyone else pretty much busted.

We should've had a pipeline of players to come in and support the existing core like what Chicago and Tampa had built

 

[SprDaVE]

Honestly, I wasn't very sold on the Lafferty and McCabe one. Just didn't think McCabe should have been a guy we target considering his lack of PO experience. He's also over eager in pinching always which you cant do in the playoffs.

Could we see the Hunters come back and take over?

Mark as GM, Dale as HC?

Lack of experience noted, you think Hunters and their lack of NHL experience would do better?

 

[Racer88]

Please no. Mark is the reason we have no good prospects and players from 2015-2017. 27 draft picks in those 3 years, and all we have are Matthews, Marner, Liljegren who were drafted 1st, 4th and 17th (Hard to give much credit for those), and Joe Woll. Everyone else pretty much busted.

We should've had a pipeline of players to come in and support the existing core like what Chicago and Tampa had built

The reason we don’t have any prospect’s available is because Dubas traded away to many draft picks

Lack of experience noted, you think Hunters and their lack of NHL experience would do better?

My London knights are heading to the finals and if they win that they are going to the memorial cup.
Every player works hard every shift every game…………..unlike Dubas and Keefes Leafs

They also play with more structure and poise then the Leafs

 

[1specter]

The reason we don’t have any prospect’s available is because Dubas traded away to many draft picks


My London knights are heading to the finals and if they win that they are going to the memorial cup.
Every player works hard every shift every game…………..unlike Dubas and Keefes Leafs

They also play with more structure and poise then the Leafs

Mark Hunter sucked here, end of story. He can't do under the table deals like he does in the OHL.

 

[Racer88]

Mark Hunter sucked here, end of story. He can't do under the table deals like he does in the OHL.

I have no idea what you are talking about. LOL

 

[centipede2233]

Here’s a bit of food for thought, the last 3 coaches who got sept in the 2nd rd, Florida last year, Winnipeg the year before with Maurice, and the NYI in 2019 trotz, 2 of them were fired and Maurice quite, chances are keefe doesn’t escape with his job if the leafs get swept. And the extension was laughable as dubas was rewarding his buddy on nepotism, not merit.

 

[HolyCrap]

If Dubas leaves there will be a handful of posters that are gonna leave this forum with him. Another bonus with him gone.

 

[Mr Knies Guy]

Here’s a bit of food for thought, the last 3 coaches who got sept in the 2nd rd, Florida last year, Winnipeg the year before with Maurice, and the NYI in 2019 trotz, 2 of them were fired and Maurice quite, chances are keefe doesn’t escape with his job if the leafs get swept. And the extension was laughable as dubas was rewarding his buddy on nepotism, not merit.

Problem with that theory is we're owned by suit monkeys and the team is run like a Fortune 500 company where decisions are made in boardrooms with multiple voters. Teams like the Rags, Bruins, Florida are sole-owned or have a couple owners which allows for easy autonomy and quick exits of those not pulling their weight. We're led by a couple of useless POS conglomerates and for them to let someone go, it's almost as if they need HR approval first