Player Discussion: Dmitri Voronkov

[Marioesque]

I’m aware that many posters have fixed opinions about Laine. Nonetheless, I stand behind my interpretation of the post in question.

Definitely to each their own, I've learned to "treat him as a hostile witness" if you know what I mean

 

[Double-Shift Lasse]

Definitely to each their own, I've learned to "treat him as a hostile witness" if you know what I mean

You might notice that my statement about people having fixed opinions about Laine did not differentiate between supporters and detractors.

Anyways, this is the Dmitri Voronkov thread so enough about that other guy who probably has his own dedicated thread.

 

[thebus88]

He's made the same argument before in a different clip with Laine not following a forward behind the net while playing as a winger, so seeing it again in this context I'm pretty sure I got his original intentions correct. He's saying Laine as a winger should ignore his required positioning and run around reacting to who ever has the puck.

This play does have some similarities to the Tage Thompson/blown coverage from Laine goal shown recently. Yes, Voronkov is showing what you should do (and what Laine didn’t even attempt) in this situation, play defense, being the guy able to make the play, stop the dangerous play, it’s that simple. Why are you saying “following a guy behind the net”, to downplay good reads, effort, and a defensive play made in order stop a goal??

Your ideas of what a players “positioning” or “responsibilities” should be in the defensive zone are INACCURATE. Especially in modern day, the players must play as a 5 man unit. Offensively and defensively.

It must be noted, that while Voronkov may be playing center in this sequence, it all starts from an opposing defender breaking up a play along the boards on Voronkov -in a stereotypical WINGER area- and he almost immediately recognizes the opposing forward coming in who he eventually stops/disrupts an extreme scoring chance on.

Not only that, but, where are ALL the Ak Bars players when Voronkov breaks up that play and they start to break out of the zone? I’ll answer, since it will be ignored, they are ALL below the hashmarks, just feet from the crease. Why is nobody out covering the points/defenseman, like some here believe the wingers “defensive responsibility” is?? I’ll answer again, because they are not a threat in ANY way, as they weren’t in that old Thompson goal. Standing flat footed somewhat near people is not adequate defense.

Laine has played 2 games as C, if there's a clip from those 2 games showing how he's neglecting his C coverage then that's a different story, then we could blame him for it. I don't remember there being one though. Just saying that "he's not going to do this as C" is not a solid argument, it's a baseless claim.

Any clip I have shown or could possibly show will be excused or dismissed for some reason or another.

 

[Marioesque]

You might notice that my statement about people having fixed opinions about Laine did not differentiate between supporters and detractors.

This play does have some similarities to the Tage Thompson/blown coverage from Laine goal shown recently. Yes, Voronkov is showing what you should do (and what Laine didn’t even attempt) in this situation, play defense, being the guy able to make the play, stop the dangerous play, it’s that simple. Why are you saying “following a guy behind the net”, to downplay good reads, effort, and a defensive play made in order stop a goal??

I understand that you think this way, but coaches do not. Yes you need to be able to read plays and cover for each others position at times, but mainly players have a fixed role and only if they're out of position should someone else cover it. If a winger follows a forward into the corner while his own position coverage is exposed, he's doing something wrong. A center can certainly follow a forward there. A winger should not.

You just wanted to blame Laine for something that to you LOOKS LIKE he should have done differently but he shouldn't have. The goal you speak of wasn't at all on Laine, but you just keep claiming it was because he didn't do what your expectation is. You don't pay him, you don't get to dictate what he should do in those situations. He's playing his role in the system as expected by his employer, as much as you'd want a different kind of defensive coverage from the unit. You're not going to last in the NHL if you can't cover your assignment, and running around reacting to the puck carrier isn't what's expected from them. That's just you.

 

[Monstershockey]

Yeah, I don't have a problem asking for a C to go there in that situation, but he also named a winger (or two). His critique might be valid for actual centers (I'm sure we can find footage of Kuraly following a forward behind the net so I don't know how accurate this whole claim is). The whole point was, he's using correct positioning as a detriment when it comes to Laine. He's saying Laine should do a C coverage when playing RW. That's just not sustainable for an NHL player.

I don't see where he said Laine should do centers work as a winger. He was including him with centers because some are thinking he should be a center. I prefer him on the wing, but I also want to go with whatever helps them win. If he earns his way into a center and we win with him there, great.

 

[Double-Shift Lasse]

Whether Laine ends up at wing or center will be an interesting thing to follow during camp, just as will the exploits of Dmitri Voronkov, a young Russian player making his way to NA for the fist time, and about whom this thread is about.

 

[Doggy]

Reading this debate about Laine...in the Vornokov thread has my head spinning...camp can't get here soon enough.

 

[CBJWerenski8]

Reading this debate about Laine...in the Vornokov thread has my head spinning...camp can't get here soon enough.

You don’t like the top 3 threads having the same debate?

 

[cslebn]

I’m somebody who has questioned how Voronkov’s skating and how quickly he sees or reads the game will impact what position and and how high in the lineup he will play.

Checking some videos and came along this 1 and it gives me hope as it shows quite a bit from Voronkov.



WHY did that goal happen??

Hint, nothing in the offensive zone. Perfect example of something the “advanced statistics” can’t show and a perfect example of something most of the current CBJ forwards or even “centers”, Kuraly/Sillinger/Roslovic/Laine can’t or dont do adequately.

I like Voronkov's effort and box out but as the play goes back up ice, man those first steps are rough. I think wiring about his skating is still a thing.

 

[VT]

IMO Voronkov should not play in bottom 6, but TOP 6, as he plays very well with skill, high hockey IQ players either a winger or center. If he starts in the NHL... Marchenko said he couldn't play big minutes, longer shifts because he had to get used to tempo that at the beginning of the season. But Voronkov played in the KHL, and was one of Ak Bars key players, especially in the PO, something that can't be said about Marchenko since he played in the VHL (Gusev took his place). That's why I think he could make the opening lineup. But there is the problem of too many players. Therefore, I wouldn't be surprised if him, Chinakhov and Sillinger were assigned to Cleveland to the nearest trades.

 

[thebus88]

I like Voronkov's effort and box out but as the play goes back up ice, man those first steps are rough. I think wiring about his skating is still a thing.

I mean, he’s never gonna be super agile or have great acceleration due to his size and build, but, looking at the most current videos, his skating seems to have improved GREATLY in a couple years. Looking at video from a couple years back is rough and where most of my opinions on his skating come from, yet now he actually looks to get up and down the ice fine IMO.

To add, it seems like his instincts and “awareness” is above average and there’s not too much coasting from what I can see. I think his eyes reading plays beforehand can make up for that slower 1st step. But, again, the KHL is not the NHL, so we’ll see, but, I’m a bit more excited from watching some newer video.

He almost looks like a tri-brid of 3 of my favorite recent CBJ players in Anisimov-Dubinsky-Jenner, all guys that were never great skaters, but, (when healthy) always managed to make it to where they needed to be on the ice.

 

[tunnelvision]

Mike Babcock Q&A: Many uncertainties, but optimism prevails with Blue Jackets

Babcock knows there are a lot of unanswered questions but said, "Here’s what I can promise you: we’re coming to work."

theathletic.com

The depth chart at center has changed dramatically this summer with the drafting of Adam Fantilli and the arrival of Dmitry Voronkov from Russia. You know have six or seven candidates to play in the middle. Who is most likely to shift to the wing?

Great, great question. My answer is, I don’t know. I would like two guys on every line who can play down low in their zone, the 200-footers. That’s something Pavel Datsyuk always said. ‘Mike, how can I be with the puck below the goal line and be the first guy back (defensively)? The math doesn’t add up.’ That’s a good rule. We’re going to see who’s best in the faceoff circle, who’s best on the ice. We’re going to have groups together that work. They can decide who is the center on the line. If you’re down first, play down (in the zone). You know what I mean?

Same question for Dmitry Voronkov … do you know what you can expect from him?

Haven’t seen him yet, but (laughing) we had a heck of FaceTime the other day. He started with his interpreter and that didn’t last very long. So I got my friend Sam from Detroit on the phone and he was a real help. Sam got us organized. He’s had some immigration problems, but I think he’s showing up right away here. Saying that, I don’t know what to expect. But anybody who’s that big, that talented, scores goals in the KHL and played in the Olympics … obviously he’s a piece. Now, is that piece Day 1? Is it 40 games in? Twenty? I don’t know the answer. Is he a wing or a center? Don’t know. The biggest thing is, when you haven’t been over here and you don’t understand one word, that takes even longer for you. The other guys are learning a lot, too, but it’s like overload for him.

 

[majormajor]

Mike Babcock Q&A: Many uncertainties, but optimism prevails with Blue Jackets

Babcock knows there are a lot of unanswered questions but said, "Here’s what I can promise you: we’re coming to work."

theathletic.com

It seems like the language barrier might delay Voronkov making the NHL. That would be disappointing but understandable.

Russia isn't Europe (culturally).

 

[CBJx614]

It seems like the language barrier might delay Voronkov making the NHL. That would be disappointing but understandable.

Russia isn't Europe (culturally).

Maybe, I feel like Marchenko didn't know much either when he came over. Hockey is pretty universal so if he can pickup what's going on I think he'll be fine. Especially during camp and having guys like Marchy and Chinny to help translate what's expected and the drills to him. But then he's possibly limited by their understanding of the system and their ability to translate that to him.

 

[majormajor]

Maybe, I feel like Marchenko didn't know much either when he came over. Hockey is pretty universal so if he can pickup what's going on I think he'll be fine. Especially during camp and having guys like Marchy and Chinny to help translate what's expected and the drills to him. But then he's possibly limited by their understanding of the system and their ability to translate that to him.

That's true, they often start on the team not being able to speak English. But the competition is stiffer this year. I was thinking Voronkov would make the starting roster but now it seems they might give him a month or two in Cleveland.

 

[CBJx614]

That's true, they often start on the team not being able to speak English. But the competition is stiffer this year. I was thinking Voronkov would make the starting roster but now it seems they might give him a month or two in Cleveland.

It's not a terrible idea if he doesn't absolutely force his way onto the roster either. IIRC Marchenko looked pretty good at camp last season and they still sent him down to start or maybe he was hurt? I do remember either Larsen or Jarmo saying they kept wanting to call him up but he would get hurt or sick every time they were about to call him up.

 

[tunnelvision]

Maybe, I feel like Marchenko didn't know much either when he came over. Hockey is pretty universal so if he can pickup what's going on I think he'll be fine. Especially during camp and having guys like Marchy and Chinny to help translate what's expected and the drills to him. But then he's possibly limited by their understanding of the system and their ability to translate that to him.

If Voronkov isn't ready to start in the NHL right away, it could be beneficial for him to play in Cleveland under a similar system that CBJ will have with Babcock, before he gets his first call up. IIRC, last year Vogelhuber said they tried to adopt Larsen's playbook in Cleveland so probably safe to assume they will try again to copy whatever system CBJ will be running this year.

 

[squashmaple]

The only thing that gives me pause on sending him to Cleveland to start for transitioning to North America is that there won't be any Russians there while Columbus will have four native speakers plus Elvis, who is half Russian iirc and speaks it fluently. He's also the only Russian going to Traverse City. It's going to be hard for him, and I hope the team is prepared to support him.

 

[CBJWerenski8]

Real question. Is it Dmitri or Dmitry? I’ve seen it spelled both ways

The only thing that gives me pause on sending him to Cleveland to start for transitioning to North America is that there won't be any Russians there while Columbus will have four native speakers plus Elvis, who is half Russian iirc and speaks it fluently. He's also the only Russian going to Traverse City. It's going to be hard for him, and I hope the team is prepared to support him.

Chinakhov could be there.

 

[Double-Shift Lasse]

Real question. Is it Dmitri or Dmitry? I’ve seen it spelled both ways

My guess - and I’m willing to admit it’s wrong if that’s how it goes - is that both and neither are exactly right, because of not only the difference in language but also alphabet.

Probably the answer is whichever he prefers but if his English skills aren’t that good he probably doesn’t even know or care yet.

 

[VT]

Real question. Is it Dmitri or Dmitry? I’ve seen it spelled both ways


Chinakhov could be there.

Dmitriy because Russian is Дмитрий. Similar like Bobrovsky is right Bobrovskiy. Only Vasilevskiy has right his surname on his jersey.

 

[VT]

It seems like the language barrier might delay Voronkov making the NHL. That would be disappointing but understandable.

Russia isn't Europe (culturally).

Russia cannot be known by the mind
Nor measured by the common mile:
Her status is unique, without kind –
Russia can only be believed in.

Fyodor Tyutchev (1866)

 

[TaketheCannoli]

Whether Laine ends up at wing or center will be an interesting thing to follow during camp, just as will the exploits of Dmitri Voronkov, a young Russian player making his way to NA for the fist time, and about whom this thread is about.

So DSL, I haven't followed Voronkov very closely. What do you think are his strengths and weaknesses?
What are your expectations of him this upcoming season and 3-5 years out?

Are we finally building a roster that's solid up the middle?

Thank you for your patience with me on these questions.

 

[WannabeFinn]

I’m a Voronkov fan but I can’t see him making the team out of camp. Not with the roster as it’s currently constructed. Perhaps if we trade Roslovic. Until then? Not sold given the limited roster space.

 

[Xoggz22]

So DSL, I haven't followed Voronkov very closely. What do you think are his strengths and weaknesses?
What are your expectations of him this upcoming season and 3-5 years out?

Are we finally building a roster that's solid up the middle?

Thank you for your patience with me on these questions.

I'm not DSL but I've tried to follow him the last couple years. I'll also qualify this by saying I am not a scout, nor expert on the finer points of skating

His size and ability to go to the corners and play in front of the net are very much needed by Columbus and a big strength for him. If you recall Alexander Svitov, he's very similar in game play in my opinion but I think he's shown a little more skill. His skating was a concern but it looked a little better this past year. I still have concern in the NHL with the fast pace of play but think he's smart enough (not high IQ but he knows where to go and he can get there, just clunky - again, my opinion). He's shown the ability to score in a tough scoring league and will be a great presence on the ice to support his teammates.

I'm probably higher on him than many but I think his game will translate well but I don't think he has top 6 scoring upside. Hard to tell at this point. I think his skating still needs to improve and he'll need to adjust to the system and new players so I expect a slow start but by mid year I would not be surprised if he's noticeable (in a good way) and keeps a permanent job.