Devils team discussion (news, notes and speculation) - offseason part III

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My3Sons

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yes he is.....


the dallas goal.


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When he asserts himself offensively he is quite effective. The problem is it takes a very high effort on his part. He can’t push that hard all game every game. He’s capable of offense but it’s not easy for him like it is for some other guys. Some of it is the burden they place on him because of lack of any other center to play reliable defensively against the other team’s best players (hopefully becomes so good offensively they can just play him all the time in the toughest situations). Still he will have to play with the greater intensity he showed in thr secjbd half of the season and stay healthy to improve his scoring.
 

NjDevsRR

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Is that a reasonable comparison? Blake was a two way player that provided strong defensive and PK value. I would expect Zetterlund to be a bottom 6 scoring winger that gets PP2 time.

I don't see a strong comparison.
In my eyes, yes. In the eyes of the majority, probably not. I’m extremely high on him and can see him carving out a top 6 role one day.
 

Eggtimer

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In my eyes, yes. In the eyes of the majority, probably not. I’m extremely high on him and can see him carving out a top 6 role one day.
I’m cheering for Zetterlund as well. I like his game so far. I know very little about him. What was he before he got drafted and projected to be? Was he a dominant scorer or someone who could score somewhat plus play with an edge or someone who figured it our somewhat at a later age and is now showing ore offensive talent ?
 
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theoptimist

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When he asserts himself offensively he is quite effective. The problem is it takes a very high effort on his part. He can’t push that hard all game every game. He’s capable of offense but it’s not easy for him like it is for some other guys. Some of it is the burden they place on him because of lack of any other center to play reliable defensively against the other team’s best players (hopefully becomes so good offensively they can just play him all the time in the toughest situations). Still he will have to play with the greater intensity he showed in thr secjbd half of the season and stay healthy to improve his scoring.

Very glad Haula was brought in. Can really be a significant 2/3C pickup.
 
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Guadana

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I’m cheering for Zetterlund as well. I like his game so far. I know very little about him. What was he before he got drafted and projected to be? Was he a dominant scorer or someone who could score somewhat plus play with an edge or someone who figured it our somewhat at a later age and is now showing ore offensive talent ?
I watched him in limited games. And guy shoot a lot and his shot was good. With meh skating, without good speed, one way player. He wasn't good without the puck.
After injury he looked like a player who has big weight but doesn't use it. Last year he started to create chances and blocking opponents to create space, he added speed. And its very likable, if you remember how long he spent to recover. Guy love the game and play with passion. I hope he will come through the path of Yegor from "who is this guy? We don't care" to "who is this guy? We want him more on the ice!".
And im little nervous about him, because of waivers. I don't want to save one year of Tatar or Johnsson, even if someone or both will start hot or even continue to be hot full year, for losing Zetterlund.
 

britdevil

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Honestly, rugby is more akin to pre-forward pass hockey than American football. Maybe today more analogous to Euro-style football (soccer).

Rugby is a style of football born out of Medieval England.

Rugby Football and Association Football (Soccer being a slang term for football; ASSOCIATION///SOCCER, usually used by posh people in the early 20th century). I'm fairly certain that the Rugby crowd split apart from the football association in the mid 19th century as they couldn't agree on what was the better version of football.

To the working class of Britain, it's always been football and never soccer.
 
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Nocashstyle

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RangerDoggo

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I'd certainly put us above Detroit and Buffalo, but that might just be me being a homer.

Anyways, as mentioned above, the fact that Pronman has Foote at 6, Gritsyuk at 10, and Okhotiuk nowhere to be found goes to show how silly some of these things are.
I can see why Buffalo is higher, they have a wealth of young guys with good upside.

But yes, as someone in the comments said, putting Foote over Gritsyuk was "a choice."
 

Triumph

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I'd certainly put us above Detroit and Buffalo, but that might just be me being a homer.

Anyways, as mentioned above, the fact that Pronman has Foote at 6, Gritsyuk at 10, and Okhotiuk nowhere to be found goes to show how silly some of these things are.

Pronman certainly doesn't have time or brainspace to watch 1000 prospects a year and legitimately have a takeaway about their game. His writeup on Okhotiuk is exactly right, though, and Gritsyuk is overrated here (though he is a better prospect than Foote).
 

Devils731

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Gritsyuk wasn’t even on the list last year so he did have a nice increase on the list.

TBH, for someone trying to cover all the prospects in hockey I kind of understand being slow to adjust to the value of a 5th round pick that has been playing in the KHL, a league he likely doesn’t watch often.
 

Rhodes 81

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After the seasons they had: Foote seems way too high at #6 and Gritsyuk seems too low at #10. Other than that, nothing too controversial.

Edit - Okhotiuk being an honorable mention is unacceptable 😡
I think Foote being this high is because he still has projectable attributes that could make him a very valuable NHL player. That seems less likely now than it did 2 years ago, but he's also looked decent in the NHL when given the chance.

I've been thinking for a bit now that this board is sky high on Okhotiuk compared to how likely he actually is to be a long-term piece for us. Not that I think he has no chance, but he's more of a 50/50 prospect to me at this point.
Gritsyuk wasn’t even on the list last year so he did have a nice increase on the list.

TBH, for someone trying to cover all the prospects in hockey I kind of understand being slow to adjust to the value of a 5th round pick that has been playing in the KHL, a league he likely doesn’t watch often.
Yeah, Pronman typically doesn't react too strongly to one season. Usually correctly but sometimes to a fault when somebody makes a big jump.
 

Guttersniped

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I watched him in limited games. And guy shoot a lot and his shot was good. With meh skating, without good speed, one way player. He wasn't good without the puck.
After injury he looked like a player who has big weight but doesn't use it. Last year he started to create chances and blocking opponents to create space, he added speed. And its very likable, if you remember how long he spent to recover. Guy love the game and play with passion. I hope he will come through the path of Yegor from "who is this guy? We don't care" to "who is this guy? We want him more on the ice!".
And im little nervous about him, because of waivers. I don't want to save one year of Tatar or Johnsson, even if someone or both will start hot or even continue to be hot full year, for losing Zetterlund.

If they put Zetterlund on waivers we should burn down the arena.

I quoted an old post at the where I have some excerpts from the Hockey Prospect draft profiles of several players including Zetterlund.

It was shockingly spot on with both Z’s strengths and limitations but he’s developing really well, he’s starting to get a lot out of his strengths. He’s a physical force on the rush and a valuable forechecker. He’s sort of a less chaotic Wood who can do more defensively and work a little more with teammates offensively (not a lot more though).

We’ll have to see what the production is the NHL but waiving him would be a terrible mistake. Thompson is waiver exempt, he goes to Utica.

We lost Studenic, who I really like, but I see why they thought he might sneak through. He wasn’t scoring. Studenic was getting pucks on nets though, was already good defensely, good on the PK and only made the minimum. So it wasn’t a surprise he didn’t make it through waivers either.

I only mention Studenic because losing guys on waivers happens but we can’t make it a habit, we need to at least try to avoid it. Young dirt cheap players with immediate upside will have takers. (Ok, I’m still bereft over Studenic, this team doesn’t give defensive forward fans a lot to love. *sob*)


Bratt and Gritsyuk were different though.

If anything Gritsyuk dropped because of his skating, which was fine in terms of form, but weak in terms of acceleration and speed.

In his Hockey Prospect grades in 2019 (they ranked him 57):
Hockey Sense: 7
Compete: 6
Skill: 6
Skating: 5
The scale is 3-9: 7 is Very Good, 6 is Good, 5 is Average

It was his size/strength and lack of elite skating to make up for his size that caused Gritsyuk to drop.

Quotes:
“He competes hard during puck-races and can-out pace opposing defenses but there’s still a separating gear he lacks at this time. This extends to his first-step which also doesn’t have the power to remain as elusive as we would like, given his frame. However his hockey sense compensated for a lot of his weaknesses, which is why we have ranked him at the back-half of our list.” (They only ranked 108 players in 2019.)

His strengths were he was always an exceptionally smart and skilled player who works hard & had a nice shot to boot. He’s a small player who’s just really good at hockey.

His skating form was fine though and speed is something you can gain with strength, which was what Gritsyuk needed to do to get over the hump to compete in the KHL.

Hockey Prospects ranked Bratt at 100 in 2016, out of 211, they have shortened the ranked lists more recently.

They didn’t have scores then but the first thing they mention is Bratt “plays a high paced game with the ability to execute at top speed”.

“He is one of the biggest one on one threats in transition, has a rare ability to deke out defensemen and tremendous agility.”

“His quick decision making keeps up with his great skating ability, and together with patience and vision allows him to be a good playmaker.”

“His accurate wrist shot is definitely a legit threat, but Jesper is a passer more than a goal scorer.”

So why only 100? Needs to get more involved with puck battles, “it looks like he doesn’t like getting his nose dirty, especially along the boards”, didn’t like his defense or compete level, blah blah. Bratt was a boom or bust pick though.

Mark Edwards has a bitchy quote “He catches my attention with some flash and dash but he’s a guy I liked less with every viewing. He’s got skill but need to be a more complete player. Not competitive enough. One of our Euro scouts called him this year’s Bracco.”

I actually bought their 2016 book (along with a bunch of early ones) maybe a year ago just for some hindsight fun. They had McLeod at 19 but Mark Edwards did hit a bullseye with his description here (and he probably saw a lot more OHL hockey in 2016).

Hope you can make that out because I don’t want to transcribe the the whole thing.:

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Also lol:
View attachment 557435

Zetterlund was ranked 176 in 2017 (out of 217) and is described as “an explosive skater who can generate very good top speed”.

“This speed is his best asset, as he consistently is stretching the ice or attacking the net, forcing the opposition to defend. In viewings this season he found himself on a lot of odd man rushes, and was a player who seemed around the puck on most shifts. He combines this speed with a very good motor, as he has a strong desire to retrieve pucks and forecheck. Another asset that helps his forechecking skills is his ability to change directions, and stop and start.”

They mention him playing bigger than his 5’11” height “as he has no trouble using his body to drive to the net and protect the puck”.

“He has a quick release that can surprise goalies and can score from a distance. As well, he can shoot the puck when at top speed and get the puck up quickly around the net.”

The best quote might be “Fabian’s best offensive asset is his feet and his other skills are complementary”.

“Sometimes when he drives the net, he looks out of control and his feet may move quicker than his mind and hands can keep up, but he still manages to create quality shots.” Still true lol.

“Zetterlund needs open space and time to take advantage of skating skills to produce offense. He’s not as impactful offensively in the cycle game or in tight areas. His on-ice vision with the puck allows him to make easy plays but he has not shown that he can create quality chances for his teammates on a consistent basis. Overall, Zetterlund can be an impactful player at the next level as a third or forth liner because of his speed, work ethic and good forechecking skills.”

Solid call there, even in the AHL with more minutes that’s basically his game in a nutshell now.
 

devilsblood

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Is that a reasonable comparison? Blake was a two way player that provided strong defensive and PK value. I would expect Zetterlund to be a bottom 6 scoring winger that gets PP2 time.

I don't see a strong comparison.
Coleman's defense is a high bar, haven't heard or seen much to suggest Z could replicate that. Very much a part of Colemans D was just a high energy level, Zetterlund looks fairly good here, but maybe not Coleman level motor.

Zetterlund probably has more pure offensive skills. Seemed to have a pretty effective one timer on the PP. Coleman got some pp time here and there just because he was so good 5v5, but he really doesn't have PP type offensive skills.

Though Z's straight ahead speed is good, I think Coleman was faster.

Isn’t this…..exactly what Coleman was?
Bottom 6 style of play, but so good at it that he got top 6 minutes. 5v5 at least.
 

Nubmer6

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After the seasons they had: Foote seems way too high at #6 and Gritsyuk seems too low at #10. Other than that, nothing too controversial.

Edit - Okhotiuk being an honorable mention is unacceptable 😡
I find it strange they have Bahl's skating as "below NHL average". I thought he was a surprisingly good skater, especially for someone his size.
 

devilsblood

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I find it strange they have Bahl's skating as "below NHL average". I thought he was a surprisingly good skater, especially for someone his size.
I think average might be more accurate, but no asterisks for size. Having good size and being an average skater is better than being small and being an average skater, but size is one category and skating another.
 

Bankers Box

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It's only USA who calls it soccer while they call Football a sport where 95% of times they use hands to play.
This is pure nonsense.

It is called soccer in the US, Canada, Australia, New Zealand, Ireland (split), Japan, Nigeria (split), Phillipines (split), Singapore (split), and South Africa. There are even a few more minor countries that call it soccer but I didnt list.

You also seem to forget that the name "soccer" was used by the inventors of the game, the British before that changed to football.

I'll never understand why people repeat things without ever checking it when we all have access to the internet.
 
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