Devils team discussion (news, notes and speculation) - offseason edition

[glenwo2]

Can't read the Bernier piece, but man, the Devils were awful in Game 6 before the hit. They had absolutely no life. Was and always will be a bullshit call, but the team was gassed.

Basically, it was Bernier still feeling regretful for that mistake he made (Lou and Little Gio got his back) and wished he could do it all over again differently but knows he can't.

I can't say any more (you need to go subscribe to support this outstanding young man who is bringing us actual Devils-centric news) but these articles have plenty of "meat" on them.

 

[devilsblood]

I am a bit wary about the contract considerations still Meier is a guy who in terms of style of play is someone I'd absolutely be interested in.

But much like Tkachuk, his playoffs #'s are meh, which goes against the "big strong player needed for the playoffs" narrative.

7-13-20 in 35 playoff games for Meier.
7-8-15 in 27 for Tkachuk.

By contrast "soft perimeter player" Fiala is 9-6-15 in 35.

 

[My3Sons]

I am a bit wary about the contract considerations still Meier is a guy who in terms of style of play is someone I'd absolutely be interested in.

But much like Tkachuk, his playoffs #'s are meh, which goes against the "big strong player needed for the playoffs" narrative.

7-13-20 in 35 playoff games for Meier.
7-8-15 in 27 for Tkachuk.

By contrast "soft perimeter player" Fiala is 9-6-15 in 35.

To be fair, Fiala is under both of the other two in terms of scoring and presumably they add some "B" game to help when they aren't contributing on the score sheet. If Fiala isn't scoring I'm not sure he adds much to slow down or tire out the other team. Maybe he draws penalties? Of course, Fiala is probably a more realistic trade target given his status and Minnesota's cap issues and Guerin's statement about preferring to keep Dumba instead. If NJ can add Fiala without giving up the second pick or Holtz or Mercer or Hughes, or an unprotected first for next season then sure, why not.

 

[Hisch13r]

To be fair, Fiala is under both of the other two in terms of scoring and presumably they add some "B" game to help when they aren't contributing on the score sheet. If Fiala isn't scoring I'm not sure he adds much to slow down or tire out the other team. Maybe he draws penalties? Of course, Fiala is probably a more realistic trade target given his status and Minnesota's cap issues and Guerin's statement about preferring to keep Dumba instead. If NJ can add Fiala without giving up the second pick or Holtz or Mercer or Hughes, or an unprotected first for next season then sure, why not.

Fiala for relatively cheap and Puljujarvi or Mikheyev would be ideal to me. I ultimately think someone likey outbids us for Fiala if we don’t add a bigger piece and I’m not doing that. Also Kakko would he nice but just seems so unlikely to happen

 

[devilsblood]

To be fair, Fiala is under both of the other two in terms of scoring and presumably they add some "B" game to help when they aren't contributing on the score sheet. If Fiala isn't scoring I'm not sure he adds much to slow down or tire out the other team. Maybe he draws penalties? Of course, Fiala is probably a more realistic trade target given his status and Minnesota's cap issues and Guerin's statement about preferring to keep Dumba instead. If NJ can add Fiala without giving up the second pick or Holtz or Mercer or Hughes, or an unprotected first for next season then sure, why not.

Oddly he is more goal heavy, more so then Meier, though on a per game avg pretty much in line with Tkachuk.

One might expect Fiala as the "softee" to have a higher assist rate, not sure the why there, but may be due moreso to linemates.

 

[guitarguyvic]

Difference between Pitt and Rag's was solely in net, otherwise Pitt was by far the better team, aging or not.

To the general point how often does a "weak" team win the cup? Not often. How often does the "best" team win the cup, not as often as maybe you suggest.

The better of the two team in the final in terms of personnel and on ice play almost always wins the cup.

I try to stay away from discussing teams in terms of “best”. It’s a term that only has value within a specific context or parameter. The Florida panthers were the best team during the regular season, defined by points acquired from total wins and regulation ties. They won the appropriate trophy for that. The playoffs is a tournament whose winner is defined by a different set of parameters, resulting in a different label/trophy being awarded. One can argue which one reflects team talent and performance more accurately. I’d posit that neither one does, they just reflect different parameters of success. Philosophically I’ve always viewed attempting to label one team the “best” as being objectively impossible. There’s are several teams who perform at a level good enough to have success in various forms, within specific timeframes, under specific parameters subjectively defined by humans. Nothing more.

/end my sports philosophy

 

[glenwo2]

Gee, I wonder why Sherry blocked him?

 

[McDuffz88]

Looks like Fitz is dead set on riding with Ruff into the season. With Cassidy already getting hired by the Knights along with the news of Flyers hiring Torts all the big name coaches are being hired. Only one left is Trotz but 0 chance he comes here when he can go to any team he wants. Of course there's others like Pete Deboer but the 2 guys I really wanted Fitz to go after are now hired. If we end up firing Ruff middle of next year with all these big name coaches available I'll be screaming for Fitzgerald's head.

 

[Bleedred]

Yeah, we really needed to win one of the first two games and get a split to have any chance in that SCF.

The 5 minute major probably only made the score of the game greater than it would have been.

I don't think there was really a chance we were gonna come back from 3 games down and reverse sweep them to come back and win that series.

We needed a split in Jersey and a split on the road, which we did win game 4 on the road. Assuming that goes the same way and we get the split in the first two games, we probably have a decent chance of taking it in 7.

 

[Nocashstyle]

Gee, I wonder why Sherry blocked him?

I think some of his trolling is amusing, but I understand why you dislike his account; however, you specially seem to bring his account up every day. Just let it go, man. You’re feeding into it.

 

[devilsblood]

The better of the two team in the final in terms of personnel and on ice play almost always wins the cup.

I try to stay away from discussing teams in terms of “best”. It’s a term that only has value within a specific context or parameter. The Florida panthers were the best team during the regular season, defined by points acquired from total wins and regulation ties. They won the appropriate trophy for that. The playoffs is a tournament whose winner is defined by a different set of parameters, resulting in a different label/trophy being awarded. One can argue which one reflects team talent and performance more accurately. I’d posit that neither one does, they just reflect different parameters of success. Philosophically I’ve always viewed attempting to label one team the “best” as being objectively impossible. There’s are several teams who perform at a level good enough to have success in various forms, within specific timeframes, under specific parameters subjectively defined by humans. Nothing more.

/end my sports philosophy

So this is a bit of a shots for% argument? Or xGF?

Not sure what the stats say about that in the playoffs historically. Though didn't Florida outshoot Tampa, only to have Vasilevsky steal it? Kind of like Shesterkin vs Pitt?

I imagine Colorado has dominated the team stats outwest.

 

[glenwo2]

I think some of his trolling is amusing, but I understand why you dislike his account; however, you specially seem to bring his account up every day. Just let it go, man. You’re feeding into it.

Hey man...I'm just annoyed that he got everyone's hopes up then revealed himself (basically) to be nothing more than someone who has as much "inside info" as you or me.

And besides, I found that tweet interesting which is why I put it up as apparently I'm not the only one (sherry) unamused by him.

BTW, how am I "feeding into it" when he's not even going to see my post? Hell...does he even know that HFBoards exists instead of Twitter?


And I don't "bring his account up every day". That's just utter hyperbolic nonsense.

 

[MartyOwns]

Looks like Fitz is dead set on riding with Ruff into the season. With Cassidy already getting hired by the Knights along with the news of Flyers hiring Torts all the big name coaches are being hired. Only one left is Trotz but 0 chance he comes here when he can go to any team he wants. Of course there's others like Pete Deboer but the 2 guys I really wanted Fitz to go after are now hired. If we end up firing Ruff middle of next year with all these big name coaches available I'll be screaming for Fitzgerald's head.

i think we already knew that when the assistants got sacked. ruff isn’t the best, but he’s not the worst. let’s see how he can do with league average goaltending

I think some of his trolling is amusing, but I understand why you dislike his account; however, you specially seem to bring his account up every day. Just let it go, man. You’re feeding into it.

you must be new here

 

[devilsblood]

Yeah, we really needed to win one of the first two games and get a split to have any chance in that SCF.

The 5 minute major probably only made the score of the game greater than it would have been.

I don't think there was really a chance we were gonna come back from 3 games down and reverse sweep them to come back and win that series.

We needed a split in Jersey and a split on the road, which we did win game 4 on the road. Assuming that goes the same way and we get the split in the first two games, we probably have a decent chance of taking it in 7.

Ya, never want to lose the first 2 games of a series on your home ice, and if you do, then you better win game 3.

So down 3-0 most everyone thinks the series is over, and if I weren't a fan of either team I wouldn't tune back in unless it got to game 6, which it did. By winning 4 & 5, the comeback went for "not happening" to "OK maybe".

And I did acknowledge the energy it took to win 4 & 5, and I acknowledge LA was a well rested team relatively, but by getting it game 6 we had made it a series once again, and at 0-0 despite being outplayed we were still in it. It wasn't until the penalty and the 3 shorties which followed did the chances of a comeback officially go kaput.

 

[Nocashstyle]

Hey man...I'm just annoyed that he got everyone's hopes up then revealed himself (basically) to be nothing more than someone who has as much "inside info" as you or me.

And besides, I found that tweet interesting which is why I put it up as apparently I'm not the only one (sherry) unamused by him.

BTW, how am I "feeding into it" when he's not even going to see my post? Hell...does he even know that HFBoards exists instead of Twitter?


And I don't "bring his account up every day". That's just utter hyperbolic nonsense.

You’re basically promoting his account by posting it in here, so yes: feeding into it. And you’ve linked his tweets here multiple times.

 

[glenwo2]

You’re basically promoting his account by posting it in here, so yes: feeding into it. And you’ve linked his tweets here multiple times.

I only did it the first few times when he was tweeting his lies (now confirmed) that he had inside-info.

That's not posting EVERY DAY like you claim.

Give me a break.

And why are you so suddenly concerned with what I post or don't?

 

[guitarguyvic]

So this is a bit of a shots for% argument? Or xGF?

Not sure what the stats say about that in the playoffs historically. Though didn't Florida outshoot Tampa, only to have Vasilevsky steal it? Kind of like Shesterkin vs Pitt?

I imagine Colorado has dominated the team stats outwest.

I’m not endorsing any particular stats or performance methodology. Merely stating that terms like “best” are arbitrary and lack any real meaning outside of very specific parameters that are being used within a given context.

For example, you made the claim that the teams that have won the Stanley cup haven’t always been the best teams. Well, how are you defining “best” and what makes that definition any more of a value statement than the parameters of winning the tournament?

Sports and competition and the rules that define it are all arbitrary human concepts. Ya dig?

 

[Nocashstyle]

I only did it the first few times when he was tweeting his lies (now confirmed) that he had inside-info.

That's not posting EVERY DAY like you claim.

Give me a break.

And why are you so suddenly concerned with what I post or don't?

Because I have to scroll past it

 

[glenwo2]

Because I have to scroll past it

And you can't help but comment on it instead of just scrolling past it like others have apparently done?

You're the only person who is "wagging his finger" at me here.

By you doing that, you invite this off-topic discussion.

Whereas I'd prefer this discussion veers back to Devils Hockey, thank you very much.

 

[NJDevilsFan21]

So if we were to land Gaudreau from UFA, we could theoretically end up with something like this if we proceed to trade the 2OA pick + some other younger assets as well:

I'm assuming we'd lose Zacha, Smith, Holtz, and 2ndOA for Tkachuk or Debrincat.

F:
Bratt-Hughes-Sharangovich
Tkachuk/Debrincat-Gaudreau-Johnsson(cheap extn)
Mercer-Hischier-Tatar(cheap extn)
Foote-McLeod/Kuokkanen-Wood

D:
Hamilton-Severson
Hughes-Siegs
Bahl-Graves/Muk

G:
Blackwood-beachball

We could then try to leverage anything we still have beyond that to fix goaltending, unless Blackwood has a resurgence.

There's no way that's still a losing team. But if it didn't work out, we'd also kind of mess up a future window we may be building right now.

 

[glenwo2]

So if we were to land Gaudreau from UFA, we could theoretically end up with something like this if we proceed to trade the 2OA pick + some other younger assets as well:

I'm assuming we'd lose Zacha, Smith, Holtz, and 2ndOA for Tkachuk or Debrincat.

F:
Bratt-Hughes-Sharangovich
Tkachuk/Debrincat-Gaudreau-Johnsson(cheap extn)
Mercer-Hischier-Tatar(cheap extn)
Foote-McLeod/Kuokkanen-Wood

D:
Hamilton-Severson
Hughes-Siegs
Bahl-Graves/Muk

G:
Blackwood-beachball

We could then try to leverage anything we still have beyond that to fix goaltending, unless Blackwood has a resurgence.

The Goaltending will remain an issue until it's fixed so whatever deals made (like yours) won't mean much until that happens.

Goaltending is the key here.

Devils fix that, they'll be on their way.

 

[devilsblood]

I’m not endorsing any particular stats or performance methodology. Merely stating that terms like “best” are arbitrary and lack any real meaning outside of very specific parameters that are being used within a given context.

For example, you made the claim that the teams that have won the Stanley cup haven’t always been the best teams. Well, how are you defining “best” and what makes that definition any more of a value statement than the parameters of winning the tournament?

Sports and competition and the rules that define it are all arbitrary human concepts. Ya dig?

Well i was trying to dig down to your point of the "better" team winning. Or whatever word you used.

I'm guessing you are saying the team that plays better in that specific series typically wins. But I wonder how we factor goaltending and finishing ability into that. Carolina for instance were meh on both fronts, though one could say they outplayed the Rag's(shooting from the hip here a bit, didn't super closely follow the series).

 

[Triumph]

And you can't help but comment on it instead of just scrolling past it like others have apparently done?

You're the only person who is "wagging his finger" at me here.

By you doing that, you invite this off-topic discussion.

Whereas I'd prefer this discussion veers back to Devils Hockey, thank you very much.

I agree with him, don't bring your Twitter feuds here. This guy posted one rumor, that's it, it was bad, he's been debunked, nobody should post about this guy anymore. All Twitter feuds should stay there - people dunking on CJ Turturo, Rachel Doerrie, Cordell, ILWT/AATJ, either do it on Twitter or don't bother with it here.

 

[glenwo2]

I agree with him, don't bring your Twitter feuds here. This guy posted one rumor, that's it, it was bad, he's been debunked, nobody should post about this guy anymore. All Twitter feuds should stay there - people dunking on CJ Turturo, Rachel Doerrie, Cordell, ILWT, either do it on Twitter or don't bother with it here.

What twitter feud?

What on earth are you talking about?

I'm not on Twitter.

I'm here and I made my point about him.

That's it.

Does it really bother you and him so much that you have to scroll past my post? (that's what he said)

How about just ignoring it? Others are doing it. Why can't you?

All you're doing is putting more fuel to this off-topic discussion fire here.

I don't want to continue this discussion here when there's more important things to discuss....more ON-TOPIC things to discuss.

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

So if we were to land Gaudreau from UFA, we could theoretically end up with something like this if we proceed to trade the 2OA pick + some other younger assets as well:

I'm assuming we'd lose Zacha, Smith, Holtz, and 2ndOA for Tkachuk or Debrincat.

F:
Bratt-Hughes-Sharangovich
Tkachuk/Debrincat-Gaudreau-Johnsson(cheap extn)
Mercer-Hischier-Tatar(cheap extn)
Foote-McLeod/Kuokkanen-Wood

D:
Hamilton-Severson
Hughes-Siegs
Bahl-Graves/Muk

G:
Blackwood-beachball

We could then try to leverage anything we still have beyond that to fix goaltending, unless Blackwood has a resurgence.

There's no way that's still a losing team. But if it didn't work out, we'd also kind of mess up a future window we may be building right now.

I am team "cap doesn't matter", but we cannot afford a big contract for Gaudreau AND Tkachuk/Debrincat. Thats way too much money at the F position.