- Dec 1, 2019
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Devils team discussion (news, notes and speculation) - 2023-24 season part III
- Thread starter NJDevs26
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When you talk rebounds Daws and Schmid have consistently coughed 'em up like 3 for a $ at the fair. Rebound control seems to be something NJ goalie coach doesn't address at all.
When Rollie Melanson was the Comets goalie coach, Markstrom, Eriksson, Bachman, and Demko became quite good at directing rebounds away from the crease if they were shots they couldn't keep right in their possession. He worked on it and they practiced it.
The new pads are very difficult to keep rebounds in close. The puck just explodes off them. You have to try to direct the puck off of them towards the corners. Not so easy to do on close hard shots, especially in traffic. Rebounds do get coughed up in those conditions and there's not much a keeper can do about it. D-men are supposed to be attuned to this and take responsibility for those kind of rebounds. Just clear the f**king rebounds anywhere they can.
The old leather pads depended upon how strong you were on your skate. If you could relax your leg, the pad would drop the shot almost right at your feet. Thus, you can see old video clips where the puck stops at their feet and the goalies are more often than not either dropping on them with both pads or covering it with the glove and the stick behind it. That's how I was taught.
Now as to the rebounds from the catching glove. there is no excuse for that. Pucks don't just jump back out of a broken in glove, especially the monsters they wear today. The webbing should be so soft it just eats up the puck. It shouldn't act like a slingshot and fire it back into play. When they are new the webbing will do that Also the new palm is like a pitch back tool. Wearing new gloves in games is not the route to take. They may look great, but the puck is very active in them.
Blocker shots are easy to direct away from you and even over the glass as well as high over the net. You have to work on it with a guy taking a lot of shots with just the two of you out there 10 minutes or so before every practice. And then once practice gets going keep doing it as often as possible until it becomes second nature. I can't believe guys can reach the NHL without having gotten this down.
There is truth in this explanation. It results in goalies being lambs fed to the wolves one night and being protected like precious gems another.
R8Devs
1-5-6-12
Jack at the top right of the top right as per usual for rush offense. special appearance from Miles Wood.
The other devils in the upper right quadrant are Bratt, Meier, and Holtz
- Dec 20, 2018
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The picture issue is denying me @NjDevsRR memes?
Wait, I have no ability to that.
Anyhoo, I think posting thumbnails helps? Maybe?
Must be a Calgary Flames board insider
So this particular meme was blurry in thumbnail form so I had to do full image. Hopefully it eventually loads
Get your shit together HF
Gotta admire his commitment determination seems like Jim is taking on the whole Devils fan base on this one
Yeah would have been nice then to leave out the Messier garbage....
JimEIV
Registered User
- Feb 19, 2003
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Not the first time. It's always the same topic it seems...or some variation.
Goalies are just not as important as people think in this era. I'll die on that hill every time.
We all gotta pick a hill and it's your right to pick the hill...
If Siegenthaler goes in someone not only has to come out of the lineup, but off the roster. With 3 keepers the Devils already carry 23. Siegs makes 24 and if Foote is practicing in a regular jersey he would make 25 if activated and 2 have to come off the roster. A healthy NJ Devils says there has to be some player movement.
I see Schmid on his way back to Utica and with the game Kallgren played Saturday that's not good news in Utica. 3-man rotations in net are not advantageous. Schmid hasn't played in eons and sticking him right back into the rotation isn't good for the Comets who are desperate to move up in the standings. He wasn't helping in that regard when he was here last. However, if he comes back it will be expected he plays over Kallgren.
The other guy would likely be DeSimone put on waivers and he'll be Utica bound if he clears.
Siegs make 7 D
Foote would be 14 Fs.
That's 21 + Vitek and Daws = 23
No word as of yet.
Perhaps Foote is ready to practice with the boys, but not yet game ready. He is actually in the state where many NHL players get sent to the farm on a conditioning stint. Not too happy about that since most players in this situation usually don't put forth a very strong effort as they are making sure they don't get reinjured.
I see Schmid on his way back to Utica and with the game Kallgren played Saturday that's not good news in Utica. 3-man rotations in net are not advantageous. Schmid hasn't played in eons and sticking him right back into the rotation isn't good for the Comets who are desperate to move up in the standings. He wasn't helping in that regard when he was here last. However, if he comes back it will be expected he plays over Kallgren.
The other guy would likely be DeSimone put on waivers and he'll be Utica bound if he clears.
Siegs make 7 D
Foote would be 14 Fs.
That's 21 + Vitek and Daws = 23
No word as of yet.
Perhaps Foote is ready to practice with the boys, but not yet game ready. He is actually in the state where many NHL players get sent to the farm on a conditioning stint. Not too happy about that since most players in this situation usually don't put forth a very strong effort as they are making sure they don't get reinjured.
Zajacs Bowl Cut
Lets Go Baby
I am sure that they will just put Vitek on IR to open up a spot
I think your best point might be that there is some anecdotal evidence that at least some teams in the league appear to agree with you.
glenwo2
JESPER BRATWURST
It's like they're doing a documentary on Philly or something.
That would cover 1, but the possibility of 2 with Foote says someone would have to go besides Vitek on IR. That would mean DeSimone as Schmid would still be in NJ.
Foote skating in a regular jersey says he must be close. Yes?
Emperoreddy
Show Me What You Got!
glenwo2
JESPER BRATWURST
guitarguyvic
Registered User
- Mar 31, 2010
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I agree with you about this, but pointing to who scores first or how often the team is trailing without any additional context tells us nothing meaningful about it.
AfroThunder396
[citation needed]
We have played 162 regulation periods this season.
We have scored 2 or more goals in a period 58 times. Over 35% of the time. We have scored 3 or more goals in a period 13 times, 8% of the time.
If you want to look at just 3rd periods - we have scored two or more goals in the 3rd period 27 times (50%). Our record in those games is 18-9-0.
So, if the New Jersey Devils are trailing by 2 goals in the 2nd period, there is a 50% chance they will score enough to tie. BUT ONLY IF the opponent doesn't add any more goals to their lead in the 3rd period.
In those 18 wins, we were trailing or tied going into the 3rd in eight of them. In those 9 losses, we were shutout in the first 40 minutes in six of them.
We have scored three or more goals in the 3rd period SEVEN times this season. We are 5-2-0 in those games. The 5 wins consist of one game we were leading going into the 3rd, one we were tied going into the 3rd, and three we were losing going into the 3rd.
Taking it further, we are 7-17-1 when trailing going into the 3rd period. 6 of the 18 losses we failed to score a goal in the 3rd, so the comeback was never going to happen. 4 of the losses we "won" the 3rd period by scoring more than the opponent, but we did not score enough to tied the game.
But in 8 of those 18 losses, we made up the 2nd intermission deficit but lost because our goaltender allowed 3rd period goals that extended the opponent lead further than it was heading into the 3rd:
Oct 16th vs Florida - Trailing 3-0, we score 3 third period goals, Vanecek allows 1 in the third, lose 4-3 in regulation
Nov 14th vs Winnipeg - Trailing 3-2, we score 1 third period goal, Schmid allows 2 in the third + 1 ENG, lose 6-3 in regulation
Dec 1st vs San Jose - Trailing 3-1, we score 2 third period goals, Schmid allows 2 in the third + 1 ENG, lose 6-3 in regulation
Jan 6th vs Vancouver - Trailing 4-2, we score 2 third period goals, Daws allows 1 in the 3rd + 1 ENG, lose 6-4 in regulation
Jan 11th vs Tampa Bay - Trailing 3-2, we score 1 third period goal, Vanecek allows 1 in the 3rd, lose 4-3 in regulation
Jan 17th vs Montreal - Trailing 2-0, we score 2 third period goals, Daws allows 1 in the 3rd, lose 3-2 in regulation
Jan 27th vs Tampa Bay - Trailing 2-0, we score 3 third period goals, Vanecek allows 2 in the 3rd + 2 ENG, lose 6-4 in regulation
Feb 8th vs Calgary - Trailing 2-1, we score 2 goals in the 3rd period, Vanecek allows 2 in the 3rd + 1 ENG, lose 5-3 in regulation
That's 8 (eight!) comebacks where we scored enough in the 3rd to overcome the 2nd intermission deficit, but we lose in regulation because the goalie shit the bed in the 3rd period. That's at least 8 points left on the table in CLEARLY winnable comeback situations - probably more considering how awesome we are at 3-on-3.
8 extra points would put us at 5th in the East, 1 point behind Carolina and 2 ahead of Toronto. And that's assuming we lose all of those OT games. If we win just half of those OT games, that's another 4 points, which puts us comfortably at #2 in the Metro - 3 points behind NYR with a game in hand on them.
That's the difference goaltending makes. A few bad goals in very important moments, suddenly you go from top of the mountain to outside looking in. 11-9-5 is a lot better than 7-17-1.
We have scored 2 or more goals in a period 58 times. Over 35% of the time. We have scored 3 or more goals in a period 13 times, 8% of the time.
If you want to look at just 3rd periods - we have scored two or more goals in the 3rd period 27 times (50%). Our record in those games is 18-9-0.
So, if the New Jersey Devils are trailing by 2 goals in the 2nd period, there is a 50% chance they will score enough to tie. BUT ONLY IF the opponent doesn't add any more goals to their lead in the 3rd period.
In those 18 wins, we were trailing or tied going into the 3rd in eight of them. In those 9 losses, we were shutout in the first 40 minutes in six of them.
We have scored three or more goals in the 3rd period SEVEN times this season. We are 5-2-0 in those games. The 5 wins consist of one game we were leading going into the 3rd, one we were tied going into the 3rd, and three we were losing going into the 3rd.
Taking it further, we are 7-17-1 when trailing going into the 3rd period. 6 of the 18 losses we failed to score a goal in the 3rd, so the comeback was never going to happen. 4 of the losses we "won" the 3rd period by scoring more than the opponent, but we did not score enough to tied the game.
But in 8 of those 18 losses, we made up the 2nd intermission deficit but lost because our goaltender allowed 3rd period goals that extended the opponent lead further than it was heading into the 3rd:
Oct 16th vs Florida - Trailing 3-0, we score 3 third period goals, Vanecek allows 1 in the third, lose 4-3 in regulation
Nov 14th vs Winnipeg - Trailing 3-2, we score 1 third period goal, Schmid allows 2 in the third + 1 ENG, lose 6-3 in regulation
Dec 1st vs San Jose - Trailing 3-1, we score 2 third period goals, Schmid allows 2 in the third + 1 ENG, lose 6-3 in regulation
Jan 6th vs Vancouver - Trailing 4-2, we score 2 third period goals, Daws allows 1 in the 3rd + 1 ENG, lose 6-4 in regulation
Jan 11th vs Tampa Bay - Trailing 3-2, we score 1 third period goal, Vanecek allows 1 in the 3rd, lose 4-3 in regulation
Jan 17th vs Montreal - Trailing 2-0, we score 2 third period goals, Daws allows 1 in the 3rd, lose 3-2 in regulation
Jan 27th vs Tampa Bay - Trailing 2-0, we score 3 third period goals, Vanecek allows 2 in the 3rd + 2 ENG, lose 6-4 in regulation
Feb 8th vs Calgary - Trailing 2-1, we score 2 goals in the 3rd period, Vanecek allows 2 in the 3rd + 1 ENG, lose 5-3 in regulation
That's 8 (eight!) comebacks where we scored enough in the 3rd to overcome the 2nd intermission deficit, but we lose in regulation because the goalie shit the bed in the 3rd period. That's at least 8 points left on the table in CLEARLY winnable comeback situations - probably more considering how awesome we are at 3-on-3.
8 extra points would put us at 5th in the East, 1 point behind Carolina and 2 ahead of Toronto. And that's assuming we lose all of those OT games. If we win just half of those OT games, that's another 4 points, which puts us comfortably at #2 in the Metro - 3 points behind NYR with a game in hand on them.
That's the difference goaltending makes. A few bad goals in very important moments, suddenly you go from top of the mountain to outside looking in. 11-9-5 is a lot better than 7-17-1.
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JimEIV
Registered User
- Feb 19, 2003
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Meaningful? I don't know. I think there are many here that believe we are scraping and clawing for a playoff spot because of goaltending and not poor play.
I think the fact that we find ourselves down going into the 3rd nearly 50% of games and never playing with a lead is more indictive of team play than individual goaltending performance. And I think sub average goalies (in stats) are often below average because of their team more than their ability.
What effect does playing 250 minutes behind Luke or Bahl this season vs Graves last have a goaltenders SV%? I don't think it's insignificant...and I think it has a cascade effect... I think forwards do different things and I think defensive partner's play differently because of it....and I think once trailing in a game you face a different opponent that takes on different posture with a lead....a posture we don't play particularly well against
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Better Call Sal
Salnalysis
Just want to share that after the discourse about us having lost the Toffoli-Sharangovich trade when Rango was red hot, he has 2 assists and is a -6 in his last 9 games ( today included so far) while Toffoli has 8 goals in his last 10 games. Toffoli has 4 more goals and 1 more point than Rango in two less games played.
Streaky players gonna streak!
Streaky players gonna streak!
JimEIV
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- Feb 19, 2003
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Since I was the one brought up that trade, I feel the need to say I don't think anyone made the claim we "lost the Toffoli-Sharangovich trade"
It was a conversation about fit(speed)with our team. At least that's what I was saying.
How could we obtain our leading goal scorer and lose the trade?
I just always direct folks to the shots on goal criteria. They have the same ice time and Tyler averages an entire shot more per game than Yegor. One will get more goals and points than the other when that happens over the course of a season.
Better Call Sal
Salnalysis
Nah this wasn’t directed at you, this was something that came up a few weeks back when Rango was pumping the net with goals and Toffoli went cold.
They’re both streaky players and Rango cooling off was predictable. I certainly agree there’s a discussion to be had about fit, but I don’t think there’s much reason in claiming a winner or loser in this trade. Both players seem to be doing what they do in their new home. I totally understood why the move was made, and I get why some are hesitant to keep Toffoli. For me, it’d depend on the cost and length of what he’d be looking for on his next contract.
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