Devils 2019-20 Preseason/Season team discussion (news and notes)

[HischieR13]

I know its not the right topic but i am moving into my new house nex tweek and really trying to get the collection together..

I have two elias banners (unopened in plastic) from retirement night that i am willing to trade for a daneyko or stevens banner (i dont care if its been opened) .. if anyone is interested just DM me or reply here. I dont actually log in that much but i do read a lot

- if you just have a daneyko or stevens banner youre looking to sell let me know too

 

[Spoiled Bratt]

Is the new season here yet?

There's nothing more to add to the Laine debate as everyone here is pretty much established their positions on that matter.

Let's get this season underway so we can have Devils hockey to talk about.

It’s not necessarily a Laine debate anymore more so then a conversation to improve our team by adding a younger player that will fit our timeline.

If it’s not something that interests you anymore, you can always choose to avoid the subject

 

[Spoiled Bratt]

Agree with the sentiment, but what if Laine's cost is the same as the cost of the ideal player you described, like it likely will be?

The reason Laine came up is because Winnipeg is tight in regards to cap space, he’s a right winger and he’s just 21 years of age.

Mitch Marner would also fit that criteria but coming off the season he had, Dubas would be asking for Hughes+. Laine didn’t have a great year and we could possibly land him for cheaper then what he’s really worth.

 

[theunsunghero]

 

[Spoiled Bratt]

This is less to do about homerism and more to do with grass is always greener/shiny toy stuff.

The guy is a goal machine. We need goals to win games. I know we root for the Devils and we sort of implemented the "defence first" mentality into our players but please, can we just expand our horizons a bit and stop with the "he’s not responsible in all 3 zones" stuff.

Why aren’t we saying that about our défense? Severson has been loved by several around here and he can’t play a lick of D. Shouldn’t we apply that same criteria for defenders as well? I keep seeing "just pair him with a defensive dman and watch his game evolve". I’m 100% on board with that notion, I just don’t understand why it can’t be applied to forwards as well.

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

Like I (and others) have said, most people would love to get Laine

Most people would not love to trade 2 good players for Laine AND pay Laine $9 million/year longterm

It isn't difficult

 

[MartyOwns]

now he’s getting $9M long term?

 

[RangerDoggo]

Do your worst, Philly (as long as it isn’t racism)

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

now he’s getting $9M long term?

if he was going to take like $5, don't you think he would be signed by now

or nah?

 

[PKs Broken Stick]

I wish we still had the old threads on Andy Greene from 2007-2009 or so. Everyone hated him because he was useless, did nothing well, and was a defensive liability.

Defensemen get better at defense as they age.

To be fair, a lot of that was because we went from Stevens, Niedermayer, and Rafalski to Greene.

 

[MartyOwns]

if he was going to take like $5, don't you think he would be signed by now

or nah?

if only there was an option between 5 and 9. 7 or something? i don’t know i’m not great at math

 

[PKs Broken Stick]

Sure, I'd love an elite goal scorer who is also a good playmaker, drives play 5v5, and is good defensively, but good luck finding or acquiring that player.

I wonder if Sidney Crosby is available.

 

[njdevils1982]

To be fair, a lot of that was because we went from Stevens, Niedermayer, and Rafalski to Greene.

more like from Stevens, Niedermayer, and Rafalski to martin and greene

 

[Emperoreddy]

makes sense, but a few things. 1) 30 goals is the least amount he’s had in a season, so to call him a 30 goal scorer is disingenuous. 2) in terms of cap, he’ll make slightly more than hall earns right now. getting laine would absolutely make hall expendable, and by trading him we could get a blue chip defenseman and a little cap relief. 3) the dimensional stuff is killing me. again, we’re not building a team in a vacuum, there are other multi-dimensional players you could pair laine with, such as nico. we don’t need a top 6 that’s full of mensa members, we need a balanced group where each guy is providing a specific skill set

We aren’t getting a blue chip Dman for a Hall rental.

When you are giving up that much plus inking a kid to a huge contract. That one dimensional play becomes really really important.

 

[SteveCangialosi123]

Sami Vatanen had a bad season due to injuries. His play didn't suddenly fall off a cliff at age 28. He's a better d-man then Severson, both offensively and defensively. Let's stop all this non sense right now.

Everytime Severson gets put on the top pair for a good stretch, he gets exposed really bad.

I don't care if he produced more points because that was never what people complained about, his ability to defend is mediocre.

Literally none of this is supported by any evidence whatsoever.

 

[TheUnseenHand]

Got our upgrade for the home opener. We wanted section 21, ended up with section 2 row 8. Never sat that close behind the net before. Should be interesting.

 

[njdevils1982]

Got our upgrade for the home opener. We wanted section 21, ended up with section 2 row 8. Never sat that close behind the net before. Should be interesting.

you'll have a good time if youve never sat in that type of area before, but i wouldnt do it for every game/season tickets……i get more out of enjoying the game to actually watch from an upper seat

 

[TheUnseenHand]

you'll have a good time if youve never sat in that type of area before, but i wouldnt do it for every game/season tickets……i get more out of enjoying the game to actually watch from an upper seat

Yeah, not something I would have chosen either, but it is the side they shoot twice. I think section 20 or 21 row 15 or so is my favorite.

 

[NJDevs26]

Literally none of this is supported by any evidence whatsoever.

I'm not saying you're wrong but it's this kind of debate that usually falls on deaf ears when anyone just slaps a random chart down with a bunch of numbers that people don't understand or roll their eyes at because they're not the perfect barometer as generally it gets made out to be. And it seems to me almost all the advanced stats are biased toward offensive production anyway.

If you or anyone else is going to argue stats at least provide some context rather than just a bunch of random abbreviated numbers that mean nothing to the people who aren't into advanced stats. If people don't want to buy into the numbers that's their prerogative, but it doesn't help convince anyone when the numbers just get thrown out there with zero context and explanation.

 

[R8Devs]

I'm not saying you're wrong but it's this kind of debate that usually falls on deaf ears when anyone just slaps a random chart down with a bunch of numbers that people don't understand or roll their eyes at because they're not the perfect barometer as generally it gets made out to be. And it seems to me almost all the advanced stats are biased toward offensive production anyway.

If you or anyone else is going to argue stats at least provide some context rather than just a bunch of random abbreviated numbers that mean nothing to the people who aren't into advanced stats. If people don't want to buy into the numbers that's their prerogative, but it doesn't help convince anyone when the numbers just get thrown out there with zero context and explanation.

it provides context within the diagram. The minutes tracked (and games), what it's measuring (either shown in percentage or per 60 minutes), and the percentile that belongs too. None of those numbers are models or derived by formulas either. Rolling your eyes before reading it is on the person who does that.

And how is zone entry defense and zone exits (the last five bars) affected by offensive production?

 

[Oneiro]

Severson is the best or 2nd best stick checker at his own blue line on the team. Deep in his own zone he makes mistakes but I’ve seen the same gaffes come from every single defender playing in Hynes’ system.

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

if only there was an option between 5 and 9. 7 or something? i don’t know i’m not great at math

hey @MartyOwns since you seem to know, can you please tell me what Laine signs for?

thank you kindly.

if Laine was asking for a reasonable contract, do you think he would have signed by now or?

 

[glenwo2]

It’s not necessarily a Laine debate anymore more so then a conversation to improve our team by adding a younger player that will fit our timeline.

If it’s not something that interests you anymore, you can always choose to avoid the subject

I don't avoid subjects but I do tire of discussing things that go back and forth with neither side budging.

If people still discuss Laine, I will add my two cents but excuse me for wanting the season to be here so we can be excited about an upcoming game or a win or how Hughes is playing....

The reason Laine came up is because Winnipeg is tight in regards to cap space, he’s a right winger and he’s just 21 years of age.

Mitch Marner would also fit that criteria but coming off the season he had, Dubas would be asking for Hughes+. Laine didn’t have a great year and we could possibly land him for cheaper then what he’s really worth.

In that scenario, they (The Jets) will ask for Nico....That's their version of "cheaper".

They are not going to ask for Bratt and/or Severson nor would they want them anyway unless they come WITH Nico as the main piece.

Stop mistaking Cheveldayoff for Chiarelli.

He's not that stupid.

 

[MadDevil]

hey @MartyOwns since you seem to know, can you please tell me what Laine signs for?

thank you kindly.

if Laine was asking for a reasonable contract, do you think he would have signed by now or?

What do you think would be reasonable?

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

If he signed longterm? Probably $7 million/year....somewhere in that range.