Devils 2018-19 team discussion (news and notes) - part IX

[Emperoreddy]

I don’t think the Hall discussion is reasonable until we reach the date when he’s actually eligible to extend.

Imagine if all of this worry and panic was for naught?

I feel like it will be. End of day money talks, and we have tons of it.

 

[None Shall Pass]

"Sheltered or not, might be smart to give him a little more ice."

Yeaaaaaaaaah, no.

 

[Monsieur Verdoux]

Trade him now Ray.

I don't want to trade him either, but there isn't anyone else who can bring something significant back. Other teams doesn't give their better players for Wood, Noesen, Johansson etc. After this season Butcher can be replacable if Smith is as good as we all hope. If you traded Butcher, I'm sure the counterpart would be pretty good.

Of course Shero can use draft picks as a trade bait, but I'm not ready to move our first round pick. With other picks he can try to get similar players as Palmieri, MoJo and Mueller. Or BB8. As you know, those aren't always sure bets.

 

[JimEIV]

Trade him now Ray.

Precisely how we should trick another GM into thinking he is good.

 

[MichaelJ]

Just a thought...over the summer there were rumors that the Devils and Hawks were discussing Toews. I don’t remember the source, so it may very well have just been clickbait.

However, in looking around the league, there aren’t many Top6 centers who look to be available. Does anyone think the Hawks would really be motivated to move him? Any interest in adding him for the next four years? I wouldn’t want to make a serious dent in the rebuild and if the price was too high in important prospects and picks I wouldn’t be interested.

If not, who is really out there who could hold down a Top6 C spot that the Devils could acquire? Some have suggested Duchene, but I don’t see him signing here.

 

[Monsieur Verdoux]

Just a thought...over the summer there were rumors that the Devils and Hawks were discussing Toews. I don’t remember the source, so it may very well have just been clickbait.

However, in looking around the league, there aren’t many Top6 centers who look to be available. Does anyone think the Hawks would really be motivated to move him? Any interest in adding him for the next four years? I wouldn’t want to make a serious dent in the rebuild and if the price was too high in important prospects and picks I wouldn’t be interested.

Well, if the price is right... but I doubt it.

 

[glenwo2]

I feel like it will be. End of day money talks, and we have tons of it.

Hall's agent must be salivating....

 

[ChicksDigTheTrap]

I don’t think the Hall discussion is reasonable until we reach the date when he’s actually eligible to extend.

Imagine if all of this worry and panic was for naught?

Who seems worried? It sounds like most everyone is level headed. If he does not choose to resign in the summer it seems like the consensus is he should be traded. While I would like the Devils to resign him, I personally would never be very upset about not giving out a large FA contract that likely will be a poor value by the end of the contract. The reality is his value drops the day he signs the new contract. His production is more valuable at $6 million than whatever he signs for as an FA.

 

[Emperoreddy]

Precisely how we should trick another GM into thinking he is good.

There is a GM in Arizona who thinks just like Todd does.

 

[Triumph]

How would the narratives here be if the Devils drafted Butcher and all of you followed him for the last 4 years before his reaching the NHL? I suspect they wouldn't be 'trade him' or 'Hynes is playing him the right amount'.

 

[MadDevil]

I'm not opposed to trading Butcher if the return is high enough. I just think some people have turned on him rather quickly because of a bad stretch of play (on a team that has struggled as a whole), which he has mostly rebounded from. Smith may make him expendable next year, but I'd be hesitant to count on it happening.

 

[JimEIV]

How would the narratives here be if the Devils drafted Butcher and all of you followed him for the last 4 years before his reaching the NHL? I suspect they wouldn't be 'trade him' or 'Hynes is playing him the right amount'.

If I followed him for 4 years before he got into the league I would've known how terrible of a skater he is. His skating ability will preclude him from ever being a top 4 defender in my opinion.

 

[Wingman77]

Do I need evidence to think something..?

Ownership is on record saying Taylor Hall is priority #1.

Therefore, I assume ownership wants Shero doing anything barring franchise-destroying moves to keep Hall

Hynes also made mention of the Lightning being a cap team when asked about them when playing them the other day.

On one hand it makes you think if there is something of frustration from him on that topic which he has more knowledge of to the actual workings of Shero and what was really pursued, contrary to what is said to the public or it was just simply a regular comment and nothing further should be read into it. Either way, it was random even bringing it up without it being mentioned by the interviewee(s) and the rest of what he had to say was in regards to the Lightning's play had nothing to do with the cap.

If over more time, it shows that we are operating under an internal cap, we can throw all the money we want at Hall, but with him experiencing this first hand on top of going through losing in Edmonton, you can't disagree with his decision if he decides to play and sign elsewhere. Throwing money at a couple of guys and letting the rest of the lineup consist of cheaper average players and more hoping for diamond in the rough types to appear to help push the team further is something that has happened with plenty of teams across sports and seldom works. You hope this isn't the case once we have more time to evaluate what the deal is with the organization and ownership spending habits.

 

[MadDevil]

If I followed him for 4 years before he got into the league I would've known how terrible of a skater he is. His skating ability will preclude him from ever being a top 4 defender in my opinion.

Why does he have to be a top 4 defenseman? Can't he just be a third pairing/PP guy that puts up 30-40 points a year?

 

[JimEIV]

Why does he have to be a top 4 defenseman? Can't he just be a third pairing/PP guy that puts up 30-40 points a year?

Sure...on a team that has 4 Dmen that can absorb the minutes he leaves on the table at 5v5 every night. That can work very well....but we aren't that team and won't be in the forseeable future...in fact it'll probably get worse in the future with an aging Greene and a green Smith.

 

[MadDevil]

Sure...on a team that has 4 Dmen that can absorb the minutes he leaves on the table at 5v5 every night. That can work very well....but we aren't that team and won't be in the forseeable future...in fact it'll probably get worse in the future with an aging Greene and a green Smith.

So we should get rid of him because the rest of the defense sucks?

 

[JimEIV]

So we should get rid of him because the rest of the defense sucks?

That statement implies that he is not a part of suck equation...He very much is.

 

[My3Sons]

So we should get rid of him because the rest of the defense sucks?

Unless you can protect him there is an argument to be made that he can return a player more in line with what the team needs. Probably an older player close to UFA but a true second pair player. As always it depends upon the specific return to decide if a real world trade is the right one but it’s not hard to connect the dots if Smith impresses management as a player who will Be much better than Butcher in a year or two.

 

[Triumph]

If I followed him for 4 years before he got into the league I would've known how terrible of a skater he is. His skating ability will preclude him from ever being a top 4 defender in my opinion.

So he'll never be a top 4 defender, but somehow he can be an excellent 3rd pairing D at even strength who's played 100 NHL games and taken 4 minor penalties? It almost sounds like this is an arbitrary distinction you've created.

Butcher struggled early on, and if he is nothing more than a 3rd pairing guy, I'd want him traded too. I just think it's remarkably premature to say that.

 

[BenedictGomez]

I'm with the trade Butcher camp. Trade Severson & trade Wood too. None of those three are going to be as good as people currently believe they can/will be in my opinion.

 

[devilsblood]

I'd like to see Butcher get some tougher minutes.

I think there will be times where he will look completely over matched, but I have a feeling his overall #'s, including his goal for #'s will be above water.

But we should give him the oppurtunity.

 

[devilsblood]

I'm with the trade Butcher camp. Trade Severson & trade Wood too. None of those three are going to be as good as people currently believe they can/will be in my opinion.

I think Butcher has proven that, in a certain role, he can be very effective. Whether or not he can do more I don't know but in a certain role he is good.

He's a guy I'd be in no rush to trade, except, the role he is so good in, is pretty much the exact role I expect Smith will be playing next year and probably the year beyond.

 

[JimEIV]

So he'll never be a top 4 defender, but somehow he can be an excellent 3rd pairing D at even strength who's played 100 NHL games and taken 4 minor penalties? It almost sounds like this is an arbitrary distinction you've created.

Butcher struggled early on, and if he is nothing more than a 3rd pairing guy, I'd want him traded too. I just think it's remarkably premature to say that.

Not premature at all. A poor skater will always be a poor skater.

I have never seen a poor skater become even an adequate one. It typically gets worse over time not better... I also don't know of too many 5'10 180 lbs poor skaters with long NHL careers...those are fixed variables that aren't changing.

Those things aren't a matter of experience.

 

[Bleedred]

Just a thought...over the summer there were rumors that the Devils and Hawks were discussing Toews. I don’t remember the source, so it may very well have just been clickbait.

However, in looking around the league, there aren’t many Top6 centers who look to be available. Does anyone think the Hawks would really be motivated to move him? Any interest in adding him for the next four years? I wouldn’t want to make a serious dent in the rebuild and if the price was too high in important prospects and picks I wouldn’t be interested.

If not, who is really out there who could hold down a Top6 C spot that the Devils could acquire? Some have suggested Duchene, but I don’t see him signing here.

The only talk I remember of us being in on Toews was a trade proposal for Schneider for Toews that was suggested on here.

 

[MichaelJ]

The only talk I remember of us being in on Toews was a trade proposal for Schneider for Toews that was suggested on here.

I vaguely remember the conversation around that but I’m almost certain it was started by a rumor/headline/article somewhere else