Daniel Sprong Containment Thread Part 3 | Mod Warning Post #1

[Ogrezilla]

Sprong now has 11 points in 20 games. And to be clear this isn't an indictment against MP. I like him, but Sprong got a raw deal here. Only some here have the courage to acknowledge that. And yes I'm one of those brave souls who do.

If you want to call it a raw deal, sure. But not due to any fault of our management or coaching. He was given a raw deal simply by virtue of playing our deepest position.

 

[Gurglesons]

to be fair, it's 11 in 20 now for Sprong. Solid game yesterday.

It was this morning.

I’d rather have what is looking like a Dumo type with more offensive ability over a fringe top nine forward though.

 

[3074326]

Then show the only stat that matters, win loss before and after. That will be the TKO.

I don't know the actual records, but I know the Pens have been significantly better since the trade and that the Ducks lost a franchise record amount of games in a row.

 

[Ryder71]

And yet, Rust has bounced back and his production for the year (rough 30 games included) is better than Sprong's.

But at the time he was struggling, let's not move the goal posts here.

 

[Ogrezilla]

It was this morning.

I’d rather have what is looking like a Dumo type with more offensive ability over a fringe top nine forward though.

right, naps confuse me.

 

[Gurglesons]

You're an advanced stats guy aren't you?

Not really. But advanced stats is just matching up what occurs in a game and analyzing it so if you don’t give it some weight you’re a f***ing moron.

 

[Ogrezilla]

But at the time he was struggling, let's not move the goal posts here.

So was Sprong.

 

[3074326]

Sprong now has 11 points in 20 games. And to be clear this isn't an indictment against MP. I like him, but Sprong got a raw deal here. Only some here have the courage to acknowledge that. And yes I'm one of those brave souls who do.

Fair.

I still think trading the guy who sucked for us for the guy who hasn't sucked for us is an awesome trade and I'm extremely confused at why people are still complaining about it. It sounds so stupid man.

 

[Ryder71]

You need advanced stats to know that hockey is much more than points?

No, but it's something that many site as the be all.

 

[Ryder71]

So was Sprong.

Was Sprong regularly getting shifts with Sid or Geno though, like Rust got?

Or was Danilel stranded in no mans land on a 4th line getting less than eight mins a game?

 

[Gurglesons]

Was Sprong regularly getting shifts with Sid or Geno though, like Rust got?

Why does this matter? He wasn’t playing in a way that warranted them.

He’s getting those shifts in Anaheim, producing and they are still dropping him to the fourth line when healthy. The only reason he wasn’t playing with Rowney for the third straight game was due to Kase’s injury last game.

 

[Ogrezilla]

Was Sprong regularly getting shifts with Sid or Geno though, like Rust got?

no, because he was playing so badly that it was better to play Rust there or move Simon from LW to RW to play there.

 

[Ryder71]

Fair.

I still think trading the guy who sucked for us for the guy who hasn't sucked for us is an awesome trade and I'm extremely confused at why people are still complaining about it. It sounds so stupid man.

I'm not complaining about the trade as much as I am how Sprong was treated here. I have no issue with MP, just to be clear.

 

[froods]

No, but it's something that many site as the be all.

True

 

[Ryder71]

no, because he was playing so badly that it was better to play Rust there or move Simon from LW to RW to play there.

Hmmm, nah, don't agree with you there. Surprising isn't it?

 

[Ogrezilla]

Hmmm, nah, don't agree with you there. Surprising isn't it?

 

[Ryder71]

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

Once again. That is because he wouldn’t have those opportunities here. We are judging him on his 5v5 production because people continue to try to act like it was a mistake we rode with Rust, Hornqvist, and Kessel.

Not true. As has been pointed out to you before, literally every PP point Sprong's gotten in Anaheim has been on the 2nd unit. The difference is that they're not putting him in the slot like doofuses. Doofi?

The only reason not to include PP production would be if it were on account of PP1 opportunity that he wouldn't have gotten in Pittsburgh. That's not the case.

 

[Ogrezilla]

Not true. As has been pointed out to you before, literally every PP point Sprong's gotten in Anaheim has been on the 2nd unit. The difference is that they're not putting him in the slot like doofuses. Doofi?

The only reason not to include PP production would be if it were on account of PP1 opportunity that he wouldn't have gotten in Pittsburgh. That's not the case.

including PP production is fine, except that it would still mean he has to play on our 4th line most of the time. Is his PP production worth that compared to what we got in a trade?

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

But Rust also scores more at even strength. If Sprong playing with Henrique can't outproduce Rust's PK production, I don't want him with Sidney Crosby or Evgeni Malkin. He's nowhere close to good enough on the powerplay to justify his limitations over our other options. Like I've said, he would need to absolutely blow Rust or Horny's production out of the water to justify playing over them because they are better at literally everything else. And as is, they are also better at producing. Horny just straight up outproduces him, and Rust is dead even for production despite trading PP time for PK time. If Sprong can't outproduce our RW's in his and their current situations, he's not good enough to overcome all of the other ways that our RW's are better than him. Which means he doesn't have a place on this team.

As I said before, that's a false dichotomy. Sprong didn't have to definitely "beat out" Rust or Horny to get regular top 9 RW time here.

Actually, tonight's line-up underlines that fact better than I ever could. We're putting f***ing Kessel on LW.

They were there in limited quantity, yes. We could have given him more of a shot. I would have. But there were reasons not to. Just like there were reasons to trade him. I just don't think he showed enough to feel like he was treated unfairly, and he sure as **** hasn't done enough at this point to make it look like the wrong decision.

They were shitty reasons that didn't benefit the team whatsoever...nothing would have been lost by displacing Rust out of a top 9 RW spot in the 29 games to start the season or Sheahan out of a top 9 spot at any time. But we're talking in circles again.

When Sprong shows that he can do that at a decent level, I'll start to think about whether we made the right move. As is, he scores reasonably well on the powerplay, and badly in the top 6.

As is, Sprong is 3rd in P/60 and 1st in G/60 among all Ducks players who've played more than 10 games.

NHL.com - Stats

I'd rather have Pettersson push Riikola into the press box than have Sprong in the press box. We need the D depth more than the wing depth. With Horny and ZAR both out, I'm still happier with Pettersson over Sprong.

Not I.

I like Pettersson, but Sprong just keeps putting up numbers with very little in the way of help in Anaheim.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

including PP production is fine, except that it would still mean he has to play on our 4th line most of the time. Is his PP production worth that compared to what we got in a trade?

Nope.

 

[Ogrezilla]

As I said before, that's a false dichotomy. Sprong didn't have to definitely "beat out" Rust or Horny to get regular top 9 RW time here.

Actually, tonight's line-up underlines that fact better than I ever could. We're putting ****ing Kessel on LW.

right, with Simon at RW. The 4th RW on our team who is better than Sprong 5v5.

 

[Ogrezilla]

As is, Sprong is 3rd in P/60 and 1st in G/60 among all Ducks players who've played more than 10 games.

NHL.com - Stats

which tells me the Ducks aren't very good at scoring, not that Sprong is very good at scoring. He's okay. Mostly on the PP. Which is fine, but not what we need.

 

[Ogrezilla]

Nope.

sure, has to is strong. But he'd still be our 5th best RW 5v5 if we include Simon. So unless Simon and someone else are at LW, or someone is hurt, Sprong is still on the 4th line. But I'm not promoting Sprong up the line-up at 5v5 because he's a solid 2nd unit PP guy.

 

[Ryder71]

Not really. But advanced stats is just matching up what occurs in a game and analyzing it so if you don’t give it some weight you’re a ****ing moron.

Giving it SOME weight sure, making it the be all, no.