CXLIV - The Tempe era set to begin as ASU opens Mullett Arena

[mouser]

ASU's basketball arena holds 14,000 and turns 50 years old next year.

I'm no rocket surgeon, but having the ability to play MBB games at TED (with WBB/VB in Mullett) during any future renovating/rebuilding their own arena sounds like a very lovely option to have.

Agreed. ASU hasn’t said anything publicly, but Mullett building specs included BB and VB. The Sun Devils have been maxing out at around 3k attendance for WBB and WVB, so permanently hosting them at Mullet could be an option assuming scheduling works with the other university sports. If WBB attendance picks up in the future, the occasional big game at TED could be scheduled.

Without WBB/WVB, the reming ASU Desert Financial arena usage is: MBB, office space, university events like commencements. The arena is no longer used for concerts or other touring acts.

Office space is readily available in other university facilities. Mullet and other facilities can probably handle most if not all individual college commencements, with the possible exception of the once a year full university commencement going to TED.

That leaves us just with MBB, which has been running somewhere around 10k attendance in recent years. Moving MBB to TED and redeveloping the ASU arena site into something other than an arena would have to be an option ASU would strongly consider. The university arena is located in a prime location for redevelopment.

 

[Tom ServoMST3K]

This franchise cannot catch a break when it comes to off-ice stuff. Not great timing here.

 

[BKIslandersFan]

This franchise cannot catch a break when it comes to off-ice stuff. Not great timing here.

Well hes a minority owner. Not the first sports team owner to be arrested.

 

[Tom ServoMST3K]

Well hes a minority owner. Not the first sports team owner to be arrested.

I personally wouldn't let this affect my vote one way or another on a hockey team I rooted for, nor does it mean the majority owner is also in trouble...

but it's not exactly a ringing endorsement of the organization as they head into a key referendum.

Awful PR for the franchise, which doesn't need any more PR losses.

 

[Major4Boarding]

Let’s keep the Barroway situation contained in the other thread, please… until further notice.

Thank you all

 

[Llama19]

Honest mistake...or backup plan...hmmm...

Source: www.tempe.gov/government/city-clerk-s-office/election-information/august-1-2023-special-election

 

[MNNumbers]

Honest mistake...or backup plan...hmmm...

View attachment 677567

Source: www.tempe.gov/government/city-clerk-s-office/election-information/august-1-2023-special-election

That's weird. Those are all different numbers that in the May 16 listing.

 

[AZDesertKnight]

That's weird. Those are all different numbers that in the May 16 listing.

Yeah, that's odd

 

[Llama19]

The August Prop numbers were suppose to be the original ones...as Meruelo and company did not want to wait that long...hence the signature drive...to get it on the May ballot instead...

 

[TheLegend]

^^^^ Not exactly the entire story. But I’m not going to waste time nitpicking it.

But this is possibly an error on MariCo’s end. They process the elections.

And it’s not a backup plan for Meruelo because that doesn’t involve Tempe at all as I understand it.

But…. just had the thought that the Tempe1st group might have also had their own signature petition drive and this may have been the result. They started much later and could have submitted a competing referendum.

 

[blueandgoldguy]

So what is the feeling on the ground in Tempe regarding the outcome of the referendum? Is the public slightly in favor or slightly opposed to this proposal? 50-50? Has there been a poll conducted or is there one that will be conducted leading up to the vote?

 

[Tom ServoMST3K]

So what is the feeling on the ground in Tempe regarding the outcome of the referendum? Is the public slightly in favor or slightly opposed to this proposal? 50-50? Has there been a poll conducted or is there one that will be conducted leading up to the vote?

The Legend cited a 60-40 poll to me in another thread, but I haven't seen it to judge if it's reasonable or not - do you have a link to that @TheLegend ?

 

[TheLegend]

The Legend cited a 60-40 poll to me in another thread, but I haven't seen it to judge if it's reasonable or not - do you have a link to that @TheLegend ?

They had two internal poll showing 60%+ positive response.

But… just came across this.

Looks like Sky Harbor wasn’t as happy as they led people to believe at the last meeting.

Haven’t read it entirely yet. But I shouldn’t be surprised.

City of Phoenix Aviation Department Files Legal Action Against Tempe | Phoenix Sky Harbor International Airport

Stay informed about the latest news and developments from Phoenix Sky Harbor International Airport. Read our press releases for the most current information.

www.skyharbor.com

 

[TheLegend]

More…

City of Phoenix suing Tempe for development that includes Coyotes arena

The City of Phoenix announced on Tuesday that its aviation department is filing legal action against the city of Tempe.

arizonasports.com

Sky Harbor (Phoenix) is only objecting to the housing. No mention of the Coyotes at all. They’re playing the PR game in this.

 

[BattleBorn]

Many airports have an obligation to upgrade sound deadening to residences within a boundary where certain noise levels are expected. They likely have to make an effort to stop residential construction within the zones or they could potentially be on the hook for whatever some court or whatever standards set forth decides they’re obligated to do in the future for these residences.

However, planes are quieter now that they were in the past and that will likely continue as time goes on and tech develops.

However, when Mr. and Mrs. Milquetoast decide they can’t live with the noise in their condo in TED and decide to sniff around the DoA for some new soundproof windows in 10 years, the airport can say they’re not on the hook. I wonder if the resolution is that they wind up just adding notes to the deeds making it clear that the residence is in a high airport noise area.

 

[TheLegend]

Many airports have an obligation to upgrade sound deadening to residences within a boundary where certain noise levels are expected. They likely have to make an effort to stop residential construction within the zones or they could potentially be on the hook for whatever some court or whatever standards set forth decides they’re obligated to do in the future for these residences.

However, planes are quieter now that they were in the past and that will likely continue as time goes on and tech develops.

However, when Mr. and Mrs. Milquetoast decide they can’t live with the noise in their condo in TED and decide to sniff around the DoA for some new soundproof windows in 10 years, the airport can say they’re not on the hook. I wonder if the resolution is that they wind up just adding notes to the deeds making it clear that the residence is in a high airport noise area.

The FAA has ruled Meruelo can’t use government funding to mitigate the noise because of the zone it sits in.

Arizona has some pretty binding disclosure laws in that a developer has to advise you of everything around the property you purchase.

The DDA includes a clause where Meruelo covers any (and all) litigation involving noise complaints (it was a concession he made to the airport).

The director of the Phoenix Aviation Department stood up at the council meeting declaring Sky Harbor no longer had any objections.

So what’s changed?

 

[Fatass]

The FAA has ruled Meruelo can’t use government funding to mitigate the noise because of the zone it sits in.

Arizona has some pretty binding disclosure laws in that a developer has to advise you of everything around the property you purchase.

The DDA includes a clause where Meruelo covers any (and all) litigation involving noise complaints (it was a concession he made to the airport).

The director of the Phoenix Aviation Department stood up at the council meeting declaring Sky Harbor no longer had any objections.

So what’s changed?

So this is a good thing right? The Coyotes have guaranteed they will cover any noise litigation against the airport. There can’t be any more stumbling blocks, can there? The vote has to go through now. When can the arena start being built? Summer?

 

[BattleBorn]

The FAA has ruled Meruelo can’t use government funding to mitigate the noise because of the zone it sits in.

Arizona has some pretty binding disclosure laws in that a developer has to advise you of everything around the property you purchase.

The DDA includes a clause where Meruelo covers any (and all) litigation involving noise complaints (it was a concession he made to the airport).

The director of the Phoenix Aviation Department stood up at the council meeting declaring Sky Harbor no longer had any objections.

So what’s changed?

Probably need a court to say they're off the hook to make sure all the bases are covered once the people making agreements and concessions have moved on/politics have changed enough or the concessions/agreements get challenged in court. It's what I'd want if I was a DoA exec had the best interests of the airport in mind.

 

[TheLegend]

So this is a good thing right? The Coyotes have guaranteed they will cover any noise litigation against the airport. There can’t be any more stumbling blocks, can there? The vote has to go through now. When can the arena start being built? Summer?

Honestly I don’t think they (Phoenix) want the district built because it would directly compete with them.

Much in like Glendale aired all the dirty laundry out back when they opted out of the year to year lease after the Coyotes refused to be locked in for another 15-20 years.

Have to believe this is evolving into an economic turf war.

 

[TheLegend]

PR sparring is underway…

 

[Llama19]

I dislike when web sites are re-designed...

Proposed Tempe Entertainment District

New Link: www.skyharbor.com/about-phx/noise-and-flight-paths/tempe-entertainment-district

NEW - On March 17, 2023 the Phoenix City Manager, Jeff Barton received two letters from Tempe City Manager, Andrew Ching.

One letter stated that Tempe will not yet affirm their support for the near-term infrastructure investments contained in Sky Harbor’s CAMP (Comprehensive Asset Management Program).

Why is this significant? The proposed Tempe Entertainment District and Modera developments include thousands of residential units directly under the flight path and within the 65 DNL noise contour. It is well documented that people living in 65 DNL high noise contours directly adjacent to airports and under flight paths grow tired of and seek relief from aircraft noise and begin to file complaints which call for constraining airport capacity and growth. Given Tempe is willfully authorizing residential development in this area, it is appropriate and reasonable that Tempe’s position with respect to the airport be formally conveyed along with assurances that they will continue to support airport development when faced with expected opposition from these residents. In an attempt to resolve this with Tempe, Phoenix participated in a Tempe Council Work Session on February 9th.

In another letter Tempe stated they could not commit to prohibiting future residential development inside the 65 DNL noise contour until they had completed their own noise contour map – even though Phoenix provided Tempe with a letter from the FAA that removes all ambiguity as to their approval of the 2019 noise contours as the official Sky Harbor noise contours.

Why is this significant? Encroachment and incompatible development must be addressed to protect the long-term future of Sky Harbor. Differing interpretations of the plain language contained the IGA between the two cities are at the heart of our dispute. Rather than proceed with protracted and costly litigation to resolve our dispute as is contemplated in the IGA, Phoenix sought to resolve this by coming to an administrative agreement that Tempe either take no future actions to permit incompatible development in this 1.2 square mile section of land, or to resolve our dispute through another form of administrative process such as binding arbitration.

Phoenix was disappointed to receive these two letters from Tempe. We relied on Tempe to act on a negotiated solution.

NEW - On March 28, 2023, the City of Phoenix Aviation Department filed a formal complaint in Maricopa County Superior Court. The City of Phoenix Aviation Department is suing Tempe for breach of contract, asking the court to rescind Tempe’s recent zoning and land use changes and prohibit future residential uses in an area the FAA says is incompatible with residential development. See the Department’s press release for additional information. The complaint also includes multiple exhibits. See those here.

 

[TheLegend]

Nice catch Llama… and yeah I agree… they all need to stop playing around with their websites…

So I take it there was more talk going on between the two cities after the council meeting last November but somehow Phoenix wasn’t satisfied with what they got.

But why aren’t there links to the letters? I can’t just take their word for it because they’ve stretched the truth in regards to the IGA before.

(Edit) Oh wait…. I see a link to exhibits.
(Yikes… 212 pages)

 

[PredsHead]

Here's the complaint: (Sorry didn't see your link above Llama)
DocumentCloud

 

[Llama19]

Here's the complaint: (Sorry didn't see your link above Llama)
DocumentCloud

In summary...it is...and has always been...IMO...about the housing...
within the 65 dB corridor...everything else is AOK...
but...
Meruelo cannot get the ROI that he needs...without the housing...

 

[PredsHead]

In summary...it is...and has always been...IMO...about the housing...
within the 65 dB corridor...everything else is AOK...
but...
Meruelo cannot get the ROI that he needs...without the housing...

That certainly has been their message from the start. Agree on housing, one would have to assume that the housing is the biggest driver in this plan as the number of units kept growing and growing.