Samsies, we are very much on the opposite side of this. I am well aware of the damage a prolonged shutdown will have, I still think it is worth it to save as many lives as possible. When peoples lives become expendable to the all mighty dollar and the stock market, I have a fundamental problem with that.
People's lives are not expendable. Nor are the livelihoods of small businesses, which you conveniently leave out focusing instead on "the mighty dollar and the stock market". I have a fundamental problem with that.
Really? is that how the economy works? Guess I had no idea being a small business (have the LLC filings to prove it). I make my living depending on people to have disposable income to spend on luxuries like art. Trust me, I am not ignorant enough to not realize that the first thing people cut back on when money is tight is discretionary spending. Spare me your economics lesson.
Just as soon as you spare me your sanctimonious crap.
You seem to have this idea "Oh well nothing we can do, just gonna have to open back up and hope too many people dont die" when you know full well that there is an option for businesses to stay closed and the federal government provides aid and services to keep them afloat. It is not a open and hope to not spread the virus too much or stay closed and go bankrupt. there is a large swath in between for some wiggle room that you are just flat out unwilling to accept. Is there money to keep everything closed indefinitely, nope. But we certainly have the funds to keep things closed past May.
You are going to have to look long and hard to find ANYWHERE where I alluded to "there's nothing that we can do".
I never said that the federal government cannot try to keep them afloat. What do you believe that SBA loans are? What I said that the government cannot keep the afloat for an extremely prolonged period of time. And once entire industries begin getting wiped out, there comes a point where none of it is kept afloat.
Some states are staying closed past May. Some are not. My view is that it cannot go on for much longer.
It is easy to say to open movie theaters back up, attendees can socially distance at the theaters. But what about the workers who will still have to deal with dozens, if not hundreds of people, interacting with, and cleaning up after to make barely above minimum wage. Those employees whether you like it or not are putting their lives at risk to earn $10 an hour for other people to have fun at a movie. And some of those employees have at risk parents, they may be at risk themselves. You keep ignoring this point, but people should not have to be making the choice between going to work and putting themselves and the ones they love at risk just so they can keep a roof over their heads.
You do understand once those businesses are allowed to open, and they do decide to open, those furloughed employees HAVE to come back to work right? And if they do not they will be fired and no longer eligible for unemployment. Boy, what a choice that is. My store is opening back up, I have to either go to work and put myself at risk or I lose my job and lose my ability to earn unemployment. If you think that is a choice, we have a fundamental difference on what choice means.
I am not ignoring any point. I am acknowledging it. I am also acknowledging the fact that unemployment benefits only last so long and tend to run out much faster in times when there is an incredible level of people out of jobs. You keep avoiding that reality. The country cannot sustain a third of it's population not working. In order to fund these benefits, the government needs tax revenue. If there is no tax revenue, there is no cash. Of course, the government can also stop spending money (something neither political party will do). What do you think the reaction would be when entitlement programs are cut so that more cash can be diverted to carry the small businesses?
For the upteenth time, if people want to return to work and the government has declared it is reasonably safe to do so (reductions in cases for 10 straight days...which btw no state has met, let alone a reduction in 2 or 3 days) they can. but if people for whatever reason do not want to return to work for fears/concerns they should have the option to stay home and still get some assistance. People should not have to choose between the health of themselves and their loved ones and putting food on the table. PERIOD.
Here we go again. There is only so much money for so many for benefits. PERIOD.
Why do you believe you are seeing demonstrations? Do you think people have just nothing to do?
You know and I know the first people back are predominately going to be low income workers, and they will be returning to work because they are desperate to make ends meet mostly instead of because they want to. It is not morally right or fair to put the those less well off to be on the front lines of this recovery, potentially putting their health and lives at risk just so our economy can keep chugging along.
You have repeatedly thrown up roadblocks to solutions like this. I never said it was a simple wave a magic wand thing, but it is a solution that would help far more people than the pain it would cause to mortgage lenders. Sorry, everyone should have some skin in this game, banks and mortgage lenders should not be above making some sacrifices for the greater good to help keep people in their homes and keep the economy moving. They could institute some sort of incentive for people that can keep their payments as usual to keep those lenders and brokers still working, but allowing people that could really use a 1 year suspension to take advantage of it. There is always room for negotiation and a middle ground, it is not black and white absolutes.
You and I also know that the economic effects will hit those people the hardest. This is not about being moral or fair. This is about reality. You seem to live in an idealistic world where there is a magical pile of money that can never be depleted so naturally the government can just keep people afloat forever. I do not have the luxury of being idealistic. The economic imperative is well documented. Economic suicide is not normal behavior.
You are going to have a renter suspend his livelihood for a year? How does that work?
Sure there are ways to try to make things better, but this is not some sort of utopia. And the staggering amount of employment and small businesses that go under under and never return will have ramifications that you are choosing to ignore.
I get that you are concerned for how the economy will look at the end of this, I am too. I depend on people have discretionary spending to survive, but you are repeatedly insinuating that the greater economy as a whole is more important than the health and safety of the people living in it. And you can think of me as a POS for saying it. But statements like that, to me, are not very empathetic.
I have friends who are on the front lines, I have friends who are not collecting pay checks.
Over the longer term, the health and safety of people will depend on a greater economy.
What I have seen is what other nations have done to protect its citizens and businesses and by and large they are all doing more than what we are willing to do for our citizens. We have enacted large scale funding programs and stimulus for our citizens before (the new deal) and it changed the lives for all americans, but it seems to me the political will to do it just inst there anymore. Instead of tax cuts for the rich, we should be giving services to the poor and middle class, so they have the money they need to spend on the economy, making it grow benefiting rich and poor alike
I know its a typo of yours but, "America can take care of its one people" perfectly exemplifies america and its interests. We are an oligarchy that has corporate socialism for the rich. Banks need a bailout, okay. Airlines, oil and gas, car manufacturers you name it, if you are a large industry/employer and you need saving we they United States government are here for you.
For the rest of us, its rugged individualism "pull yourself up by your bootstraps no gov handouts" sucks to be you
Oy vey. Cannot really respond to this as it would stray towards the political.
