Connor Bedard or Jack Hughes?

[Happyhary9]

I will just say there's a reason all the best puck transporters are world class skaters. Eichel, McDavid, Mackinnon, Hughes, Stutzle, Barzal, Point etc. Young Crosby was dynamite through the neutral zone but after that high ankle sprain he lost a step and I don't think he ever recovered.

Ya and Bedard is like Crosby as a skater. Bedard and Crosby coming into the NHL are about the same top end speed, Crosby maybe a hair faster. But supposedly Bedard has added strength/speed in the offseason, but we ha e to see that in a game still. Crosby/Bedard skating is very similar. Both had strong lower bodies and short explosive strides. People have for some reason really underrated Bedards top end speed. Yes it is not elite like those guys but he is still very fast and can carry the puck at full speed. Bedard is also like Crosby in that he likes to dictate pace and then use speed when needed or he gets a guy set up.

 

[Filthy Dangles]

Bedard doesn't project to be a puck carrying center like Hughes, as he lacks Hughes' skating ability. Bedard obviously has the better shot, but I also think he has the better overall hockey sense. Not that Hughes lacks hockey sense, but Bedard sees the ice like Kucherov.

I think the difference in their skating and shooting will more or less net out, but I give the edge to Bedard because of that hockey sense.

But as I said earlier, there is still a lot of risk with Bedard, and it's almost certain that Hughes' contract will be a much better value.

Not really or at least to me. Jack Hughes had 21 points, 31 points in first two seasons. Then barely PPG in 3rd season albeit shortened one for him. Obviously last year was his coming out party.

Bedard should crush Hughes when we look back and compare first 3 seasons. And unless he ends up being a notable disappointment he should be near or eclipse the 100 point mark in his prime in this scoring environment.

 

[FDBluth]

Certainly, and it was the aspect I was referring to. Perhaps I should have been more clear in my comment. Bedard is an extremely effective o-zone puck carrier, using his quickness and balance extremely well. His lateral mobility is really fantastic.

But the ability to transport the puck across all three zones is really what I meant to highlight, and it's an incredibly important part of the game, especially for centers. Bedard will be an elite o-zone puck carrier, but I don't think he will an elite transporter.

You're gonna be in for a surprise when you watch him in the NHL. Will he have elite speed? No. Will he have elite "transporting" ability? Yes. He's just so good at executing plays, so good at reading defenses, and so good in tight places. And he's not slow.

 

[Filthy Dangles]

I will just say there's a reason all the best puck transporters are world class skaters. Eichel, McDavid, Mackinnon, Hughes, Stutzle, Barzal, Point etc. Young Crosby was dynamite through the neutral zone but after that high ankle sprain he lost a step and I don't think he ever recovered.

I think you underrate his skating ability quite a bit. It's an asset for sure and I think he's gonna be one of the better players at carrying it zone to zone in the league by using the sum of his tools, rather than just skating by someone like MCDavid for example.

Also, if you look the top scorers in the league year to year and esp last year, a lot of names who's skating ability isn't what stands out in their game, so you seem to be putting a little too much emphasis on raw skating ability on top of underrating Bedards' personal ability, imo.

 

[Coffee]

Hence why the post you quoted referenced the "safer" choice as an option.

That can be taken out of context and it has been clearly in this thread

 

[thefutures]

Imagine comparing laughreniere to bedard and thinking you made some gotcha point. Lmfao

 

[WarriorofTime]

I will just say there's a reason all the best puck transporters are world class skaters. Eichel, McDavid, Mackinnon, Hughes, Stutzle, Barzal, Point etc. Young Crosby was dynamite through the neutral zone but after that high ankle sprain he lost a step and I don't think he ever recovered.

Where do people get off that Bedard is a weaker skater?

 

[FDBluth]

I think you underrate his skating ability quite a bit. It's an asset for sure and I think he's gonna be one of the better players at carrying it zone to zone in the league by using the sum of his tools, rather than just skating by someone like MCDavid for example.

Also, if you look the top scorers in the league year to year and esp last year, a lot of names who's skating ability isn't what stands out in their game, so you seem to be putting a little too much emphasis on raw skating ability on top of underrating Bedards' personal ability, imo.

Bunch of examples of his neutral zone ability from one session.

Example:
Example :
Example:
Example:
Example:

 

[x Tame Impala]

Hughes has the potential to be a top 5 scorer in the league. Bedard has the potential to be 2nd only to McDavid.

Hughes is quickly becoming one of my favorite players in the league but people saying Hughes over Bedard, even for contract purposes, is most likely going to look pretty foolish in the next few seasons at least. Maybe even by this season.

I’m rooting for the Devils to win a Cup and for Hughes to win the Smythe, but this is Bedard.

 

[WarriorofTime]

Bunch of examples of his neutral zone ability from one session.

Example:
Example :
Example:
Example:
Example:

Yep, and about a dozen more from last year's World Juniors, which is about as "up and down" an event as it goes.

 

[Ezekial]

Jack Hughes right now maybe that changes within the next few months, IDK. But I know what I'm getting from Jack Hughes and for how much at this point

 

[Coffee]

Yep, and about a dozen more from last year's World Juniors, which is about as "up and down" an event as it goes.

A bit off topic but since Lafreniere was mentioned

Rangers should have listened to you and paid a premium for a depth player on a fantastic contract.

I wonder how many years they have with the core at their very best

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

Not really or at least to me. Jack Hughes had 21 points, 31 points in first two seasons. Then barely PPG in 3rd season albeit shortened one for him. Obviously last year was his coming out party.

Barely PPG? He had 26g 56p in only 49gp on a very poor Devils team, that's a 44g 94p pace. Not too far off his pace this year on a much better Devils team.

This is the list of centers who scored primary points at a higher rate than 20 year old Jack Hughes in 2021-22:

Auston Matthews
Connor McDavid
Leon Draisaitl
Nathan MacKinnon
Steven Stamkos
Aleksander Barkov

Bedard should crush Hughes when we look back and compare first 3 seasons. And unless he ends up being a notable disappointment he should be near or eclipse the 100 point mark in his prime in this scoring environment.

There is very little doubt that Bedard will have a better first 2 years than Hughes. Bedard is far and away more physically mature than Hughes was at 18. 19 year old Hughes was actually pretty awesome before he got COVID - he had 5 goals 8 points in his first 9 games of the year and then COVID got him and lost a bunch of weight. In the 25 games after returning from COVID, he only had 7 points.

You're gonna be in for a surprise when you watch him in the NHL. Will he have elite speed? No. Will he have elite "transporting" ability? Yes. He's just so good at executing plays, so good at reading defenses, and so good in tight places. And he's not slow.

Who said he was slow? I have always compared his skating to that of Brad Marchand. Elite edges, quickness, balance, and lateral mobility, with great top speed as well. He will still absolutely be a great transporter when he's got even a bit of time and space, but I don't expect him to be able to break away from backchecking pressure the way guys like McDavid, Mackinnon, Eichel, Hughes, and Barzal can. In the very common scenario where he's taking a breakout pass out of his own zone and there is a backchecker in his backpocket, he's not going to be able to create the sort of separation those guys can.

I think you underrate his skating ability quite a bit. It's an asset for sure and I think he's gonna be one of the better players at carrying it zone to zone in the league by using the sum of his tools, rather than just skating by someone like MCDavid for example.

In most scenarios, he will be an elite puck transporter. But in the scenario I described above, where he needs to create separation quickly (and maintain it), he's not going to be on the same level as the elite.

Also, if you look the top scorers in the league year to year and esp last year, a lot of names who's skating ability isn't what stands out in their game, so you seem to be putting a little too much emphasis on raw skating ability on top of underrating Bedards' personal ability, imo.

Transporting the puck is an incredibly important skill, even if it doesn't always show up on the scoresheet

Where do people get off that Bedard is a weaker skater?

Bedard is not a weak skater relative to the rest of the league. But in terms of speed he's not going to be in the elite class of skaters. But his edges, quickness, balance, and lateral mobility are all already world class.

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

Ya and Bedard is like Crosby as a skater. Bedard and Crosby coming into the NHL are about the same top end speed, Crosby maybe a hair faster. But supposedly Bedard has added strength/speed in the offseason, but we ha e to see that in a game still. Crosby/Bedard skating is very similar. Both had strong lower bodies and short explosive strides. People have for some reason really underrated Bedards top end speed. Yes it is not elite like those guys but he is still very fast and can carry the puck at full speed. Bedard is also like Crosby in that he likes to dictate pace and then use speed when needed or he gets a guy set up.

They definitely have a lot of skating similarities, but Crosby was for sure faster as a 17/18 year old. His top end speed was pretty incredible before that high ankle sprain. Crosby also had the better balance and strength on the puck.

As stated earlier, his skating is most similar to that of prime Brad Marchand. Nobody would ever call Marchand slow but he was never among the top 10 fastest skaters in the game.

 

[Arthur Morgan]

Yes because he will generate far more revenue in his market than Hughes in his. Hence why within a day of being drafted, the Blackhawks sold “$5.2 million in new ticket packages including 1200 full season packages.” Before you come at me with the salary cap and on ice performance, you need to remember that off ice influence is factored into contracts as well.

No its all about the cap. winning generates more money too and Jack Hughes + 5-6m for the rest of your team while Hughes is already a 100 point C imo is worth having over Bedard. you can argue Bedard when Hughes signed his next contract but no doubt taking Hughes is likely the better path to success

 

[Happyhary9]

They definitely have a lot of skating similarities, but Crosby was for sure faster as a 17/18 year old. His top end speed was pretty incredible before that high ankle sprain. Crosby also had the better balance and strength on the puck.

As stated earlier, his skating is most similar to that of prime Brad Marchand. Nobody would ever call Marchand slow but he was never among the top 10 fastest skaters in the game.

Bedard skating at 17 much better then Marchand as in even close.

People seem to want to compare Crosby skating in NHL vs Bedard skating in WHL. Remember that both of these kids were also some of the youngest players in their drafts. Both of them didn't even turn 18 until after they were drafted. One year from 17 to 18 matters a lot.

 

[Roomtemperature]

Actually wouldnt bedard give you the better chance to win in the next few years at a 900 k caphit? Bedard should be hitting the ground running, all generational prospects do

Depends how fast Bedard gets to speed. Jack is at that speed.... I'm think it will take Bedard two years to get to somewhat his potential if he is all that and a bag of chips. Also Jack has a pretty good contract for what he is gonna to do

 

[BlueDream]

Bedard in one of the easiest choices ever.

 

[Despote]

For EDM definitely Bedard because that ELC is just too sweet to pass up.

 

[FDBluth]

Who said he was slow? I have always compared his skating to that of Brad Marchand. Elite edges, quickness, balance, and lateral mobility, with great top speed as well. He will still absolutely be a great transporter when he's got even a bit of time and space, but I don't expect him to be able to break away from backchecking pressure the way guys like McDavid, Mackinnon, Eichel, Hughes, and Barzal can. In the very common scenario where he's taking a breakout pass out of his own zone and there is a backchecker in his backpocket, he's not going to be able to create the sort of separation those guys can.

That doesn't really matter because he can create separation in different ways. And he has great agility. I reaaalllly hesitate to compare anyone to Gretzky but he has some of those qualities in his skating and just overall ability that transcend top speed.

If you really want to pigeonhole your argument to such a narrow point that "he won't be able to create as much separation as the absolute best skaters in the NHL in a breakout when he gets a pass at X and Y" then be my guest. It doesn't really matter because of all of the other tools that he has.

 

[Panthaz89]

No, but I get more personal enjoyment out of the team winning games than I do out of the team making money. I don't think that's a unique position.

That might not be true for you, I guess. It's not impossible you get your enjoyment from people who aren't you making money.

I don't get how you can't win games paying Bedard more the Oilers have no problem being a contender with McDavid or making it far its thanks to Nurse's contract not McDavids that they can't completely fill out a big lineup. Pittsburgh won mainly due to Crosby and Malkin carrying around a bunch of meh most of the time Crosby and Ovechkin can let you get away with barely spending much on the rest of the lineup.

 

[TLEH]

Guy hasn't even played an NHL game yet and is already making 13-15m after his ELC. Incredible.

 

[TheDoorDoctor]

Lol the hypocrisy. I’m old enough to remember when 70 percent of people thought Lafreniere was the better prospect than Hughes.

I’ve always been a Hughes defender but this is clearly Bedard. Hughes always projected as 100 point franchise centre. Bedard projects as a near generational player.

Waw you were around when people thought Laf was a better prospect than Hughes?! What are dinosaurs like?

 

[Nabrules]

Waw you were around when people thought Laf was a better prospect than Hughes?! What are dinosaurs like?

Seems like ages ago when people thought one of the most overrated prospects coming out of the draft was better than Hughes!

 

[LeapOnOver]

How is that close?

Tavares >> Yakupov as a prospect.
Whereas it's Bedard >> Hughes as a prospect. And also Ovechkin >> Kovalchuk.

What you're describing is the opposite scenario. Weaker prospect and not yet proven. Absolutely no reason to not pick Tavares above him.

Kovalchuk/Hughes both pretty strong #1 overall picks, both looking very promising in career to date entering their age 22 seasons.....vs Ovechkin/Bedard - generational prospects with all the hype in the world, but no NHL games yet, only about to enter their rookie season.

My parallel makes sense - yours doesn't.

No, you just forget the hype around Yakupov.