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Player Discussion Charlie McAvoy IV

Dr Hook

Dr Hook

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Dennis Bonvie said:
So objective opinion is an oxymoron?

I'm playing the age (old) card here.

How about an unbiased opinion? Maybe that's what I'm trying to say. Eminently fair. That's it.
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So if someone disagrees with you, they are biased? Setting yourself up to be right no matter what happens eh? :laugh:
 
Dennis Bonvie

Dennis Bonvie

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Dr Hook said:
I'm sorry but I disagree, and we'll have to leave it at that. I am not going to get into a stats-picking contest over this. I think they are both great players and I think based on my viewing that McAvoy is a better defender than Fox. You don't and that's okay- it's not like they will be traded for one another any time in the next decade :)
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No problem.
 
Dennis Bonvie

Dennis Bonvie

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Dr Hook said:
So if someone disagrees with you, they are biased? Setting yourself up to be right no matter what happens eh? :laugh:
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Didn't say anyone was biased.

Just that I am not.

If that sets me up to be right no matter what, well, don't we all think we are right no matter what?
 
Dr Hook

Dr Hook

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Dennis Bonvie said:
Didn't say anyone was biased.

Just that I am not.

If that sets me up to be right no matter what, well, don't we all think we are right no matter what?
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Of course we do or we wouldn't have an opinion on anything. I am open to changing my mind as these guys progress in their young careers. Right now I don't see it like you do, but Fox can make a believer out of me or Mac can make a believer out of you. Who knows. I don't have a dog in the hunt as far as who is better here, because I think that is a totally subjective thing as well, particularly when you are talking about guys that occupy a pretty elite strata of the game.
 
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Dennis Bonvie

Dennis Bonvie

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Dr Hook said:
Of course we do or we wouldn't have an opinion on anything. I am open to changing my mind as these guys progress in their young careers. Right now I don't see it like you do, but Fox can make a believer out of me or Mac can make a believer out of you. Who knows. I don't have a dog in the hunt as far as who is better here, because I think that is a totally subjective thing as well, particularly when you are talking about guys that occupy a pretty elite strata of the game.
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I don't like to say much about what happens in the future. No crystal ball. Too many times being completely wrong about what will happen next.
 
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burstnbloom

burstnbloom

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Dennis Bonvie said:
McAvoy is up ice way more than Fox. On the PP he gets burnt by breakaways more often, usually by his own reckless play. Fox averages more PK time per game. Fox takes the puck away more than he gives it away. McAvoy gives it away 3 times as much as he takes it away.
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Despite all that, his team pumps his opponents with regularity in shots, chances xG and goals. These are anecdotal observations that are skewing how you're evaluating these two players. They are VERY similar players that look different getting similar results. Fox may play more on the PK but his results are poor. It's one of the only real weaknesses in his game. McAvoy, on the other hand, is one of the best PK players on earth.

I just think people's eyes really lie to them a lot. Fox and McAvoy look really different on the ice. McAvoy is a physical specimen, he's loud on the defensive end of the ice and while he's graceful, there is a noiseyness to the way he plays the game. Fox is slick as hell and everything about his game is graceful. He's a quiet player who has a charismatic game. Depending on your perspective, you're going to draw conclusions based on your own biases as to who is "better" when really you're just saying which style you prefer.

That's why I like the data models so much. They don't give a shit what players look like. It takes all bias out of the equation and just tells you what happens. When you just look at what happens, these two guys look really similar and arguing which one you want seems silly.

I'll take McAvoy for the sole reason that they are the same age and Chuck has 1 more year on his deal. That's it. Don't think there is much differentiating either guy beyond that.
 
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BigBadBruins7708

BigBadBruins7708

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burstnbloom said:
Despite all that, his team pumps his opponents with regularity in shots, chances xG and goals. These are anecdotal observations that are skewing how you're evaluating these two players. They are VERY similar players that look different getting similar results. Fox may play more on the PK but his results are poor. It's one of the only real weaknesses in his game. McAvoy, on the other hand, is one of the best PK players on earth.

I just think people's eyes really lie to them a lot. Fox and McAvoy look really different on the ice. McAvoy is a physical specimen, he's loud on the defensive end of the ice and while he's graceful, there is a noiseyness to the way he plays the game. Fox is slick as hell and everything about his game is graceful. He's a quiet player who has a charismatic game. Depending on your perspective, you're going to draw conclusions based on your own biases as to who is "better" when really you're just saying which style you prefer.

That's why I like the data models so much. They don't give a shit what players look like. It takes all bias out of the equation and just tells you what happens. When you just look at what happens, these two guys look really similar and arguing which one you want seems silly.

I'll take McAvoy for the sole reason that they are the same age and Chuck has 1 more year on his deal. That's it. Don't think there is much differentiating either guy beyond that.
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No, he plays with the 2 best PK players on the earth...big difference
 
RussellmaniaKW

RussellmaniaKW

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still on a 55 point pace but it's funny how when you hear pundits around the league talk about him they downplay his offense b/c he's not a PPG player like Makar or Fox. 50+ points with his all around, all-situations game is pretty insane.
 
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chizzler

chizzler

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I wasn’t thrilled with his new contract, but I gotta say, he’s is getting better and better. He’s the only one that can hit and be clean in doing so. Great hip checker. His confidence is evident. Great to see. Bruins always have that cornerstone Dman. Hopefully he keeps getting better. He’ll wear a C eventually.
 
DKH

DKH

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Dennis Bonvie said:
I think Fox has been substantially better than Charlie this season.
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Different type of teams and styles and I’m not surprised some would pick Fox and some McAvoy.

I watch the Rangers quite a bit and Fox is a stud but if I would not trade McAvoy for Fox.

He like Swayman fit the team style I like and although born other places fit in this area
 
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Dennis Bonvie

Dennis Bonvie

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Bam Bam Rubble said:
Different type of teams and styles and I’m not surprised some would pick Fox and some McAvoy.

I watch the Rangers quite a bit and Fox is a stud but if I would not trade McAvoy for Fox.

He like Swayman fit the team style I like and although born other places fit in this area
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Have you been waiting for the right time since I posted that (January 25) to respond?
 
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