Proposal: Chariot and Jake Allen to Leafs

[Mike Dukarm]

No, they really won't... because they won't have to.

If the Leafs want Chiarot, it'll be their 2nd round pick, plus some other, lesser asset. Maybe it's a prospect excluding Knies/Niemla/Robertson; maybe it's Travis Dermott or Justin Holl... obviously at that point you're getting into splitting hairs, and MTLs pro scouting will be the determinant of who they like.

Habs would take a 1st or a prospect wuth that value.

Dermott or Holl: Habs wont take them... Habs want to make room for the number of contract....
I dont think the prospects you name would do it the for Habs GM.

So no 1st, no Chiarot for Toronto... Toronto is not the only one Habs can take an offer.

The best offer will win Chiarot, so i dont think what you offer from Toronto would win Chiarot

 

[Goldenhands]

"Fairness" has no real place in trades -- only being in the best interest of both teams.

It would be an incredibly STUPID deal for the Leafs to do, giving up 2 pieces of greater quality than either Chiarot or Allen would be able to garner on their own.

The concept of giving up your first round pick for a rental like Chiarot, or a backup-swap in Allen is colossally stupid. The concept of giving up Knies (who IMO is worth more than the Leafs 1st this year), even more ridiculous. The idea that the Leafs should trade both to do that deal, is something that Dubas should get fired for.

Alright, he will get fired for doing nothing instead and Leafs fans will enjoy another 1st round exit.

 

[seanlinden]

Habs would take a 1st or a prospect wuth that value.

Dermott or Holl: Habs wont take them... Habs want to make room for the number of contract....
I dont think the prospects you name would do it the Habs GM.

So no 1st, no Chiarot for Toronto... Toronto is not the only one Habs can take an offer.

The best offer will win Chiarot, so i dont think what you offer from Toronto would win Chiarot

Just because the Habs would like a 1st or equivalent prospect; doesn't mean they're going to get one. We just saw what Manson, a superior defenceman, got, and there was no first included.

The only defencemen yielding firsts leading up to the deadline are Lindholm and Chychrun.

 

[Mike Dukarm]

Just because the Habs would like a 1st or equivalent prospect; doesn't mean they're going to get one. We just saw what Manson, a superior defenceman, got, and there was no first included.

The only defencemen yielding firsts leading up to the deadline are Lindholm and Chychrun.

I really think the Chiarot is superior of Manson for a playoff run... Manson got 2nd (value)...

So i really think he will get a better return

 

[Empoleon8771]

Why does Allen have more value now than when the Habs got him for dirt cheap?

Chiarot can bring back the value of a 1st, but I'd be shocked for Allen to bring back anything more than a 2nd. Allen is a backup on any actual contender, and any contender would be on crack to pay a huge price for a backup.

Packaging the two together might get you Mrazek, a 1st and a 2nd, but that's really about it. And honestly I still wouldn't do that if I'm the Leafs.

 

[Mike Dukarm]

Just because the Habs would like a 1st or equivalent prospect; doesn't mean they're going to get one. We just saw what Manson, a superior defenceman, got, and there was no first included.

The only defencemen yielding firsts leading up to the deadline are Lindholm and Chychrun.

And for Chychrun-Lindholm... Prospect, young players will be the base of the trade PLUS a 1st

 

[seanlinden]

I really think the Chiarot is superior of Manson for a playoff run... Manson got 2nd (value)...

So i really think he will get a better return

There are very few teams who want to play the game like Montreal did last year; collapsing on everything. Manson is a much more versatile fit for a good team.

And for Chychrun-Kindholm... Prospect, young players will be the base of the trade PLUS a 1st

Of course, Chychrun & Lindholm are both likely to yield multiple assets, including a first round pick. In the case of Chychrun with a good contract, certainly multiple high quality pieces.

Chiarot, being a massive step below those guys, and far less desirable, will likely yield a 2nd + unremarkable prospect.

The Habs really don't have any movable pieces capable of garnering a first round pick at the deadline. Excluding super-young players, I think you're pretty well limited to Gallagher and Anderson... and both of those deals are pretty tough to make at the deadline because of their large cap hits.

 

[Maplebeasts]

Lol there’s no way. That’s a good start on a trade for chychrun. Not Ben chiarot and jake Allen (who I think is decent)

Even then I'm not giving that up for Chychrun until he starts looking like half the player he was last season.

 

[Mike Dukarm]

There are very few teams who want to play the game like Montreal did last year; collapsing on everything. Manson is a much more versatile fit for a good team.



Of course, Chychrun & Lindholm are both likely to yield multiple assets, including a first round pick. In the case of Chychrun with a good contract, certainly multiple high quality pieces.

Chiarot, being a massive step below those guys, and far less desirable, will likely yield a 2nd + unremarkable prospect.

Again i think Chiarot is a very good D for the playoff.... and the league have seen him last year and they will pay...

Last 4 years Manson is not the same D that he was.

We will see the value for Chiarot in the next 7 days...

 

[pth2]

I'm not seeing the point of Allen rumors. He's been injured, hasn't played recently, and the deadline is a week away. If he were playing (well) every second game, he might be a decent plan B for the Leafs, but now, it makes no sense.

Chiarot would be a great fit, though. But I expect whoever gets him will be angry at the price paid - big defensive D aren't sexy, but they get a team through the playoffs. GMs know this and will try to get them.

 

[Goldenhands]

Manson returned a second and solid prospect. Chiarot for Knies and 2nd is even trade

Since Chairot is easily the better player, expect a 1st + Knies.

 

[colchar]

Aside from Fleury who don't want to play for the Leafs

You asked him and he told you that did he?

 

[colchar]

Some folks have no clue about Allen. We got him to get a strong backup for Price and the guy has been nothing less than great for us, especially the stretch where Price was out. He has played like a legit starter, very consistent and reliable, rarely allow bad goal, pretty square, stable and confident. Im not trying to bullshit anyone, Allen is a better option than MAF or Varlamov.

I wouldnt trade him for less than a 1st

 

[Scintillating10]

Since Chairot is easily the better player, expect a 1st + Knies.

Only way we get that is Allen included

 

[Scintillating10]

Manson is a lot more desirable than Chiarot, and Knies likely valued higher than Helleson.

What is this some kind of joke?

 

[Holymakinaw]

What would the Leafs need to trade?

I would say Knies, Lillgren, First round pick and cap dump not sure who

No thanks!

 

[BlueBaron]

Let's not trade with the Habs....

 

[Habs Halifax]

You've confirmed yourself stat watching too though, considering if you watched the games you would know that Muzzin wasn't playing that well compared to his old self, and the goalies have been divebombing since 2022 started.

in fact, stat watchers are the ones who bring up Holl & Muzzin being a strong pair bringing out their analytics, when they were horrible the last few months to ACTUALLY watch on ice

Obviously Muzzin is a net positive to the D, but to corollate Muzzin with the Leafs winning games just proves you are what you're complaining about other people with Chiarot and Allen

I look at many things including stats, eye test, and ice time/usage. Did you ever consider usage and how Muzzin gets 63% of his starts in the D zone and his coach leans on him heavy? I recall this same approach put on Danault from Habs fans and other fans when he was getting 60-80% of D zone starts. BS comments like "lacks offense" and is only a 3C. Danault getting closer to 50/50 zone starts with the Kings and look at his stats. Go figure eh. It's also the same BS posters are saying about Chiarot too.

Did you see the look on Muzzin's teammates when he went down? This was concern for his health only right? No concern that they are missing a D zone min eater and they can easily live without him right?

You should watch the player more. Like be very obsessive when they make a mistake and say... "See I told you he sucks". Comical stuff. If you think Muzzin is not a very valuable piece for the Leafs, you are part of the problem, not the solution. Go get more skilled/skater/soft types like Sandin and Dermott. That will work out fine

Habs players quote last playoffs: With Muzzin out for game 7, we have even more confidence we can knock the Leafs out.

 

[Lshap]

Allen isn't what the Leafs need. He'd be a great add over a long season for a team trying to make the playoffs, but Toronto's probably a playoff lock and Allen won't them further than their existing tandem.

Chiarot's a different story. He will help some team's playoff run, the only question is which team and at what price. If the Leafs don't offer a 1st, some other team probably will. Is he worth it in isolation? Maybe not. But for a playoff run for a team going all-in... he is.

 

[Habs Halifax]

No, they really won't... because they won't have to.

If the Leafs want Chiarot, it'll be their 2nd round pick, plus some other, lesser asset. Maybe it's a prospect excluding Knies/Niemla/Robertson; maybe it's Travis Dermott or Justin Holl... obviously at that point you're getting into splitting hairs, and MTLs pro scouting will be the determinant of who they like.

Who knows what Chiarot returns. But if it's a 2nd and a smaller add, the Leafs are not getting Chiarot cause many other teams would offer that.

Not sure if we get the 1st rounder. I've always been around the two 2nd's price tag and over the last month ish, I added a grade B or B+ type on top of those two 2nd's. Doubt we get a 1st rounder but the return should be solid.

Who was your last best deadline player who provided value? Pleky? Leafs fans can hate the Habs but we really do have two players that can help you a lot. Allen and Chiarot. You can disagree with us all day long and try to get other players if you wish but we are not trying to give you trash players. Both of these guys can help you with your team needs.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Allen isn't what the Leafs need. He'd be a great add over a long season for a team trying to make the playoffs, but Toronto's probably a playoff lock and Allen won't them further than their existing tandem.

Chiarot's a different story. He will help some team's playoff run, the only question is which team and at what price. If the Leafs don't offer a 1st, some other team probably will. Is he worth it in isolation? Maybe not. But for a playoff run for a team going all-in... he is.

We will probably never know but if Allen was traded to the Leafs, he is a substantial upgrade over Mrazek and I bet you he steels the starter job from Campbell. Regardless, Allen with Campbell is basically what Dubas was thinking when he signed Mrazek. Allen has a better track record and he proved his worth for the Habs down the stretch last year to make the playoffs. Without Allen, Habs don't make the playoffs and he did face a lot of high danger shots with his time with the Habs.

In terms of finding a real impact starter? I would agree with you but besides Fleury who don't want to go to Toronto, who's that guy? I don't see it. And are the Leafs not going to do anything and ride with Campbell/Mrazek?

The other area you overlook is Dubas's ability to escape that Mrazek contract. That should not be thrown under the rug... it's a massive problem for Dubas cause he is chewing up a lot of cap space he needs and with Campbell struggling and injured, they need someone better than Mrazek for this playoffs and someone on a better contract for next season's cap too!

So I repeat, if not Fleury and if not Allen, who?

 

[The90]

Who knows what Chiarot returns. But if it's a 2nd and a smaller add, the Leafs are not getting Chiarot cause many other teams would offer that.

Not sure if we get the 1st rounder. I've always been around the two 2nd's price tag and over the last month ish, I added a grade B or B+ type on top of those two 2nd's. Doubt we get a 1st rounder but the return should be solid.

Who was your last best deadline player who provided value? Pleky? Leafs fans can hate the Habs but we really do have two players that can help you a lot. Allen and Chiarot. You can disagree with us all day long and try to get other players if you wish but we are not trying to give you trash players. Both of these guys can help you with your team needs.

Manson in a more desirable RD position and a extremely comparable player, just cost Colorado a decent prospect and a second round pick. HH here thinks a player that plays the position with more availability on the left side will somehow command a first and a good prospect. Makes sense.

 

[Lshap]

We will probably never know but if Allen was traded to the Leafs, he is a substantial upgrade over Mrazek and I bet you he steels the starter job from Campbell. Regardless, Allen with Campbell is basically what Dubas was thinking when he signed Mrazek. Allen has a better track record and he proved his worth for the Habs down the stretch last year to make the playoffs. Without Allen, Habs don't make the playoffs and he did face a lot of high danger shots with his time with the Habs.

In terms of finding a real impact starter? I would agree with you but besides Fleury who don't want to go to Toronto, who's that guy? I don't see it. And are the Leafs not going to do anything and ride with Campbell/Mrazek?

The other area you overlook is Dubas's ability to escape that Mrazek contract. That should not be thrown under the rug... it's a massive problem for Dubas cause he is chewing up a lot of cap space he needs and with Campbell struggling and injured, they need someone better than Mrazek for this playoffs and someone on a better contract for next season's cap too!

So I repeat, if not Fleury and if not Allen, who?

I'm sure the Leafs would like having Allen as an option, but at the cost of a 1st? He'd have to be a clear upgrade, and right now he'd be Plan-B should Campbell not return and Mrazek fail.

 

[A1LeafNation]

Cant believe people are crapping on Chiarot and Allen... Chiarot shut down AM and Marner all playoffs last year and Allen is for sure more stable than Campbell and Mrazek.

Allen is more stable? How many games has he played in 2022, how are his numbers in 2022?

 

[Just a Fan]

perfect. solve your goalie and dmen problems elsewhere. leafs are the last team habs will and should be helping in any way shape or form

I love posts like this, you think your GM cares where the best offer comes from?

Also, Allen solved nobody’s goalie problems.