Speculation: Caps Roster General Discussion (Coaching/FAs/Cap/Lines etc) - 2022-23 Season Part 3: Drop the puck!

[tycoonheart]

Come on you never left the train, you just hid among the livestock!

You're right. I never did. I don't think he is a good enough coach. He seems to have these one good stretches per season and then his teams go back to looking subpar. They'll make the playoffs but I don't think have much hope for this team in the playoffs unless Lavi shows me more by then.

 

[Ridley Simon]

As dismayed as I was to see the practice lines — I’m gonna hold my outrage for the game.

That’s just me

You're right. I never did. I don't think he is a good enough coach. He seems to have these one good stretches per season and his teams go back to looking subpar. They'll make the playoffs but I don't think have much hope for this team in the playoffs unless Lavi shows me more by then.

Sounds like our feelings on Trotz. Circa 2017

 

[AlexModvechkin8]

They're trying things out since they're now 3pts out of 2nd in the division and 5pts clear in the wild card.

If they lose the ground they've gained and threaten to fall out of a playoff spot look for the lines to revert to something closer to what we had in December.

They’ve played four games more than the Pens who are four points behind them. They’ve also played four more games than Detroit and Buffalo who are nine and ten points behind them. I know you have to win the games in hand for them to matter but it’s not like their buffer is that big. And I don’t know about you but I’d rather play the Devils in R1 as M3 then the Canes or Bruins as one of the WC teams.

 

[CapitalsCupReality]

you absolutely can, what happened to "produce and play"?

Doing it for a return game made some sense, it's a moment. Continuing to do it when they haven't exactly hit the ground running is goofy. Backstrom should be the NHL poster child for load management right now anyway with his procedure, personally not even sure I'd play him every game right now let alone basically just chucking him where he used to be.

like... you don't think Strome has earned a little more than Kuznetsov at the moment? Why is a past contract at all a consideration when the guy isn't playing at his value anyway? Yes, you obviously want your best paid players playing best... but sometimes they just don't and you don't need to shoot yourself in the collective foot trying to get them in gear.

Shit, especially when Ovechkin and Kuznetsov just don't work anymore anyway.

You have to give them (19&43) a chance to show. I mean you know this. No reason to panic after a loss.

I was just criticizing Kuzy yesterday. Strome like the other regulars has earned a guaranteed spot somewhere.…just like the other regulars…..subject to shuffling I guess.

So….. now the game against the *Flyers* of all teams, is turning into a must win?

Good Lord.

Always calm cool and collected around here.

 

[AlexModvechkin8]

You're right. I never did. I don't think he is a good enough coach. He seems to have these one good stretches per season and then his teams go back to looking subpar. They'll make the playoffs but I don't think have much hope for this team in the playoffs unless Lavi shows me more by then.

I don’t think you can question Lavi’s ability to coach. He’s only the fourth coach in history to coach three separate teams to the Stanley Cup Final. He has the most wins of any American-born coach and he’s one of only 10 coaches in history to rack up 700 wins behind the bench. He’s a Stanley Cup winner, a first ballot HoFer, and clearly can coach the shit out of some hockey and get guys to play his system, which works.

What you can question is his personnel decisions throughout the course of a season and the way he develops young players but saying he’s not a good enough coach… if he’s not then there are maybe two or three guys in the NHL right now with a better resume. Maybe.

 

[g00n]

They’ve played four games more than the Pens who are four points behind them. They’ve also played four more games than Detroit and Buffalo who are nine and ten points behind them. I know you have to win the games in hand for them to matter but it’s not like their buffer is that big. And I don’t know about you but I’d rather play the Devils in R1 as M3 then the Canes or Bruins as one of the WC teams.

They're not worried about the Pens, imo. They're looking at NYI who are 5pts back with only 1 game in hand, and the closest team to knocking them out of the WC spot.

Like I said if that margin with NYI and others you mentioned like DET and BUF shrinks, maybe the experimentation to handle the returning player integration gets a little less funky.

I don't think they're looking at playoff matchups specifically...not seriously. They're just trying to get everyone up to speed for a playoff push and making sure they have "next man up" locked and loaded.

IMO

 

[tycoonheart]

As dismayed as I was to see the practice lines — I’m gonna hold my outrage for the game.

That’s just me


Sounds like our feelings on Trotz. Circa 2017

Barry had the team lose to the eventual cup champions twice in the 2nd round. Some would say we outplayed them in 2017. Lavi has been out coached in the playoffs every damn year he's been with us.

 

[CapitalsCupReality]

You're right. I never did. I don't think he is a good enough coach. He seems to have these one good stretches per season and then his teams go back to looking subpar. They'll make the playoffs but I don't think have much hope for this team in the playoffs unless Lavi shows me more by then.

They’re a puncher’s chance roster (for the playoffs)…..not sure any coach changes that.

 

[Ridley Simon]

Barry had the team lose to the eventual cup champions twice in the 2nd round. Some would say we outplayed them in 2017. Lavi has been out coached in the playoffs every damn year he's been with us.

No. That’s simply inaccurate.

Barry had Presidents Trophy teams in 15-16 and 16-17. And they lost. Caps fans were none too happy with him as a coach. No one was.

Then 17-18 started and the team was struggling before getting into a regular season groove. But ppl wanted him fired. Lots of ppl.

Then Spring 2018 happened.

Also — Lavi coached great against Florida last year. The goalies let him down. Hard. Let’s not forget what actually happened.

 

[g00n]

Trotz was also criticized for not adjusting in-game, or line matching.

 

[StrikingDistance]

Interesting strategy by Lavi: De-value Strome so we can sign him for cheap next year.

The only thing missing from the practice lines is 1st line Eller.

 

[tycoonheart]

I don’t think you can question Lavi’s ability to coach. He’s only the fourth coach in history to coach three separate teams to the Stanley Cup Final. He has the most wins of any American-born coach and he’s one of only 10 coaches in history to rack up 700 wins behind the bench. He’s a Stanley Cup winner, a first ballot HoFer, and clearly can coach the shit out of some hockey and get guys to play his system, which works.

What you can question is his personnel decisions throughout the course of a season and the way he develops young players but saying he’s not a good enough coach… if he’s not then there are maybe two or three guys in the NHL right now with a better resume. Maybe.

I don't know what it is then but for one reason or another I don't think his coaching style has clicked with this roster. Maybe it's a mismatch? He has struggled to get the team into the playoffs. And he has certainly struggled in the playoffs itself.

 

[Jags]

I don’t think you can question Lavi’s ability to coach. He’s only the fourth coach in history to coach three separate teams to the Stanley Cup Final. He has the most wins of any American-born coach and he’s one of only 10 coaches in history to rack up 700 wins behind the bench. He’s a Stanley Cup winner, a first ballot HoFer, and clearly can coach the shit out of some hockey and get guys to play his system, which works.

What you can question is his personnel decisions throughout the course of a season and the way he develops young players but saying he’s not a good enough coach… if he’s not then there are maybe two or three guys in the NHL right now with a better resume. Maybe.

I agree with you on Laviolette, but your post kinda reads like this:

I don't think you can question Gordon Ramsey's ability as a chef. He's won a zillion awards, several Michelin stars, and owned a bunch of successful restaurants.

What you can question is his ability to cook food and have it served to people.



Personnel decisions and player development are pretty huge aspects of his job to be dodgy at. We've seen a bunch of old school coaches struggle lately. Has the modern game begun to pass them by? Has the attitude and sense of entitlement of the more recent generations and society in general started to make a "100% accountability" system and approach less effective? Is he getting more crotchety and apt to discipline these days or with this particular group of players?

Or is everything pretty much fine and we're just kinda bitchy and reactionary?

In fairness, the truth is probably some combination of all of that, with a heftier dose of that last one than we'd like to admit.

 

[tycoonheart]

They’re a puncher’s chance roster (for the playoffs)…..not sure any coach changes that.

Why just a punchers chance? We upgraded goalies, we have a center who looks like he is a good 1C with Ovi, Ovi is doing his Ovi things. Nicky might not be as hobbled.

Shouldn't we expect more?

 

[HTFN]

You have to give them (19&43) a chance to show. I mean you know this. No reason to panic after a loss.

I was just criticizing Kuzy yesterday. Strome like the other regulars has earned a guaranteed spot somewhere.…just like the other regulars…..subject to shuffling I guess.


Always calm cool and collected around here.

They can do that with practice reps and pretty limited game minutes, ideally on the same line to let the rest of the team stay gelling. The problem with giving them their “owed” minutes is that other players probably deserve them right now.

Kuznetsov, I mean, I’m glad you also agree I guess but I don’t give this Ovechkin-Kuznetsov thing a pass, we should be well past this by now from the coaching staff until it’s clear Kuznetsov has blood in his veins again.

 

[YippieKaey]

New lines for next game:

Kuemper-Irwin-Forsythe
TvR-Hathaway-Gritty
Joe B- Craig L-Alexa
Strome-Ovi-My old sock

Kuzy-Lindgren
Alan May-Sid the Kid
Bäckström-Kolzig

Sheary in net.

 

[bacchist]

Why just a punchers chance? We upgraded goalies, we have a center who looks like he is a good 1C with Ovi, Ovi is doing his Ovi things. Nicky might not be as hobbled.

Shouldn't we expect more?

They literally looked like a lottery team at the end of November. I'm tempering my expectations.

 

[CapitalsCupReality]

Why just a punchers chance? We upgraded goalies, we have a center who looks like he is a good 1C with Ovi, Ovi is doing his Ovi things. Nicky might not be as hobbled.

Shouldn't we expect more?

Because the core is old man….guys in important positions too hot and cold…it is what it is. We should not expect more IMO with this roster. Maybe win a round or 2…..would love to be wrong of course.

 

[Hivemind]

I hope this recent stretch is enough to prove to even Lavi's most ardent supporters that his roster decisions have very little relationship with how well a player is playing. This isn't a new development, but its beyond the pale now.


I love Lavi as an Xs and Os coach. His systems are pretty solid fit for the current direction of the NHL, and he was one of the coaches to help push the NHL in this direction in the first place with his success in Philadelphia and Nashville. But many of his other areas as a coach seem to be inconsistent and/or outdated. We've covered his handling of young forwards ad naseum, so I won't dig into that. But his ability to handle a locker room has always been fragile (there's a reason so many teams regress after his first couple years), and this also isn't his first stop where fans have accused him of favoritism and dog-houses when it comes to his roster and line-up decisions.

 

[ovikovy817]

The only thing I'm ok with it's Back and Willy on the same line.
Put them together and give them 3rd line minutes.

 

[g00n]

I hope this recent stretch is enough to prove to even Lavi's most ardent supporters that his roster decisions have very little relationship with how well a player is playing. This isn't a new development, but its beyond the pale now.


I love Lavi as an Xs and Os coach. His systems are pretty solid fit for the current direction of the NHL, and he was one of the coaches to help push the NHL in this direction in the first place with his success in Philadelphia and Nashville. But many of his other areas as a coach seem to be inconsistent and/or outdated. We've covered his handling of young forwards ad naseum, so I won't dig into that. But his ability to handle a locker room has always been fragile (there's a reason so many teams regress after his first couple years), and this also isn't his first stop where fans have accused him of favoritism and dog-houses when it comes to his roster and line-up decisions.

Such a dishonest post.

I guess you missed the injuries and roster changes, eh? And Mantha admitting he wasn't doing what he was supposed to do?

You have no idea what's going on in the locker room and it sure doesn't appear to prove you right about anything.

 

[pman25]

Such a dishonest post.

I guess you missed the injuries and roster changes, eh? And Mantha admitting he wasn't doing what he was supposed to do?

You have no idea what's going on in the locker room and it sure doesn't appear to prove you right about anything.

But any player will say that if they’re benched. Like if Lavi decided Kuznetsov or Milano was the one underperforming and benched them, they would say exactly the same. It obviously forces a player to reevaluate their play

 

[g00n]

But any player will say that if they’re benched. Like if Lavi decided Kuznetsov or Milano was the one underperforming and benched them, they would say exactly the same. It obviously forces a player to reevaluate their play

This speculation is not evidence that Mantha is being wrongfully benched and it's only one potential angle in the "see this proves I was right about Lavi" nonsense. Not to mention Mantha's comments which were very specific wrt why he was being benched.

All people talked about since the trade was how much he sucked. Now that he's scratched, the hatred for Lavi overpowers the hatred for Mantha.

JFC this board is fickle.

 

[AlexModvechkin8]

This speculation is not evidence that Mantha is being wrongfully benched and it's only one potential angle in the "see this proves I was right about Lavi" nonsense. Not to mention Mantha's comments which were very specific wrt why he was being benched.

All people talked about since the trade was how much he sucked. Now that he's scratched, the hatred for Lavi overpowers the hatred for Mantha.

JFC this board is fickle.

Lavi has his favorites, let’s not pretend he doesn’t. I’m a supporter of his but his standards for some are different than with others. He clearly values guys with a certain profile. We’ve seen him be harsher on guys like Vrana, McMike, Sprong, and Mantha than he is on the Ellers and Hagelins. He doesn’t have as much patience for mistakes made by guys that play a certain style.

There’s no defensible reason for having promoted Eller to 2LW and now demoting Strome to 4LW. There’s no analytical or objective measure to merit either of those moves.

And yes, Mantha is being wrongfully benched. Even with the questions around his consistency of effort he’s still one of their best two way forwards and he’s certainly more valuable to the team than some guys whose lineup spots seem to be etched in stone. I don’t see how anyone could argue that Lavi doesn’t play favorites.

 

[bacchist]

Strome is obviously being demoted to the 4th line because Ovie hasn't been scoring as much since he was moved to the 2nd line.